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Scandal as raptor killers beat justice

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Published Date: 27 December 2008
URGENT action is needed to fight the "national disgrace" that has led to hundreds of birds of prey being killed, RSPB Scotland has warned.
The charity is calling for greater efforts and more funds to fight the crime that plagues Scotland's countryside and for the judiciary to get tougher when cases come to court. It also wants landowners for the first time to be held responsible for wha
t happens on their estates, rather than only gamekeepers being punished if they break the law.

The call comes as The Scotsman today reveals that there have been only 26 convictions for crimes against birds of prey in the past ten years.

And during that time not a single prison sentence has been handed out for the killing of the country's most treasured birds.

Duncan Orr-Ewing, the head of species and land management at RSPB Scotland, said: "It's hard to get convictions, and we have known that from bitter experience over the years. It's a blight on landowners' reputations and it's a blight on Scotland's reputation as well."

Figures obtained by The Scotsman show there were at least 428 crimes against birds of prey between 1998 and 2007. However, a mere 28 cases ended up in court, with just 26 resulting in guilty verdicts.

Of those, the majority resulted in no penalty, a community service order, or a fine of less than £500 – even when there were multiple charges.

This is despite the maximum possible sentence for crimes against birds of prey being a fine of £5,000 or six months in prison for each offence.

The Scotsman has been given details of every crime against bird of prey in Scotland over the past ten years.

The 428 confirmed incidents of bird-of-prey crimes have been described as the "tip of the iceberg".

Those incidents included 271 poisonings, all of which were confirmed by post-mortem examinations carried out by the Scottish Agricultural Science Agency.

AMONG those killed were 52 red kites, 14 golden eagles, three sea eagles and 187 buzzards.

In addition, there were 157 other crimes against birds of prey, such as shootings, the setting of illegal traps and destroying nests.

The average penalty for the charge of killing, taking or injuring a bird of prey – a crime once described as Scotland's "national disgrace" by the late former first minister, Donald Dewar – was £995 and for possessing an illegal pesticide was £112. The highest possible fine is £5,000.

Nobody has been prosecuted for any of the 37 confirmed crimes against birds of prey in 2007.

The statistics have led RSPB Scotland to call for more effort to be put into investigating and prosecuting crimes against birds of prey.

Mr Orr-Ewing believes there are not enough specialist police officers dedicated to wildlife crime and a lack of consistency in the penalties meted out by the courts.

He criticised the fact that a prison sentence had never been handed out for killing a bird of prey, even though it has been used for less damaging offences, such as collecting birds' eggs.

He said: "It really is difficult to get these cases through the court system. It's a function of inadequate resources being diverted to the whole system.

"The use of custodial sentences in the most serious cases would hand out a strong message and would be a considerable deterrent.

"There are many cases where we thought this could have been used. We are not saying it would be regularly used, but that in exceptional cases, where crimes are serious and very damaging to conservation, that the courts should use them."

Mr Orr-Ewing thinks another strong deterrent would be for wildlife crimes to become the responsibility of landowners – a legal position known as vicarious liability.

Currently, if a gamekeeper is found with illegal poison, he is prosecuted. Under a system of vicarious liability the landowner would instead be responsible.

Mr Orr-Ewing equated it to publicans being responsible if a staff member served alcohol to an under-age customer, and to managers of companies being liable if a staff member is injured.

He believes that, if the responsibility was passed to the landowners, it would free gamekeepers to speak out, which they are reluctant to do.

"We think there are people out there on the ground that want to do the right thing but, because of their employment conditions, they can't do that," Mr Orr-Ewing said.

However, it is an idea that has previously met with strong opposition from landowners.

THE RSPB has launched a new campaign calling for gamekeepers to phone a confidential hotline number with information about the persecution of birds of prey.

"It's not all landowners involved, but the actions of this minority, this hard core, that undermine the work of others," he said.

"It's time for the good people in the industry to stand up and get this stopped."

Mr Orr-Ewing believes the number of crimes against birds of prey recorded each year is just the tip of the iceberg.

"Given that most of these crimes take place in remote areas and are on private land, it's easier to conceal them than to find them," he said.

He estimates that, on some estates, hundreds, if not thousands, of birds of prey could be killed every year.

He said: "That might be a more extreme example, but even if people were killing hundreds a year, that would be very damaging."

The Scottish Government's "Natural Justice" report last spring set out 25 recommendations for improving action against wildlife crime.

These including establishing a full-time wildlife crime officer in every police force.

However, no deadline was set for the recommendations to be put into action, and most have not yet happened.

