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Hearts hit by cash-flow crisis as six still unpaid



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Published Date: 05 December 2008
THE extent of Hearts' cash-flow problems became clearer last night when it emerged that up to six leading players did not receive their delayed weekly wages on Monday.
Although a club statement four days ago asserted that the players "have been paid" and a Hearts spokesman blamed the delayed payment on "a blip," it has now become apparent that some of the leading earners did not receive their money. Those players, who include Bruno Aguiar and Christos Karipidis, were instead asked by Anatoly Korobchka, Hearts' sport director, to agree a deferred payment, and apparently agreed.

Yesterday, a spokesman for the club refused to add to Monday's statement. There was no attempt, however, to stick to the assertion that the financial difficulties were merely the result of some minor technical hitch.

The unpaid players are thought to have been assured that they would receive their delayed payments as soon as possible. The best-case scenario is that today they get paid for this week and for last, and that the rest of the playing staff receive their own weekly pay as usual.

Last week's delay was the second time this season that Hearts' players have not been paid on time. The first time it happened, in September, the club blamed "a glitch," and a spokeswoman for Ukio Bankas Investment Group (Ubig), Hearts' parent company, denied the suggestion that there was a cash-flow problem.

Instead, the implication was that the problem had been caused by human error.

Among those inclined to an optimistic outlook, it was suggested that the non-payment could have been caused by some of the technical difficulties which can crop up when money is transferred from one country to another.

It is now plain, however, that the roots of the problem lie with Ubig, the group in which the Kaunas-based businessman Vladimir Romanov has a controlling interest. Until recently, Hearts paid their employees through the current account they held with HBOS. Over the past few weeks that practice has stopped, and staff have been paid direct from Lithuania.

The former Hearts chairman George Foulkes, who had previously accepted that the non-payments might have been caused by nothing more than a hitch, agreed last night that the problem could be more complex than previously admitted. "If it is correct that the cause is a cash-flow problem, then we should be really worried," he said.


The full article contains 410 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 05 December 2008 3:08 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Heart of Midlothian FC
 
1

GOA-JAMBO,

India 05/12/2008 02:16:07
I find it hard to believe there is a `cash flow problem` given that Ukio Bankas have made a profit. Credit to the players involved for not making a bigger issue with the `Illegal Withholding of Wages`. Where is Cambell Ogilvie now with a Official Statement from the club. This is a major concern for all at Heart of Midlothian.

C`mon the Gorgie !!
2

Jon Bon Jovi,

05/12/2008 02:34:42

yet still there will be jambo's with their heads in the sand....

your club is in serious, serious trouble yet you all sit back hoping hearts will pull through, you should all be ashamed of yourselves!!!!


and no im not a hibby, an in firm, an arab or a sheep...
3

jamtart,

Beechboro Western Australia 05/12/2008 03:27:07
Your right Bon Jovi your not a hibby,an infirm,an arab or a sheep.








Your a trumpet.

TOGETHER

MON THE JT'S
4

Championees,

The Emerald City 05/12/2008 04:22:58


Just wondering what Media 1 in Cape town’s take is on this mess would be, after all he has stated on these threads on numerous occasions that Vlad's his man, Vlad has it right not to mention Vlad has the vision to take HOM all the way to the top of the SPL.

Just wondering, so come on out Media 1 let's be hearing ye, let's see if you can impersonate BE and put a positive spin on this sorry mess.
5

Forward not Back,

05/12/2008 04:58:10
The key question here is why the players agreed to the wage deferrals. If there was no assurance of getting paid, I certainly wouldn't have agreed to it and would have spoken to my agent about the breach of contract.
6

r1niceboy,

Yankeeland 05/12/2008 05:18:32
Given that the unpaid players are the top earners, I'd bet that HBOS has reduced the overdraft facility for non-EU owned businesses operating in Scotland. Bloomberg reports that UKIO profits were up 40% through the first eight months of the year. UBIG was consolidating and contracting their investments a year ago, so they'd actually have more cash lying liquid.

Romanov should ask his board for a fund to be established to pay the wages for the forseeable months ahead. The fees being charged by HBOS will be prohibitive. It's the devil or the deep blue, however, as moving a bunch of cash over here will be subject to heavy taxation and suffer exclusion from earning anything but a meager interest. That's also probably why they don't pay the players directly from Lithuania. I can't see a way around this, unless Hearts take their business to someone who will be more amenable. HBOS has their loans also, so that could be tricky without some kind of consolidation. There are banks wanting to lend, but HBOS is not one of them. Hearts have been stupid, but also unfortunate, and their penchant for secrecy hasn't helped them.

