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Trams U-turn will shut Princes Street for most of next year

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Published Date: 08 December 2008
By BRIAN FERGUSON
A FULL closure of Princes Street to make way for Edinburgh's tram works is to get the green light, despite the city centre being brought to a standstill by a previous attempt to reroute traffic from the thoroughfare.
Council officials are recommending pressing ahead with a shutdown for virtually all of next year in a bid to ensure work to lay tram tracks is completed as quickly as possible.

They are also refusing to ditch a controversial extension to the tram
network to serve most of the capital's waterfront, despite a massive funding black hole.

The council's stance on Princes Street is yet another U-turn over the trams scheme, and one to which many city centre retailers are opposed.

Mounting delays, blamed on the botched start to works at The Mound in October, mean the council is likely to have to suspend works on Princes Street for the summer festivals, then restart again in the autumn.

The move – believed to be crucial to ensure the trams are up and running as planned in July 2011 – will trigger major concerns about the impact a full closure will have on retailers struggling to cope with the economic downturn.

Full details of the works are expected to be revealed this week. However, it emerged yesterday that business groups backed the idea of a full closure in the hope it would limit the length of time the city centre suffers major disruption.

Transport officials believe traffic can be successfully rerouted on to Queen Street to relieve pressure on George Street, which was brought to a standstill during the last, hastily scrapped closure.

One source said: "We never actually said the Princes Street closure wouldn't be going ahead. There was obviously a major review of what happened over The Mound.

"But it's simply untenable to try to do the work on Princes Street in phases. It could lead to a delay of six months in completing the whole project."

A spokesman for Edinburgh Chamber of Commerce said: "There's no doubt a full closure of Princes Street will cause major disruption, but getting the work done quicker is preferable."

Jane Wood, head of Essential Edinburgh, the firm responsible for revitalising the city centre, said: "An awful lot is going to depend on how the council communicates these measures to businesses."

The council is also expected to confirm it is pressing ahead with plans for a tram loop linking Roseburn with Edinburgh's waterfront area, in the hope that MSPs will agree to extra funds being released.

The Scottish Government is to be asked to sanction giving the council a share of future business rates expected to be generated by the huge regeneration of Granton, Newhaven and Leith.





The full article contains 463 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

 
1

Continental,

08/12/2008 00:23:25
Every time I am in Edinburgh all I ever see are the workers either standing about chatting, texting on the their phones or sitting in their vans/trucks/diggers. No wonder the job is taking a long time. When do they work?
2

One-man-bucket's older twin,

08/12/2008 01:36:43
Perhaps the council is hoping that all the other people who now won't be able to get to work will leap off their stationary buses and into the roadworks and grab a shovel, drill or digger, and take over from the workman paid to do the job.
3

Hmm ...,

08/12/2008 01:40:11
... still no decision to face up to reality by scrapping the entire project, then?

This stump of a tramway will never make ends meet - so Edinburgh council tax payers will have to subsidise it with cash that could have been used where it is really needed, instead of propping up Labour's vanity fantasy.
4

Navvy,

08/12/2008 03:33:22
given a free run at Princes Street the contractors should be able to do the job in 3 months. They should be working a 13 shift fortnight
5

Rajneesh Bhagwash,

London 08/12/2008 04:50:45
The whole sceme is utter nonsense. Tramcars cannot swerve round obstacles, and cannot be diverted from their fixed path. Years ago a tram often used to get stuck behind broken down buses and lorries, often for hours, and on one case days. Bicycles and shoes get stuck in the rails, and the council was constantly being sued for damages, due to broken ankles, crashed bicycles and even deaths etc.
6

Rajneesh Bhagwash,

London 08/12/2008 04:51:26
The entire nineteenth century fantasy was dreamt up by the outgoing Edinburgh Labour Councillors, when they knew they couldn't hold on, and would lose the last elections.
So Just before they made themselves redundant, with a big cash payola, they signed off all these ludicrous contracts, so as to hamstring the incoming SNP / LibDem administration with massive debts.
7