Michael Russell, the environment minister, said he was determined to stamp out wildlife crime.

"Wildlife crime continues to be a problem in Scotland, and the RSPB is quite right to be showing concern at the disparity between the number of crimes and the number of successful convictions," Mr Russell said. He added that he wanted to see the Natural Justice report become a "means to catching and punishing the cowardly perpetrators of these awful acts".

He said Scottish Natural Heritage would be making £220,000 available over three years to the Partnership for Action Against Wildlife Crime.

"It doesn't matter if it's bird poisoning, hare coursing, badger baiting or any other deliberate action which causes harm to an animal," Mr Russell said.

"A crime against Scotland's natural heritage is a crime against Scotland itself, and this government is determined to stamp it out."

The life and slow death of a monarch of the skies

ONE spring, a pair of sea eagles on Mull began incubating their eggs.

By April, one egg had hatched. The chick fledged in July. In September he flew over Salen Bay.

In November he was independent. The following April, he left Mull. By May, he was dead, aged one year and one month. He'd been poisoned. This isn't a tale from 1888 but 2008.

This is the story of a young eagle, White G…

He had an uncertain start in life. While still in the egg, his parents were spooked by something and left the nest unattended for two hours. We wondered if the egg would hatch.

Luck must have been shining down on him that day. The air was mild. It was dry. The early spring sunshine was warm. He carried on living inside his shell. He was a survivor.

Everything returned to normal and on the appointed day, 38 days from laying, he fought to break out of the egg.

Soon we could hear him calling whenever he spotted one of the adults returning with food. By four weeks old, his first feathers were coming through, he was sitting up on his own and just a week later he was beginning to try to feed himself.

Another two weeks on and we came face to face for the first time. It was ringing and wing tagging time. He was lowered to the ground and I lifted him carefully out of the bag. I remember him as one of the feisty ones.

Soon enough, the measurements, ringing and tagging were complete: white wing tags were the colour for 2007 and his letter was 'G'. White G was official.

And so safely back into his nest, a gift of mackerel left for him and away we went to leave them in peace once more.

For the next month, he grew into a fine, strong young sea eagle. Rich dark chocolate feathers, bright yellow feet, dark beak and eyes.

By three months old, he was ready to take his maiden flight.

By October, he was on his own for most of the time.

At the end of March this year, he was filmed by John and Janis Allen from the Ross of Mull. He was trying to pinch a fish from an otter in Loch Don. It's something sea eagles are well known for. It doesn't always work and it didn't on this occasion but the fact that White G had already learned to do this proved that his prospects for survival were good.

But that was the last time anyone saw him alive. What happened next we can never know for sure.

Like all young sea eagles, he had the wanderlust and began a long journey to the mainland and cross country eventually finding good, suitable habitat in the Angus glens. It was there that his luck ran out. One Sunday night in early May, the phone rang. White G had been found dead in woodland. A few days later a police and RSPB search of the area found over 30 poisoned baits positioned on the tops of fence posts to target birds of prey while on the ground was a dead mountain hare. It had been cut open and it too laced with a cocktail of illegal poisons. Maybe this is what White G had fed on.

The lethal ingredients in his contorted body in the brambles and bracken matched those on the baits.

And so the police investigation got underway and continues today. Many here on the island, across Scotland and the UK are horrified that we are still killing our birds of prey in 2008. Responsible landowners and gamekeepers, of which there are many, will feel as sickened as we all do. It is only a few who still resort to these lazy, indiscriminate tactics to protect their game but the actions of these few will tarnish the image of many.

White G struggled down the hill. I pray his end was swift but experience tells us that this is not always the case with the pesticides involved here.

Over ten years ago, Donald Dewar called the poisoning of raptors in Scotland "a national disgrace". It still is.

Shooting magazine refuses to carry RSPB ad

THE country's leading game shooting magazine has refused to publish an advert calling for readers to turn in the culprits of crimes against birds of prey.

RSPB offered to pay Shooting Times more than £2,000 for two adverts with the slogan "A bad apple can spoil everything".

The advert, which had a picture of a rotten apple, encouraged gamekeepers to phone a confidential hotline to report wildlife crime.

However, Shooting Times said it could be offensive to their readers. Its deputy editor, Alastair Balmain, said: "We refused to allow this advertisement to be carried on the grounds that the copy implied that readers of Shooting Times are likely to have friends and associates taking part in criminal activity. Our readers would obviously find this offensive."

He added that Shooting Times condemns the illegal killing of protected birds, and has done so in print many times.