I think HBOS is in panic mode. I'd lay as much of the blame there. Sorry if this made your head hurt, but it's not nearly as simple an issue as somebody writing a cheque. When the Scotsman starts talking about "implications" you know they're reaching. I don't see things getting better, though.
7

Pilrig,

Livingston 05/12/2008 05:39:26
ST BERNARDS...THIRD LANARK....GRETNA....HMFC !!!
8

The Fat Jannie,

Edinburgh 05/12/2008 06:41:29
Weekly wages! It's 2008 and these guys are on WEEKLY WAGES? I wonder if they have to line up at the office to collect their pay in cash, in wee brown wage envelopes. I suppose the poor wee souls find it difficult to scrape by from week to week.
9

Robert Bonaly,

East Lothian 05/12/2008 07:00:26
I just knew it - Vlad again makes sure that when matters on the park move in a positive direction he ensures matters off it take away the shine - it was so inevitable it isn't funny !!! Did anyone see the STV report where they depicted the club as a pantomine - well you know what they are not far wrong and Vlad and his cohorts only have themselves to blame for us being depicted this way. I also object to the fact that this episode will only add to the long list of situations where we quite frankly are fed a line ( I could use stronger language, but will refrain from doing so) everyone, the press, the suppliers and most importantly the supporters are being treated like dirt. It is not good enough and I for one hope the whole thing can come to a head so the club that we love can move forward in the right direction. I have said it so many time sit is boring, but the likes of Vlad and his cohorts can never ever understand what HMFC means to the rest of us in our lives and the quicker we all understand and deal with that fact the better.
10

Robert Bonaly,

East Lothian 05/12/2008 07:05:04
#8 - I know it is ridiculous in this day and age this is how players are paid - the admin costs must be monumental, especially if it also includes cross-border bank payment charges - no wonder there is a cash flow problem. We should all go out to Riccarton on 26 December and give them their "Boxing Day"presents along with the Postie and the Milkman, as I presume given the archaic nature of the remuneration process, they will be expecting them as well - give me a break !!!!
11

Nell,

Yawn, Yawn, Yawn 05/12/2008 07:28:39
There is nothing in this article that has not been said at least three times before in the Scotsman.
Do they really have so little to write about?
12

c mains hibby,

edinburgh 05/12/2008 07:30:33
Hearts will romp 3rd place in the league then be hit by a points penalty for going into administration ha ha.
13

petegeneva,

geneva 05/12/2008 07:31:56
not a problem.
glitch blip human error.
Happens to all big companies.
Late payment of invoices.
All big companies do this.
Nothing to see here.
Move along now.
14

petegeneva,

geneva 05/12/2008 07:34:03
#13 do you understand that if Hearts do go into admin then all players become property of the SFA, and they would be sold on in order to pay creditors? So yes you might finish 3rd and yes you might qualify for Europe but in the above scenario who'd be in the team?
15

UrbanFox,

05/12/2008 07:37:03
Lets get one thing clear. A company can be "profitable" right up to the day it goes into administration due to running out of cash. "Profit" can be manipulated. Profit is vanity, cash is sanity. The Moronov has betrayed Hearts supporters again and again, never living up to his boasts.
16

Sarajevoiwasthere ,

Paris 05/12/2008 07:50:32
13, glad you admit hearts will romp 3rd place.
17

GeorgeCowieOrWalterKidd?,

05/12/2008 07:53:30
Hopefully they are moving to pay the players monthly instead of weekly, like the rest of the staff. Weekly payments seems a little odd, especially with money tight.
18

allanr,

perth 05/12/2008 08:02:39
ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha still the laughing stock of Edinburgh.
19

GeorgeCowieOrWalterKidd?,

05/12/2008 08:05:57
#20 I wonder if you or someone you know will be laughing as loudly when you lose your job, home or both over the next year?
20

Addie,

05/12/2008 08:06:53
Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha Ha, still higher up the league than Hubz!
21

Bigwull,

edinburgh 05/12/2008 08:12:29
Funny tho' but if I'd agreed to have my wages deferred, I wouldn't expect payment the next day, non story.After Saturday, go into admin, we'd still be in line for a european place even with the 10 point deduction.
20 you are from Perth,enjoy yer sister?
22

allanr,

perth 05/12/2008 08:13:16
#20. correction, i should have said the WORLD. HA HA HA HA HA HA HA
23

LionheartFodithman,

05/12/2008 08:31:03
#25 tt
Usual windbag of nonsensical drivel.
In the non-likely event that some players have to be sold then there is a transfer window open in a matter of weeks & judging by the web-site then Larry is on his way.