Rajneesh Bhagwash,

London 08/12/2008 04:53:56
On 18th Nov, in the Scotsman Edinburgh section, some residents made their true feelings about the sceme known to the "slow motion workers".....
http://is.gd/aEch
Those ex-councillors should be made individually financially liable for this whole disgrace, and force them to work on the road crews for no wages.
8

Mercutio,

FALKIRK 08/12/2008 05:28:22
Trams U-turn?
9

calum,

08/12/2008 05:59:03
And still the madness goes on. The country is in recession, jobs are going, investment is lost or shelved (for a decade accoring to some experts), Scotland needs transport improvements north of the Forth/Clyde and yet this madness goes on. Why does,'t the First Minister explain to Scotland why? What are the economic benefits now for Scotland? What is the safety case? Instead of trying to play statesman why doesn't he deal with matters at home like this?
10

A True Scot.,

08/12/2008 06:29:50
9

This whole project lies at the door of the 3 main opposition parties who forced it through Parliament. The SNP were the only major party to object to it.
But you knew that already didnt you?
11

Aileen,

08/12/2008 06:58:12
Everyone but the Council has been against this idea. Traffic being diverted to George Street and Queen Street didn't work last time, what makes them think it will this time? What happens if there is a power outtage? Or a car breaks down, or a fender bender, or anything that reader 5 has mentioned? Would love to see what happens when a women's high heel gets stuck in the rails.
12

Mr. Borat Sagdiyev,

Kuzcek, Kazakhstan 08/12/2008 07:29:46
#10

A partial truth, indeed this hairbrained scheme was rammed in place by the idiotic main parties, however the Snips still had the power to refuse, but they didn't. Ho-hum.
13

GraemeH,

Edinburgh 08/12/2008 07:36:44
The business plan for this farce never had any full raod closures, with no more than seven sets of works across the whole route. TIE has LIED persistently about the costs of this project, about its so called benefits and the disruption required to build it in order to preserve their own jobs.

To press ahead with the extension is compounding the economic madness. The extension has an even worse financial case than the main line which itself is dependent on massive development, none of which is happening.

To continue with this farce is to saddle the council taxpayers of Edinburgh and Lothian Bus users with a £10m+ pa annual subsidy and risk the ongoing viability of the entire Lothian Buses company. Its all in the business plan (Revenue and Risks section).

Time to put all works on hold and commence an independent review of this project before wasting more money.
14

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 08/12/2008 08:19:59
Why does the Cooncil hate Edinburgh so much?
15

roadstohell,

08/12/2008 08:52:49
#14 it doesn't hate Embra, but it does know what's best for us, so it's really a kinda "hard love" :0(
16

drunken proffet,

Tassy 08/12/2008 08:55:13
It is difficult to persuade folk that trams are quite a sociable and economic way of transport. As are railways, and the odd bus. Between 1960 and 2060 it will be classed as the year of personal transport and go down as the biggest waste of energy for the next one thousand years. Get used to it, it is painless and will most likely be one of those things that the government of that time in the future can provide for free.
17

Padraig,

08/12/2008 08:57:33
Urban Guerrilla #8 said "Why does the Cooncil hate Edinburgh so much?"

It's because it is staffed by Trots, hired by the former Labour (Trot) councillors. The Trots believe that to build a "workers' paradise" they first have to destroy the community and economy then rebuild their new "vision" from the rubble.