"A large proportion of the readership of our magazine is made up of gamekeepers,'' he said. "The RSPB's advertisement was for a 'gamekeeper hotline' as a means to report criminal activity (notably regarding persecution of birds of prey).

"Our stated position is that the proper channels to go through in the case of wildlife crime are the police or Crimestoppers."

A spokesman for RSPB Scotland said he thought it was "regrettable" that Shooting Times had taken that stance.

Shooting Times describes itself as the official magazine of the British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC). Colin Sheddon, director of BASC in Scotland, said this was a "historic" link. "It doesn't mean that we have got any editorial or any other control over shooting times," he said.

He added that he recognised bird of prey persecution was a problem in Scotland.

"Unlike some others, we are not in denial over the involvement of game keepers and other in wildlife crime," he said.

• The RSPB's confidential hotline number is 0845 4663636.

A decade of killing takes its toll on birds of prey in Scotland

THE 26 convictions for killings of birds of prey over the past ten years (the dates refer to the final court hearing, not the date of the offence):

30 October, 1998: Gamekeeper convicted of poisoning birds of prey and illegal possession of poisons after police found the illegal pesticide carbofuran and a dead peregrine in a vehicle: fined £700 for four charges.

14 March, 2000: Falconer convicted of using a tethered pigeon in an attempt to trap a peregrine: fined £2,900 for six charges.

25 May, 2001: Gamekeeper convicted of shooting a hen harrier, after a film of the crime was found: fined £2,000 for one charge.

21 November, 2001: Gamekeeper convicted of using poison baits and killing a buzzard, after poisons were found in suspect's shed: fined £3,400 for five charges.

19 September, 2002: Pigeon racer convicted of shooting a peregrine. Fined £400 for one charge.

9 July, 2003: Individual convicted of illegal possession of poison and firearms offence, after poison found at premises: fined £350 for two charges.

12 November, 2003: Gamekeeper convicted of illegal possession of poison, possession of an unlawful trap and possession of a buzzard egg, after poison found on suspect's property: fined £250 for three charges.

4 December, 2003: Pigeon racer found guilty of illegal possession of poison: guilty on one charge and admonished.

24 March, 2004: Gamekeeper found guilty of removal of a peregrine chick from nest and firearms offences, after a film of the suspect removing the chick was found: guilty on two charges and fined £600.

13 April, 2004: Gamekeeper convicted of shooting a buzzard after being seen shooting the bird and burying the corpse: guilty on two charges and given absolute discharge.

25 August, 2004: Gamekeeper convicted of killing 22 buzzards and a goshawk and possession of illegal poison after poisoned baits and buzzards were found: guilty on five charges and fined £6,000.

15 December, 2004: Gamekeeper convicted of possession and insecure storage of pesticides after poisoned buzzards and illegal pesticides found on suspect's property: guilty on two charges and fined £1,200.

11 January, 2005: Individual convicted of firearms offences in follow-up investigation after a poisoned buzzard was found: guilty on two charges and admonished.

28 January, 2005: Gamekeeper convicted of possession and use of an illegal hawk trap, after trap was found with live pigeon decoys: guilty on two charges and fined £1,500. Conviction overturned on appeal.

10 June, 2005: Gamekeeper convicted of possession of illegal snares, illegal chemicals and insecure ammunition in follow-up investigation after a poisoned buzzard was found: guilty on four charges and fined £190.

1 August, 2005: Gamekeeper convicted of shooting a short-eared owl, after crime was seen by a witness: guilty on one charge and fined £500.

17 February, 2006: Gamekeeper convicted of attempting to kill a hen harrier after being filmed attempting to shoot the bird: guilty on one charge and fined £500.

8 May, 2006: Gamekeeper convicted of shooting two buzzards after suspect witnessed shooting: guilty on one charge and fined £2,000.

14 May, 2006: Gamekeeper convicted of possession of illegal pesticides in follow-up investigation after a poisoned buzzard was found: guilty on one charge and fined £100.

14 May, 2006: Gamekeeper convicted of possession of illegal pesticides and setting poison baits: guilty on two charges and fined £100.

29 June, 2006: Gamekeeper convicted of taking and possession of common gull eggs, poisoning ravens, possession of illegal pesticides and firearms offences, after dead raven and poison baits found: guilty on three charges and fined £850.

26 July, 2006: Farmer convicted of possession of illegal pesticide and firearms offences after carbofuran was found in suspect's gun cabinet: guilty on two charges and fined £100.