If we have to sell the high earning players then so be it,we still have enough in the locker to compete in the SPL and build for the future running the club normally.
24

Iggle Piggle's Paranoid Hibbie Friend,

In the Night Garden 05/12/2008 08:35:52
Come in Agent Romanov, job done. Bring Rodney with you.

Aye, UBIG can ride out the financial crisis much better than all the other investment banks in the world. They clearly have the answers to the global crisis. As stated above it is all the fault of HBOS. Aye, now Hertz are paid direct from Lithuania, clearly HBOS are to blame.

For those that say there is nothing new in the article, I refer you to the news that players have been asked to defer their pay.....as opposed to a technical glitch. Of course the technical glitch story earlier in the week was the full honest truth. The Hertz board wouldn't tell porkies now, would they?Even Fatty Foulkes is starting to smell the coffee.
25

TangerineDreamer,

OF Free Zone 05/12/2008 08:37:18
Why has all the talk about the new stand dried up...?

And if you think the players will accept monthly payments when they are not being paid weekly then you are dreaming.
26

Paul Spencer,

Glasgow 05/12/2008 08:38:44
#26 So they will sell players to sort their cash flow problems, which to state the obvious means that they major financial problems, and if they have to sell players to sort that, then ergo on the field performance suffers and then people stay away and then its a downward spiral. Hearts sound as if they has cashflow problems what worries me is that UBIG probably have their problems too and that means god help the Latvians
27

rosco.1875,

05/12/2008 08:42:16
And when are they getting paid their win bonuses for the last 5 games?

Deeper in the brown stuff for the yams I'm afraid, looks like this may come to a head soon...
28

the west end general,

05/12/2008 08:43:14
as I said yesterday I am getting seriously worried,however lets fill Tynie and the away stand at Motherwell for the next couple of games and show the players that we are right behind them.sing your hearts out like never before and lets GIFRUY

Jambo till I die
29

Montford's Jaicket,

Hanging Around 05/12/2008 08:47:02
There was a "technical glitch" last week - and the team won. There's a "problem" this week - let the players do their talking on the park. If they keep having "administrative malfunctions" and win every week I suspect that the fans will soon stop worrying. Provided the players do get paid, there isn't a problem here.
30

Iggle Piggle's Paranoid Hibbie Friend,

In the night garden 05/12/2008 08:49:11
#32

Well at least he acknowledges the problem and clearly loves the club. It might be a bit like the orchestra continuing to play while the Titanic sank, but there seems precious little else happening amongst the Hertz fans to protest.

Your Club is dying FFS!!! Stop believing and do something about it!!!
31

the west end general,

05/12/2008 08:51:07
as Secret Affair so aptly put it 'this is the time for action'
let's be having you !!!!
32

Iggle Piggle's Paranoid Hibbie Friend,

In the Night Garden 05/12/2008 08:52:51
Earth to #35, are you receiving???

Can't you see the problem is that the players aren't getting paid? What a nice cosy outlook. If we keep winning and the players get paid, averything is fine. Well that's reassuring.

If Hibs play like they did against Motherwell for the rest of the season, we will win the league and the cup. However they won't. Realism is a scary master.
33

Montford's Jaicket,

05/12/2008 08:53:44
#various - nothing wrong with weekly payments. I get paid weekly despite working in an office as a contractor. It suits those I work for - and my personal cash flow - to do so. If they are smart, or well-advised, these players will be doing the same as many in the IT, oil and other industries, namely working as one-man limited companies. Bobo Balde was on the mark when he said he was the CEO of Bobo Balde PLC. I suspect that a lot of highly paid players are working for clubs through legal arrangements which minimise their tax and NI. They aren't employees; they are contract staff with fewer employment rights. If they were employees then the transfer window scenario wouldn't be allowed to persist and UEFA would be in restraint of trade by failing to allow employees freedom of movement to another club whenever they wanted. As contract staff in the oil & IT industries know to their cost, when times are tight then contract people are first to go as they have only a one week notice period in many cases.