They are at the "destroy" phase of their plan just now.
18

ddmc,

08/12/2008 09:03:57
#17 they are pursueing Begg's utopia of a carless city with wonderfull public transport, Begg f'd off a long time ago but his vision remains

#16 they maybe sociable, economic not sure they still need leccy to power them, but i think the main point is the cost, £500+ million for a hornby train set is OTT. The main reason the ex-labour council were so determined was to provide the beloved waterfront with a transport system, now that it's going to the dogs it's time to cut our losses & ditch the trams.
19

Leila,

Edinburgh 08/12/2008 09:23:03
WHY does the tram scheme have to be finished on time? I don't see why another 6 months or a year should make any difference. It's already been shown that completely closing Princes Street is impossible so why do these IDIOTS on the council persist in their stupidity?
20

Destroy the Planet,

08/12/2008 09:26:45
There goes the cycle paths
21

Major General Puffin-Stuff,

08/12/2008 09:30:23
#12

The SNP do not have an overall majority in Parliament, as you rightly say this hairbrained scheme was rammed in place by the idiotic "main" parties - all 3 of them, giving them an overall majority - your point is?
22

Alternative (High-Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 08/12/2008 09:32:31
The time has now come to put a lid on this whole sorry affair now.

Scrap this ridiculous project.
23

Yonthing!,

08/12/2008 09:34:45
Princes Street will NEVER open again to transport.

Edinburgh Council has always wanted to get all vehicles off Princes Street - first the cars, now the buses and taxis. Once the tracks are down they will leave the street closed, and when the trams start operating will there be transport again on Princes Street.

Shame there are only two stops for the whole length of it.
24

Yonthing!,

08/12/2008 09:36:26
Can someone do a Freedom of Information request - I had heard a rumour that the contract states the main contractors get paid even if the job gets cancelled. Anyone know if this is true ?
25

bluehead,

edinburgh 08/12/2008 09:46:38
perhaps we should shut down the city council,I'm sure that would be a vast improvement in it's self,goodness knows where they dug up this lot that are running the place ,it's like a madness has come over the city.I have never seen Edinburgh in such a dreadful mess
what did the Edinburgh citizens do to deserve this lot ??
26

AbroadScot,

France 08/12/2008 10:06:27
Those against the tram scheme should take a trip to Montpellier in southern France to see just how incredibly efficient a tram system can be. Maybe they would then get their heads out of the sand and agree that the long-term benefits will far outweigh the short-term hardships.
27

Leila,

Edinburgh 08/12/2008 10:22:33
26: Please spell it out - what specific long-term benefits? If a tram system can't be efficient then it shouldn't exist, surely? So merely praising a tram system for being efficient is meaningless. And logically it's impossible to agree in advance that the "long-term benefits will far outweigh the short-term hardships". At best you can only speculate optimistically.
28

Mr. Borat Sagdiyev,

Kuzcek, Kazakhstan 08/12/2008 10:23:23
Urban Guerilla asks "Why does the Council hate Edinburgh so much?".

The Council does not "hate" Edinburgh as such, rather like all Councils in the UK it is an overgrown Quango that serves only to sustain its own existance and further its own aims, a la circumlocution.

The tram scheme secures Council jobs, gives the transport department something to work on and provides an income and perks for the Council Quango. Also it makes the political parties involved in the Council Quango look good in the eyes of the minority-interest peer groups, e.g. Environmentalists, who seem to run this country nowadays.

AbroadScot suggests that the tram system in Montpellier is excellent. It probably is. There again, the streets of MontP are not crammed full of cars, buses, taxis, lorries etc. and the tram system was probably not put in place by an arrogant, wasteful and parasitic Quango. Also the tram system is of some use there, unlike Edinburgh.
29

Major General Puffin-Stuff,

08/12/2008 11:16:55
#12

Ho-hum!
30

Douglas,

Bathgate 08/12/2008 11:26:38
The potential is there. Just extend it out to Livingston Centre where the shoppers go.
31

Liz,

Edinburgh 08/12/2008 11:50:30
#26
Yes, many cities across Europe have fantastic trams and public transport systems I have travelled to and even lived in many of them.

The problem here is that his tram appears to be being built at the expense of everything else. It should have been the icing on the cake once everything else had been sorted. For example the South Suburban line could have been opened at (relatively) minimal cost - this actually would have reduced the need for cars as it would have been an entirely new route rather than a very expensive replacement of routes that are already well served by the buses.