16 November, 2006: Gamekeeper convicted of setting poison baits, possession of illegal pesticides and killing a buzzard, after poisoned buzzard and dead badgers found: guilty on five charges and then sentenced to 100 hours community service.

24 January, 2007: Gamekeeper convicted of poisoning four buzzards, use of poison baits, possession of illegal pesticides and electronic crow call decoys after poisoned buzzards found: guilty on two charges and fined £100.

30 April, 2007: Gamekeeper convicted of possession of illegal pesticides and firearms offences in follow-up investigation after a poisoned buzzard was found: guilty on four charges and fined £1,000.

4 June, 2007: Gamekeeper convicted of killing ravens, use of illegal traps and poison baits, possession of illegal pesticides and firearms offences after snares and pesticides found on suspect's premises: guilty on eight charges and sentenced to 220 hours' community service.

• The Scotsman is committed to helping the Scottish Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals catch those responsible for killing birds of prey and other wildlife.

Information about raptor poisonings and other incidents of wildlife crime can be passed to police via the National Wildlife Crime Unit in North Berwick on 01620 893607.



The full article contains 2972 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 26 December 2008 8:41 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Birds of prey
 
1

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 00:58:27
As the report "correctly states", a scandal
2

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 02:50:35
Reporting... well, this atricle gets straight to the heart of the issue.

Gamekeepers punished....

I had to rock in my chair for a few minutes when I read that. Think it out. The "pluses and minuses"

Have to say, I'm "undecided" on that particular issue
3

stonepark,

ayrshire 27/12/2008 04:25:00
Looks like the police are prosecuting when there is evidence. If there is no evidence then how can they prosecute anyone? Saying a certain person or landowner did it because dead bird was found on their property (or even worse disappeared on their property) has no basis in law.

Prosecuting the Landowner would only work if he had knowledge of gamekeepers activities. If you speed while in company car, you get ticket, not company, if landowners (employers) were able to be prosecuted for employees transgressions of the law then no business would employ anyone, plus you can't prosecute employer for something an employee does in their own time.

Typical RSPB/Scotsman Story biased and not truthful with the facts. RSPB quotes of 'tip of the iceberg' are just statistical calculations and also include birds where they 'just dissappeared' or had 'unknown death'

Funny how the RSPB fails to mention all those extra birds of prey out there due to shootings conservation activities. deer or Pheasants for food for buzzards, eagles, kites(whether road kill or killed by bird of prey), grouse for hen harriers, pigeons and small birds and mammals which feed on game food/crops for peregrines sparrowhawks, kestrals etc .

Whether RSPB like it or not, shooting results in higher prey densities and therefore higher predator (bird of prey) densities than can be sustained at a natural level because more food is provided and competetion (crows, magpies, foxes etc) is eliminated. If all shooting of game and vermin was to stop tomorrow, bird of prey numbers would probably treble within 3-4 years (on average) but then the populations would crash to less than what we have now as prey numbers crashed, leaving us with less. (see Langholm Moor as a scientific example - Hen Harriers)

RSpB needs to get off its high horse and come up with workable, practical solutions which will result in maximum numbers of raptors with some way of relocating/controling problem birds or populations.

BTW
4

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 04:53:52
Everyone needs a "good wee burd"

5

KampungHighlander,

Jakarta 27/12/2008 05:55:37
I think that what is needed is a serious discussion about Land Reform, Scotland is one of the only places left on earth where you have such a feudal system of land holding.

It is fine for people to have nice big country homes and working farms, but having all the wild areas of the country in the hands of a "few Lords" is a mistake.

They should be incorporated into National Parks for the benefit of all the people of Scotland, not held as private playgrounds for the rich.

Crofters should also be given legal title to their crofts, its time to break up these ridicules estates.
6

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 06:08:55
Here we go again.... the Crofters... are they a band.

It's an old argument that was lost with the bones.


The "today issues" are the relevant ones.

Smart school uniforms. No chewing gum before lunch (that one needs to be stamped out), no ties when the Queen's speech is on.

It never used to be like this...
7

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 06:08:56
Here we go again.... the Crofters... are they a band.

It's an old argument that was lost with the bones.


The "today issues" are the relevant ones.

Smart school uniforms. No chewing gum before lunch (that one needs to be stamped out), no ties when the Queen's speech is on.

It never used to be like this...
8

T M,

LA, USA 27/12/2008 06:31:18
Would someone please explain to me why the Scotsman almost never allows comments on stories about violent crime in Scotland? What is their motivation?
9

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 07:00:05
#8

I see, the old "why can't we talk about violent crime and Eddie Murphy movies"

No slack on here with your "American ways".