There is nothing illegal in what these guys are doing - it is, however, disliked by HM Government and Revenue/Excise as they want to bleed everybody for every penny that they can so seeing high earners not paying 40% tax and higher rates of NI gets right up their noses.
34

GeorgeCowieOrWalterKidd?,

05/12/2008 08:58:50
#29 What have Latvians got to do with the price of fish?
35

Rambo The Jambo,

4-0 at Hampden 05/12/2008 08:59:58
Amazing how simple minded Hobos like to use the word Administration. If only they could seek legal advice on what Admninstration acually means they would understand what fools they make of themselves.

Hey guys, Google the word Administration then work out how stupid you have all been.

Any way I think there could be a silver lining here. If Romanov can no longer support HMFC financially, he might be forced to sell off this part of his business empire. The club could be bought for a knockdown price and run properly, but then what would the Hobos do with their spare time between giros.
36

Rambo The Jambo,

4-0 at Hampden 05/12/2008 09:00:59
Here's a starter for 10:

1. Insolvency and bankruptcy
Administration and administrative receivership.

When a company or partnership gets into financial trouble an administrator or administrative receiver may be appointed.

2. Administration.

The role of an administrator is to get the company out of trouble and trading again if possible.
Administrators can be appointed to a company that is unable, or is likely to become unable, to pay its debts. They can be appointed by any of the following:

• the courts - on application from a creditor, directors or partners
• the holder of a qualifying floating charge over the assets of the business
• the company or its directors
An administrator's primary goal is to rescue the company as a going concern. If this isn't possible, the administrator will try to get a better result for the creditors than would be possible if the company was wound up.

If neither of these is possible, the administrator will sell the company's property to make at least a partial payment to one or more secured or preferential creditors, such as employees or the bank.
Administration can also apply to partnerships.
37

57vintage,

Keith (home of the TRUE Maroons) 05/12/2008 09:06:18
And Arbroath (laughingly called "The Gable Endies" in our local rag yesterday) are still waiting for the 5 figure payment on the Webster-Wigan deal.

Apparently they are willing to ask for Hearts' gate receipts to be impounded to have this contracted debt settled. I'm not sure how they would go about that though.

I wonder where all the goons who applauded Romanov into that AGM have gone?
38

Montford's Jaicket,

Hanging Around 05/12/2008 09:08:04
#39 - Not sure why you said "we" as I'm not a Hearts fan, and, based on your name, neither are you.

There are 2 types of onlookers - a) those who want to help and b) those who want to rubber-neck. I'm more inclined to be a type a).

If Hearts were to implode, what would be the impact on Hibs? Please sit back from the keyboard for maybe 2 minutes and consider that before you answer, rather than go "Hearts go bust - ha ha ha" or similar. For example, what would happen to your 2 derby gates every season?

Scottish football (club and national scene) needs to have clubs who are competitive and the scenario where Hearts - or any other of the bigger clubs - falls apart isn't a good one for ALL of the teams in the SPL (and perhaps lower divisions). Just for fun, have a look at the meaning of the phrase "in league" sometime - then ask yourself how that relates to the "football league".
39

GeorgeCowieOrWalterKidd?,

05/12/2008 09:13:49
#47 There was no "Webster-Wigan deal" that involved Hearts, so I'm not sure why we should pay anything. If he went on a Bosman would you expect him to pay you part of his signing on fee?

There was a deal between Wigan-Webster-Rangers. Maybe you should invoice Webster or Rangers for the cash as they are the ones who benefited from his actions, not Hearts. We may not even have received the compensation, not transfer fee, from Webster yet.
40

Red Dykes,

Tain 05/12/2008 09:17:31
The biggest TESCO in Edinburgh - the new Gorgie Road Branch - whilst Vlad returns from whence he came - remember Shinavatra at Man City................
41

Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 09:18:22
Got to look at the bigger picture, this all started when robinson was in charge and he ran up ridiculous debt in the first place, then we had the option sell the ground and move to murrayfield or go pear shaped or sell the shares to a guy who clearly at the time had bags of cash and had a vision he could break the hold of the old firm on scottish football. Let me ask all those ACCOUNTANTS out there WHAT would you have done in the situation, sell up parkhead, ibrox, easter road. my guess is that in the same situation any fan of another team would have done the same and anyone out there who says different is full of it! Every club is having to tighten the belts at the moment due to the worlds financial meltdown its just that the scottish presses hatered for the nutty one means they will jump on anything for a story (this can be proven by looking at the fact there are three stories in one paper all about the same thing).