There is also the arguement about reinstating some of the old railway lines that are currently used as cycle paths - now whilst I apreciate these cycle paths are very nice and also an asset, but how much more of an asset could they have been if they had been restored to carry trains/trams.

In my experience most of the congestion in/around Edinburgh revolves around the By-Pass, Forth Bridge and the West of the City, and the routes in from Mid Lothian, the tram is not really going to do much about any of these is it?
32

Papa? Nicole! Papa?,

08/12/2008 12:05:36
Hang the councillors from lampposts with piano wire.
Sack the planning department.
Sack the transport department.

Edinburgh gets this level of contempt from the council and their lackeys only because we let them.
33

Unimpressed one,

08/12/2008 12:21:55
#26, But we could also learn lessons from the French railways, probably the best in Europe.
34

Alternative (High-Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 08/12/2008 13:24:05
Some good points Liz.

Also to bear in mind... Many of the continental cities that have trams have always had trams from the year "dot" so the city has developed around them. Quite a few of the cities in question have large, wide boulevards rather then quite narrow streets with biuldings on either side, therefore there is much more room for the trams.

Finally, almost all of the continental cities in question have TRAMS---ie, they share the road space with other traffic. What is being planned for Edinburgh is a LIGHT RAILWAY system where the road space taken up by the rails is SOLEY for the use of the trains and ALL other traffic is excluded.

There is a HUGE difference between Edinburgh and the continental examples cited so frequently by the pro-tram crowd on these pages.
35

sonofhamish,

edinburgh 08/12/2008 13:55:36
Its amazing to see all the doom mongering and negativity about ANY kind of change from Scots. No wonder we are all apparently trying ourselves to death.

The trams provide a world class mass transit system to a city poorly in need of one and choked up by slow smelly noisy buses.

Roll on.
36

Leila,

Edinburgh 08/12/2008 14:12:37
#35: You're right when you say "poorly in need", which means there is very little (i.e. "poor") need for it. And I've never heard of anyone "trying" themself to death!
37

S.M.D.,

Edinburgh 08/12/2008 14:25:10
#26
You seem to be the only one here agreeing with this tram mess.....wonder why?....perhaps as you don't actually live here?.
It isn't just the sheer inconvenience to be able to get from a to b for years to come, it's the fact, that businesses are suffering[esp. during a very difficult economic time], taxes will rise as well as bus fares during a time , when people can least afford it, other area's in Scotland, who also need transport improvements are totally ignored, as well as other area's within Edinburgh ,who all have to endure cuts.....
Is all that really worth it, just because another city's tram works well?
It's a fancy show, which should NEVER have got off the ground.....the sooner it could get stopped, the better!

The amount of people, who are against it, .....why on earth does people power not win?
38

S.M.D.,

Edinburgh 08/12/2008 14:36:55
#35

I only can assume, that you are living and working on the proposed tram route.....

Time you get your head out of the clouds and live in the real world!
Most of us won't be anywhere near that tram route, still have to rely on the bus service, which is getting run down to the ground, just because of the trams, that hardly any one wants.

Clearly, all you've done is listened or spread the word of the tram propaganda ,which says's about all those wonderful things, that the tram's will bring.....
Have you ever thought of the reality?
These trams won't be able to stop as often as buses, therefore those with heavy bags shopping, will be further discouraged out of city center shopping.
Seating is very limited.....have you ever heard of all the complaints, when folk have to stand in buses?

Being against trams, hasn't got anything to do with being against change, it's just do to with common sense .
Trams are a waste of time and money!..Fact!
39

Mcsnagpile,

08/12/2008 14:50:18
Who exactly decided that we should have trams?? Name them,, Demand they publish a copy of the feasibility study and the basis for their final decision..
Democracy-- who are you kidding?
Demand they publish the up-to-date Critical Path with milestone costs in respect to time,, Demand they publish the liquid liability and other penalties.