This paper covers the "big stories", pal.

Dying birds, wee women who found thier cat after 17 hours of searching and she was worried stiff.

10

,

27/12/2008 08:28:16
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
11

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 08:31:28
RTF

He is an American rambler.

Off to watch his "basket ball game"

Today is where the legends of the future walk on to that fine turf.

No bouce the ball 10 times and its OK...

Liquid football.......
12

gus1940,

Edinburgh 27/12/2008 08:39:15
It is ridiculous and illogical that the penalty for egg collecting is greater than that for actually killing mature birds.

The mortality rate for the birds that would have hatched from stolen eggs would be high whereas mature birds which have survived the high infant bird mortality rate can go on and produce clutches of eggs year after year provided that they aren't poisoned or shot at the behest of greedy landowners.

Any gamekeeper found guilty of killing raptors should be jailed and banned from gamekeeping for life. His landowning employer should be jailed, banned from keeping or using any firearm and should have his land confiscated.
13

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 08:41:43
#12

You are daft or funny.

I'll let you off on both accounts....

Which reminds me,,, The Celtic accounts... must be overdue...Are they hiding something?
14

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 09:00:24
#14

As they say, one in the hand is worth two of something.

I wonder who is playing in goal for Celtic today.

Couldn't be that fat Polish guy who slobbers over the ball even before he sees Broadfoot putting in an inch perfcet cross.

Nah, they wouldnae play him.... must have another keeper lined up....all that spending that WGS talks about
15

,

27/12/2008 09:01:59
Comment Removed By Administrator
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16

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 09:05:09
RTF

Times of old, games won and lost.

It's all about today.

11 men (for a while) on both sides. Football will win, and if it doesnae there are a few other things that can be done
17

,

27/12/2008 09:26:41
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18

Steve Ev,

Malta 27/12/2008 09:30:59
Just see how many escape justice here in Malta, and carry on with their disgraceful acts against birds of prey. The cancer of this island!!
19

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 09:38:57
RTF

Vouchers? The True Blue don't need any of that.

Leave that to the carpet fitters.

Our boys will play fair, and win the day
20

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 09:41:30
#19

A bird thread...sorry, off the main frame for a moment.

Sparrow....and the wee red robin.

Taking the top off the milk before you have time to open your Cocco Crisps
21

,

27/12/2008 09:52:46
Comment Removed By Administrator
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22

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 10:05:24
RTF

There's me losing it again.

Crofters? Not my specialist subject, but here go

The crofters should have bigger houses, pay no tax, and have their Sunday Post delivered on time.

But , that's just my view
23

Pilrig,

Livingston 27/12/2008 10:09:26
3 "sideline the rspb" etc.
24

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 10:10:55
Just checking the "Nine in Row Clock with trophy handles" there. Only two hours, two red bulls and whatever else is around, before the kick off
25

Pilrig,

Livingston 27/12/2008 10:12:27
20 - you mean your bhoys ? Anyway a p*x on both sides of the infirm
26

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 10:16:35
Garlic chips.

That's what you get here.


You're dying for a big bag of greasy chips with brown sauce, and a pickled onion topping.

What do they have...garlic chips.

I like chips, and garlic....but no on the same chip
27

Black Five,

edinburgh 27/12/2008 10:28:56
Shocking story.These gamekeepers are nothing else than murderers and I`d hang the them if it was up to me.In the face of you cannot do that it`s about time we as a nation said enough is enough and sorted the perpetraters out once and for all.
28

Black Five,

edinburgh 27/12/2008 10:31:39
Also trust the Glasgow neddies to appear somewhere.They should realise out of their sordid little worlds no one could care less about them.They both deserve each other.
29

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 10:42:23
Let's only hope Celtic don't go for the draw.

Prefer it (as a neutral) if they throw caution to the wind
30

AntiPCman,

27/12/2008 11:03:03
I have some sympathy with 3-Stonepark. RSPB are very unsuccessful at safeguarding any specific bird on their extensive lands eg, capercaillie, hen harrier or corncrake. This is primarily because they do not understand that a degree of predator control is required.

There are too many buzzards and far too many magpies and crows. I have been in agriculture all my life and would defend the need for effective biodiversity across Scotland but one cannot subvert the natural course of nature.

If capercaillie are going to die out then so be it. To try and say it is because of deer fences around plantations is a nonsense. The grouse family have all been declining in numbers for a variety of reasons - climate, less sheep, more tic, less moor management - so articificially protecting the caper with knee jerk polictical solutions is a non starter and the RSPB encourages it with no success on its lands.