The issue now is where do we go from here? We still have the stadium and at worst we will be back in the same position as 4 years ago! i dont think there are cashflow issues as such i honestly think it has more to do with the fact that romanov has to have a say in EVERYTHING that happens on a daily basis and hates getting forced into doing anything unless its on his terms!
42

Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 09:25:01
Celtic had to cut back big time in the 80's and rangers look to be on a shoogly peg also, hoobs fans are happy to support a club with no real ambition and are currently revelling in all this BUT if hearts do go under would the hoobs fans be happy to have no more local derbys and a large gate 3/4 times every season, who would they then play derbies with? motherwell have hamilton, dde utd now have aberdeen so tell me would you really be happy with playing falkirk every new year!
43

GeorgeCowieOrWalterKidd?,

05/12/2008 09:25:07
#53 Spot on. We'd be more financially secure if Tynecastle had been sold, but for me Hearts is all about Tynecastle. I would not have gone to some new Straiton stadium nearly as often - where else can two of my main interests - beer and football - be so closely linked than a football stadium right next to a brewery? Tynecastle is quality and I hope selling it is the absolute last resort. I'd rather we sold every single first-team player and play our reserves and youth players for a while.
44

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05/12/2008 09:26:55
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05/12/2008 09:27:44
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05/12/2008 09:30:20
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05/12/2008 09:31:02
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48

Rambo The Jambo,

05/12/2008 09:31:36
# 50 tommytommy

It's always possible to get a court order if you are owed money, the point we are trying to get over to some thicko Hobos is:

WE DON'T OWE ARBROATH ANYTHING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He wasn't transferred therefore how can we pay a percentage of a transfer fee which doesn't exist.

Webster walked out on HMFC. He went to Wigan on a free. He was order BY A TRIBUNAL to pay HMFC compensation. Compensation is not a transfer fee.

Get it yet???????????
49

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05/12/2008 09:31:53
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05/12/2008 09:32:25
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05/12/2008 09:32:55
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05/12/2008 09:33:43
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53

Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 09:36:24
If ubig/ukio are in such a mess financially them why arent the two builings they own in the city up for sale as they would still command a decent price! Romanov was guilty of having a dream and at the same time using that dream to try and market his bank into the UK but what he didnt see coming was a global financial meltdown. with massive companies going to the wall on a daily basis then everyone is now having to look over their shoulders at the moment.
If hearts did fold then we would just start out over like airdrie did and would have to share a ground with someone like livvy (who would be glad of the extra cash) but one thing is for certain it wouldnt be the end of hearts as the fan base would be there it would just mean we wouldnt have a nutty owner anymore!
54

scorchio,

West of the Pecos 05/12/2008 09:39:38
There is some utter nonsense written on HMFC finacial matters in these pages.
Right now, I accept that the club & fans are embarassed by the recent "revelations".
However, the most frustrating thing for me, is the amateurish way we seem to do everything, and that includes the initial submissions for the new stand.
I am more worried that a company that owns HMFC is incpable of setting in place the system where wages are paid on time, every time; than I am about administration/liquidation.
Hearts may indeed feel that Webster was not sold, and therefore no moneys are due to Arbroath, but I think I remember us saying we would pay them!
As for the agent who is demanding a six figure sum, Vlad has always stated that the agent is an agent of the player and the player should pay HIS agent.
So I concede on those two issues there may be acrimony, but on the paayment of wages it is totally unacceptable.
55

Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 09:40:17
NOOOOOOOOOOOO rambo dont go there with timmy timmy as he is like a broken record, the point is we shouldnt have to pay it BUT we said we would and should now just stump up the cash!

56

Iain Bhern,

05/12/2008 09:40:30
There's a load of absolute guff getting talked here. Let's be clear about one thing. The only ones who know the true state of things at Hearts are the Romanovs! It's been stated by #6 the UKIO profits are up 40% in the first eight months of the year but he hasn't quantified that 40%. 40% of what? 50 million? 50 quid?
It's only going to be of use to Hearts if it's 40% of a lot of money. We can pontificate until the cows come home but without the real facts of the matter none of us knows what's in store for Hearts. My own personal point of view is that I want to see Hearts continue into the future. No Hearts means no more short term amusement when I hear they've lost a match, no more anticipation of the next derby and the hope of beating them that goes with that anticipation and lastly but probably most important no more chances to have a laugh at workmates expense after a bad result. The other side of the coin of course is true for them but I'm happy to take the pain of losing to Hearts now and then knowing that there's always a next time, with no Hearts there wouldn't be a next time! Think on that fellow Hibees before you laugh at the current stories.
57

LionheartFodithman,

05/12/2008 09:42:17
#58 TT says....