Who is paying for this thing anyway?????
40

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 08/12/2008 16:11:11
35 well said. I cant believe the negativity on here. Best way out a recession ? infrastructure projects.. we have the start of one.
41

Leila,

Edinburgh 08/12/2008 16:31:43
#40: Can't believe the negativity? So you think it's a good idea to completely close Princes Street for a YEAR even though it was tried for one day in November and caused horrendous traffic problems which even our head-in-the-sand council couldn't ignore? You think it's a good idea to jeopardise the already fragile retail environment in Princes Street? You think tourists will be happy to visit a Princes Street full of noise and mess from tramworks? You presumably think that any problems will be solved by repeated assertions that it will all be worth it in the end, and the more of those silly "all shops open for business" signs there are, the more convincing they will be?
42

JabbaTheFifer,

Dunfermline 08/12/2008 16:34:14
All the talk of a tram "system" or tram "network" in other cities is a bit misleading.

Edinburgh's going to get ONE tram route, which will - at best - replace a perfectly adequate bus route.

If this was being run on a purely commercial basis, without the City Council's politicking, then this project would have been canned long ago. In fact, it would never have got the go ahead.

As posted by someone else above, it would have been a far better idea to start by reinstating the south suburban line.
43

Alternative (High-Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 08/12/2008 16:37:26
#40:

"Best way out a recession ? infrastructure projects..."

ONE way to HELP a recession you mean. The problem here is that during the course of this "infrastructure project" they are going to make life intollerable for a great many businesses and inevitably many of them will go under.

I can just see it now... "Oh look at our lovely new railway system! Pity that all the shops along it's route are boarded up and that no-one comes into the city to shop any more though..."
44

Padraig,

08/12/2008 17:43:40
#40 - "Best way out a recession ? infrastructure projects.. we have the start of one."

I kinda think that this theory applies to projects set up to provide employment (and income) to people that would otherwise be out of work, providing a much needed item of infrastructure (like the USA's Hoover Dam) instead of continuing a politically inspired vanity project that no one needs or wants at enormous expense incidental to the unemployment situation.

The UK's current "infrastructure" borrowing is intended not to regenerate the UK's economy.

It is intended only to fill the black hole of spending that Labour have developed. They need to raise massive amounts of borrowing, not for infrastructure benefits but to continue their profligate spending that can't be met within the existing borrowing rules set by Gordon Brown himself but insufficient for his plans.

They know that the next election will see Labour off for the foreseeable future so want to get in as much of their control-freakery plans as possible before they are sacked.
45

Goat Boy,

08/12/2008 19:29:50
I suspect that the tram is sponsored by a consortium of Glasgow and Livingston Retailers.

They're doing a good job - 'cause that's where I'll be shopping this year.
46

Old Town Resident,

edinburgh 08/12/2008 21:15:50
No 25 Yonthing, why don`t you do a FOI? Anyone can and here instantly and for all to see
http://www.whatdotheyknow.com/
47

Tim C,

Southern England 08/12/2008 23:16:12
Padraig 44, spot on as usual. I regularly visit a small town on the continent that is suffering from tram fever (metro madness). The main street has been ripped up for about a year, and it will be a long while yet. Businesses along one side of the street have been ruined, with no vehicle access; it is difficult for pedestrians to cross the road because they have to walk around the roadworks. And there is a good bus service to the city nearby, so it is just another vanity project to keep the nomenklatura wealthy. Cities need underground railways; plenty of space and weatherproof. Buses destroyed trams about 75 years ago; buses are more versatile.
48

itsmeisntit,

on an empty 33 bus 11/12/2008 09:29:08
It amazes me reading all comments from people, assuming most live in edinburgh - every time of speaking to others about the tram without fail all are negative and wonder why its being built.

why-the-f has this project got of the ground...altho i doubt we will see the end project in our lifetime .

The amount of close on empty lrt buses blocking Edinburgh streets and bus stops located at traffic islands holding up traffic behind , now the tram will run alongside the buses.. well along a fixed route as its so infexible .




 

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