The gamekeeper convicted on 29th June 2006 was for 30 years a keeper on a large North East estate and locals will tell you that he was getting away with it for years but they said nothing. He was caught redhanded with a plethora of wrongdoing and it was hoped he would have the book thrown at him. He got away with an £850 fine when it should have been a custodial sentence. The newish owner of the estate living in Surrey got away with it and did nothing!

Many etate owners are excellent but the bad press they get makes them sensitive and less forthcoming. Good management needs good predator management but the estates are made to feel like criminals when they are not and should, instead, be encouraged to manage the countryside for us all especially when it is being done at their own expense.
31

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 11:07:24
#31

I know a bit about birds. I think that the smaller ones get less attention.
32

,

27/12/2008 11:11:36
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33

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 11:15:14
RTF

We're no going down the Norwegian route....

But, for the bird lovers...there are more blue ones than any other colour. Is it a trick of nature, or did God plan it that way
34

KampungHighlander,

Jakarta 27/12/2008 11:40:24
Rufus and ICSFM

I realize you are both a little bit thick, having been held back in primary school.

But the Football threads are in the Sports Section. You can join all the Old Firm sectarian football idiots on that thread.

Or did they chase you off because you don't know anything about football? Just a mastery of nonsense?
35

,

27/12/2008 11:45:56
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36

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 11:52:09
#35

Was reading in the Times today that the Crofters Pension Fund lost millions in dodgy pyramind schemes.

The CPF should be the ones you're asking the question to
37

,

27/12/2008 11:55:49
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
38

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 12:01:51
RTF

CCOTGTBBS was never a "peoples organisation".


They might have had a few cocktail parties and "more than you can eat sandwiches but they're too small to pick up unless you got one of they big tweezers that you cannae find in shops but you always get one for Christmas".

Nah, I don't think they are really doing their job
39

KampungHighlander,

Jakarta 27/12/2008 12:02:14
My original post was about Land Management which is the central issue about why people feel the need to kill birds of prey.

Which is much more relevant to this topic than which of the 2 sectarian weegie football teams in going to win.


40

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 12:06:16
#41

LM? you should have said so
41

,

27/12/2008 12:08:57
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42

,

27/12/2008 12:10:12
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Reason:
43

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 12:12:12
RTF

I thought it was Easter Sunday.

OK. Focused now. LM it is
44

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 12:12:34
ES..
45

Houssine,

Nanterre 27/12/2008 12:19:58
The story of the eagle Bird,

In old times ,in Brittany, live a King whit his three children, this king have a garden whit tree and one of them produce gold aple. The King call for his children, my children each night they are one gold apple stealed by an thief. The first of his children have proposed himself to take gard the next night, but when the night coming he sleep. Tomorow again one gold apple was stealed and the King was alarming, then the second childr have proposed himself but he sleep again and the young have proposed himself to his father the King. In the night the young boy was in the garden whit arms and in midnight he see the sky becoming dark and a great creature come to the tree of apples and he take one gold apple but the young boy shot the big bird and the big eagles lost blood and he fly whitout the apple of gold. The next day the King was unhappy he counted the apples of gold and agin one was taked. But the young children tell his father how he have shouting the big bird who was responsible of the stael and how the apples gold was in the garden. Than the King was happy whit his young children and all take the decisions to follow the trace of the blood losted by the big bird.In finaly the young children have discovred the Kastel of the eagle bird under the earth and he have killed the bad thief who are in reality a bad sorcer and in the same time he have freed three very beautifull princess and each one of the children take one as wiffe and all was happy.
Translated from the breton language by my self.They are many stories like this in britany litterature and more of theme was not translated to english .The story was more complexe but i have resumed it because my english was very bad. In the story in reality the young children was under the earth and after he hase liberated the princess eash one give him one of his shoes and then the young boy who are under the eart ask his brother to send him a rope and the first princess go up from the unde
46

Houssine,

Nanterre 27/12/2008 12:22:12
My first comments was not complet in finally i have writted about my blog www.arabs-nations.blogspot.com where is political articles about arabs and islamic world as Irak, India...
47

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 12:26:00
It's Captain Ferguson time
48

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 12:27:01
Cannae believe it, Mizuno is playing....Welcome to the big stadium
49

gus1940,

Edinburgh 27/12/2008 12:39:26
Scotland will never be a mature nation worthy of international until the poison that is Rangers and Celtic football clubs and their bigoted supporters is eliminated.