"51 Bitterness creeping in ? You are a bitter twisted
wee man"

Scrambled egg splattered all over me screen.
58

Toast,

05/12/2008 09:43:32
The players are hardly the only people hearts owe money to,they have at least one court case pending and their gate receipts are to be frozen,Romanov may do business this way in his country but it is about time he was given a severe talking to the man is a cheap wee chancer.
59

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05/12/2008 09:43:58
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05/12/2008 09:44:37
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scorchio,

West of the Pecos 05/12/2008 09:45:17
#64 I have no idea, it should be a low priority under the present economic downturn, but Vlad is one for surprises.
What chance of Hibs building theirs first?
62

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05/12/2008 09:46:24
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Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 09:47:04
I have another issue! I have heard the manager of the month has been given to strachan! WHY and if this is the case then it clearly shows the bias towards the old firm, yes the wee ginger one has won one more game in the month of november but i though that csaba turning the team around and winning 5 on the trot would have counted for something! if its only based on purely winning games then it should be renamed the manager of the weegies award!
64

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05/12/2008 09:47:55
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Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 09:50:34
65 LF, egg is better than what all the hoobs fans (and timmy timmy) will be splattering ovet their screens on a daily basis.
66

GeorgeCowieOrWalterKidd?,

05/12/2008 09:51:51
#68 Incredible if true - Hearts deserve a clean sweep of the awards for November - Laslo - Manager, Berra or Drive - Young Player and Aguiar - Player.
67

Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 09:52:14
timmy timmy, hows your team getting on at the moment?
68

_NB_,

05/12/2008 09:56:15
Morning all. The way I see it, there is nothing to stop Hertz doing "a Motherwell" and wiping the slate clean and staying in the SPL. The only thing holding them back is mad Vlads desire to build flats at Tynecastle to recoup some of his investment. But with the current state of the property market, Vlad may be forced to walk away having blown his cash.
69

GeorgeCowieOrWalterKidd?,

05/12/2008 10:00:00
#74 "The only thing holding them back is mad Vlads desire to build flats at Tynecastle to recoup some of his investment"

Really? You're forgetting the small matter of mad Vlad canceling the sale of Tynecastle to Cala Homes when he bought the club, and thus losing a LOT of money as the value of the ground has dropped substantially since, to the point that its sale won't cover debts. If property development was his aim all along, he's got a very strage way of going about it.
70

_NB_,

05/12/2008 10:05:35
#75 Geo

Mad Vlad took a punt that in a rising market he should delay the sale. He was not the only speculator who thought the good times would continue to roll.
71

Paulmac2,

surrey 05/12/2008 10:05:40
68

Aye yer right....it shouldn't be decided on winning games?

The Hamilton manager Billy Reid should have won it...lifting his team aff the bottom of the league....and I'm sure you wouldn't have mentioned the number of games Hertz have won had they given it to Billy.....

Glasgow having the better teams is just something you're gonna have to live with...ya spanner!
72

Paulmac2,

surrey 05/12/2008 10:08:51
77

Have a look at your clubs salaries to revenue ratio...there is yer answer!
73

_NB_,

05/12/2008 10:09:49
#76 Tombhoy

Hertz still have their ground, which could be sold to cover much of the debt. Mad Vlad would prefer to make the sale whip out the cash and leave the club debt burdened with the ground gone. In some ways all this has come to ahead in such a way that Hertz still have a chance of going down the Motherwell route, However it plays out, Hertz will end up ground sharing at Easter Road.
74

,

05/12/2008 10:09:59
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
75

Rambo The Jambo,

4-0 at Hampden 05/12/2008 10:10:48
# 62 Maroon tinted glasses

Okily Dokily, everyone should just ignore this stupid ignorant Hobbit anyway. Responding to his taunts is just fanning the flames.

76

GeorgeCowieOrWalterKidd?,

05/12/2008 10:10:58
#76 Sorry tommytommy, it's UBIG's debt now. They hold the debt. They own Hearts. They pay the players. They take any profits.

#78 And you know that for sure do you? And that's why he also spent £1m on a plan to redevelop the ground, not to mention millions on players' wages and new community developments, etc - all while intending to sell the club in a couple of years? Expensive smokescreen.
77

Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 10:15:11
79, shhhhhhh

who truly is the spanner here?

Me commenting on a story regarding my team?

Or

You getting a semi cause you are able to read and type (with one hand) at the same time? mummy must be proud!
78

Snowman,

Whistler,BC 05/12/2008 10:22:08
I'm old enough to remember when stars like Bobby Evans,Jimmy Mallon, Bobby Collins all Celtic stars and Willie Waddell, Dougie Grey,all Rangers stars, Carrabine of Third Lanark, Dougie Wallace of Clyde and Gordon Smith of Hibs all had to take time away from their jobs to play mid-week games and time off on Fridays to travel for some away games as did all other Professional Footballers and never received pay for it. Oh and they all had to play for a full ninety-minutes and overtime as well. No substitutes and no penalty decisions and the goalkeeper had to get rid of the ball fast or he would be bundled into the net. Whatever happened to real football and real full-time footballers. Do we know of any footballer today who is really worth the money?
79

Paulmac2,

surrey 05/12/2008 10:24:14
85

"who truly is the spanner here?"

You...with that post!

You commented on the manager of the month award...ya tube!

Never mind...it's interesting that whilst you're posting about football...you're thinking about semi's....how very Hertz minded that is!

Now stop greetin ya pphhud...
80

LionheartFodithman,

05/12/2008 10:25:40
Its so HEARTS warming to know that there are so many followers of other teams that care so much about our great club.

I do think you fella's should hold fire with the custard cannons just a little while longer though.

The official line will be along very shortly i would pressume and then you can batter yourselves into oblivion if the mood takes you.
81

Iain Bhern,

05/12/2008 10:29:40
#86 if you were listening to Radio Scotland last night you could answer your question. "Whatever happened to real football and real full-time footballers. Do we know of any footballer today who is really worth the money?"

A player at Atletico Bilboa who has spent his entire career there is to play his last season for no wages. It's at his suggestion and is his way of saying thanks to the club and the fans for his career. Now that's the type of loyalty you just don't see these days. I'd say that makes him worth all the money he has been paid over the years!
82

Paulmac2,

surrey 05/12/2008 10:32:40
86

Nope!

No player is worth the money they are paid in a football sense....

However, football agents know the worth of merchandise and image rights...and sadly this is what inflates a players salary...which gives the false impression that the money he receives is purley for football....which it isn't....

I remember Tommy Gemmell...telling a story....that he had to keep an injury secret otherwise he would be dropped...and not playing meant no pay....and he had a mortgage to pay....

Changed days indeed!
83

Paulmac2,

surrey 05/12/2008 10:36:13
90

Now that is a remarkable gesture in this money driven footabll age....well done to the fella!
84

Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 10:36:53
87 oh dear, trawling the threads to find the slighest link to tie in to your team and your on it in a jiffy.

Get a life, you sad weegie outcast!
85

Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 10:40:12
91, aw cant you comment on threads regarding your own team? why would that be then, do you think its because you and your neighbours cant be trusted.

scvm
86

Jambo83,

05/12/2008 11:03:34
The thing I am most concerned about is Karipidis being amongst our top 6 earners!!!!!!!
87

GeorgeCowieOrWalterKidd?,

05/12/2008 11:10:10
#96 I'm also surprised to see Aguiar on that list, given he's been injured for so long and wasn't exactly trumpeted as a great signing when he arrived. Punting Makela, Kingston and Nade will do me and ease the wages significantly. I'm ambivalent about Karipedis but I really hope we keep Berra until the end of the season. If it came to a choice between losing Aguiar or Driver, I'd rather cash in on Aguiar while he's playing well. We've got Stewart for his position and Driver's value is more likely to rise. Plus good left-sided players are hard to find.
88

Jambo83,

05/12/2008 11:22:21
#97 - No, because contrary to what the hordes of Hibs fantasists think, Hearts still have some very sellable assets and the next transfer window is just 4 weeks away. If Hibs fans think Brown was worth £4.4m but Berra, Kingston or Driver are not worth £2-3m then you are the deluded ones. Not to mention Eggert Jonsson who has been scouted by Arsenal, Lee Wallace, Bruno Aguiar, Christian Nade.