Ban both clubs and bulldoze their stadia and if any attempt is made to transfer the bigotry to other clubs do the same to them.

It is a terrible reflection of our dumbed down society and our education system that for so many sad cretins think that 22 overpaid yobs kicking a ball around is the most important thing in their lives.

Mind you, watching TV and reading the press those in control seem to believe that, with the daily dose of Old Firm inconsequential drivel to which we are subjected. It would appear that it is a hanging offence in TV if every news bulletin 365 days a year has to have about 5 or more minutes of Old Firm rubbish to keep the idiots from changing channel.

I feel much better from having got that off my chest.
50

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 12:42:13
#51

Just saying that because you follow a wee diddy team.

This is football
51

Not a taxi lover.,

27/12/2008 12:59:25
The keepers poison the birds of prey because they eat the food that they put out for them. (sorry that was meant to say pheasants and grouse that they breed) The landowners know what their employees are doing because they provide the wherewithall for them to do it. They want their estates to have lots of birds for rich Italians (cos they like to shoot) to pay lots of money to shoot. No birds = no rich shooters willing to pay £400 to £500 each per day to shoot. They seem to think it's their right to "keep the balance" that they that they disturbed by introducing lots of foreign species of birds. It's simple economics really. If there's not lots of birds the keepers won't have a job.
52

I can see for miles,

27/12/2008 13:35:47
Tight OF game, but justice will see us right.
53

,

27/12/2008 15:50:14
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
54

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 27/12/2008 15:56:41
Is this the best the Hootsmon can do for front page news? Next time I see a squashed seagull on the road I'll expect another front page splash.

Yawn.
55

Geomac 1,

Scotland 27/12/2008 16:30:23
The RSPB simply have too much money and influence - as if this was one of the most important issues facing the country at the moment.
We have violent crime increasing, child neglect increasing, more pensioners than ever in poverty, teachers being subject to ever increasing violence in classrooms (from children AND parents), a massively increasing dole queue, more and more homelessness - I could go on but you get the message. And all the RSPB does is cause a stushie about a POSSIBLE increase in the killing of raptors and ALL Jenny Haworth goes on about are global warming, climate change, windmills and birds. Come on Scotsman, why don't you address the real issues facing Scotland.
56

Geomac 1,

Scotland 27/12/2008 17:34:37
I've just noticed the following havers from Mr Orr Ewing - he of the RSPB

Mr Orr-Ewing believes the number of crimes against birds of prey recorded each year is just the tip of the iceberg.
"Given that most of these crimes take place in remote areas and are on private land, it's easier to conceal them than to find them," he said.

He estimates that, on some estates, hundreds, if not thousands, of birds of prey could be killed every year.

He said: "That might be a more extreme example, .....

Ahem Mr E - your ridiculous postulation does not constitute an "eaxmple" - this exageration is so typical of the RSPB
In the acronym RSPB, I assume that the B stands for "birds" and not for "raptors" - so it's Ok for raptors to kill pigeons and small birds - oh yes, that's "nature". Is it also "nature" for raptors to be introduced in huge numbers by the RSPB and its buddies??
57

,

27/12/2008 17:57:04
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
58

,

27/12/2008 19:09:26
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
59

dido-bendigo,

Scotland 27/12/2008 19:56:03
Mr Orr-Ewing should now turn on the Windfarm developers and demand that they be punished accordingly for killing raptors, waders, bats and all the other avian creatures that might be construed to be vunerable to disturbance or destruction by wind-farms. He should demand a change in the law that states that such casualties are "the result of a legal operation" and therefore of no consequence, despite being dead! Incidentally, I wonder in the story, if it was a 'Bird protector' who caused the parents to leave the nest and almost cause the chilling of the said egg?
60

Poetess50,

27/12/2008 19:59:18
I hate birds!
61

dido-bendigo,

Scotland 27/12/2008 20:10:56
The black grouse in this part of Argyll are almost extinct. The shooting of them was stopped many years ago, when the forestry people bought up the hills and planted sitca spruce all over them. Since then, the black, and the red grouse, numbers have plunged downwards. Now it is mainly crows, buzzards, hen-harriers, sparrowhawks, foxes and pine martens that dominate the forestry, unplanted hilltops and upland farms. The laugh is, the RSPB, SNH and friends (asking for donations) want to rescue the black grouse and introduce beavers which have never lived locally in the first place! Or, at least, no one has ever produced evidence that they were here.
62

dido-bendigo,

Scotland 27/12/2008 20:32:13
Look up www.songbird-survival.org.uk for the truth about the benefits some raptors bring. I wonder if the RSPB would like to put a £2000 ad in their magazine?
63

T M,

LA, USA 27/12/2008 20:39:16
# 60

All your posts seem to be lame attempts at humour.
Maybe you should sober up. Might help focus the mind.

I am simply curious as to why this so called Newspaper never lets it's readers comment on the random violence that is very prevalent in Scotland. They obviously have some vested interest in down playing the violence there. Maybe their alignment with a certain government party that is very lenient on crime?? I have witnessed random drink-fueled violence there myself and am truely amazed by it....
64

dtd,

Edinburgh 27/12/2008 22:16:07
Murder Rates.
Los Angeles; 10 per 100,000 (2007)
Edinburgh; 2 per 100,000 (2007)
Sources;
LA - Los Angeles Times ,story did not permit comments.
Edinburgh - Evening News ,Comments permitted for this story.
I know which country has the bigger problem with random violence fuelled by drink, drugs or whatever. Do You ?
65

Phil1,

Edinburgh 27/12/2008 22:58:26
I am not sure - the police do not come round to clear yobs off the streets or drunks drinking on the streets and in doorways and urinating all round the old town in Edinburgh and the RSPB wants them to hide out in the highlands to seize gamekeepers or farmers!

OK RSPB why are 'gamekeepers or farmers' killing birds of prey? Tell us - I mean its not for fun is it? There must be a reason - what reason could anyone have for killing a bird of prey.

Someone will have to help me out here? I just cannot think why anyone would want to stop birds of prey from mutiplying from hundreds into thousands.

I would think the RSPB would pay all the gamekeepers and farmers who lose livestock to these birds of prey wouldn't they. Afterall its their livelihood that is being eaten by the birds of prey - but perhaps the RSPB don't care about the livelihood of the farmers or the gamekeepers and that is probably the reason the birds of prey are being preyed on by the biggest predator - humans.
66

Mallard,

Borders 27/12/2008 23:40:25
Instead of wasting tax-payers money dealing with "wildlife crime" let's have the specialist officers back to Tullialan for refresher training before putting them back in the community catching real criminals.
67

T M,

LA, USA 28/12/2008 03:30:34
#66

You will find that 9 out of 10 of those murders in Los Angeles are Gang/drug related and do not effect the average citizen, but what you do not see in Los Angeles and is much more common in Edinburgh and Glasgow are people out drinking at night in what would be considered good areas of town that just start trouble/fights for no real reason. Random drink fueled violence. You would think the Scots would be able to hold their alcohol as they surely get plenty of practice but that doesn't seem to be the case...

The Scotsman allows readers comments on almost all stories except for those related to violence in Scotland but you are to busy getting defensive to venture a guess as to why they seem to have this policy...
68

Embaba,

falkirk 28/12/2008 11:33:59
Geomac 1,

You obviously feel that the the numbers of birds being killed is being exagerated.
Let me remind you of a search at Barns Estate Peebles in 2004, when 25 poisoned birds of prey were recovered during a search. Buzzards, tawny owls and goshawks.This was just one day andshows just how much damage can be done.

There are people who seek to deny the extent of this problem, most usually citing that 'balance'is required. This 'balance' translates as their BANK BALANCE.

Killing birds of prey has been a normal part of land management in Scotland for hundreds of years, bounties being paid for the feet and beaks of birds of prey.

This primative practice is nothing new. Scotland should hang its head in shame.
69

Angus,

Alexandria 28/12/2008 11:34:32
What a bunch of hypocrites the RSPB are!

They make great play about raptors being killed but encourage shooting by having shooting tenants on their reserves.

If the want to stop the killing of raptors they should be railing against the game bird shooting industry rather than being part of it

The RSPB is little more than the Royal Society for the Protection of some Birds and complicit in the killing of others.

70

Pilrig,

Livingston 28/12/2008 15:55:26
67 'sideline the rspb' #94
71

Pilrig,

Livingston 28/12/2008 15:57:30
Some people won't be happy till the countryside birdlife consists of solely pheasants and grouse
72

Strix,

NYHAMNSLÄGE 28/12/2008 20:40:08
The scandal occurs when animal rights activists being abel to use birds of pray and other raptors as
murder weapons on citizen making a living in the rural part of the country and on top of it supporting
the pleasent life that these activists experience. Stop these pathetic figures.
73

Robert Jones,

Stoke 29/12/2008 00:36:28
Well done Scotsman for a well written article.

Thank you for higlighting the disgusting practice of BOP persecution.


 

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