Am I happy that we will have to sell our best players to better our financial position, yes and no. I want us to maintain our 3rd position and we will struggle to do so without Berra in the team, but I realise that UBIG cannot continue to fund us at £20m+ debt in the current climate.
89

Pazuzu,

05/12/2008 11:24:37
Romanov has a lot of questions to answer, then all the "stories" should come out in the wash.
Obviously the longer he takes to clear the air the longer this debate will go on, and I'm bored with this now.

Get rid of him, if that's possible.

GGTTH
90

Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 11:26:55
100 are you reading a differne statement from the rest of us!
91

Jambo83,

05/12/2008 11:29:08
Tommy, why do you and others on here take negative stories about Hearts as gospel, but when the same publication announced a few months back that Hearts debt was circa £20-24m it is a lot of nonsense?

You can't pick and choose i'm afraid, at least be consistent for heavens sake.
92

Paulmac2,

surrey 05/12/2008 11:30:37
93&94

Hahhahah.....you're a supporter of a 2 bob team with a 2 bob stadium in a 2 bob city...

Maybe if you can stop thinking about semi's whilst posting....you might just start to put together a cohesive post....

Now....Who you gonna support when yer club go doon the pan quicker than a flushed Tollie?
93

Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 11:31:37
102, where is your proof of this? the accounts have not been released for the time when the money should show up and believe me IF the accounts come out and there is no transfer cash showing then this is when the action will start, until that point we cant make accusations with the proof to follow it up! If the accounts come out and the debt has been reduced drasticaly then what would your argument be?
94

GeorgeCowieOrWalterKidd?,

05/12/2008 11:31:39
Hearts just confirmed every player has been paid today.
95

Pazuzu,

05/12/2008 11:31:53
Paulmac2

A gloating weegie, makes a change.
Must have nae mates to share his glue with.

GGTTH
96

Paulmac2,

surrey 05/12/2008 11:34:06
103

And when did you learn to read?

Another classic from Maroon the trumpet!
97

Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 11:34:09
106, no you show me your first lol.

i am only looking at the ones in the press, has there been another released!
98

_NB_,

05/12/2008 11:34:12
#105 PaulLing

Please forgive PaulLing folks, I bet you would be a bit cranky too if you had just spent the night sleeping in your car outside your ex-wifes flat.
99

AJ Fife,

05/12/2008 11:35:07
Looks like Hearts are spiralling into the abyss.

100

Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 11:36:57
110, still on a hearts thread?

that about says it all!

get to your supported teams games often do you? or are you one of those BANDWAGON fans!
101

Iain Bhern,

05/12/2008 11:37:42
#99 said "If Hibs fans think Brown was worth £4.4m but Berra, Kingston or Driver are not worth £2-3m then you are the deluded ones."

Frankly it doesn't matter a jot what any fan thinks my friend. It's the buying club that decide the worth of a player. Craig Gordon was worth 9 million to Sunderland but no one else came in with a similar offer. Hearts can put any valuation they like on players but ultimately if no other club agrees with the valuation they'll still be with you come the 1st Feb. The same goes for Fletcher who is reported to be valued at 4 million. Personally I think that's way over the top but if a club is daft enough to pay it then Petrie ain't daft enough to turn it down!
102

Paulmac2,

surrey 05/12/2008 11:38:40
109

Says the lad from needle city.....

Maroon face went on a bit of a rant...mentioning that when he posts....he has semi's on his mind?

Soory....but that is just asking for the p!sh to be taken....
103

_NB_,

05/12/2008 11:39:20
In fairness to the Hertz players, they have not let the behind the scenes shenanigans affect them in recent weeks. In fact they know they are playing for their futures, when the club goes belly-up they want to be picked up by some other club.
104

Paulmac2,

surrey 05/12/2008 11:43:53
112..

Ahhh.....Margaret....you and Maroon should team up....

what with Maroon thinking about semi's when he posts and you with yer monthly subscription to Hunks magazine...you seem the perfect couple...
105

salmondella,

uk 05/12/2008 11:45:52
Romonov needs to come cleahe players lose heart.n before t
106

Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 11:46:39
118, still here?

so are you going to change your name to paulmac bandwagon supporter and ablutophobe extrodanair!

join me in song

"your just a part time supporter, part time supporter, your just a part time supporter"
107

_NB_,

05/12/2008 11:47:18
I watched a fine programme on Rangers TV last night that had a report on a supporters club charity do. Several thousand pounds raised and a good time had by all. An interesting point for me was that in the group assembled all income brackets were represented, From those earning small amounts in Public Service(Posties, Nurses etc) to multi millionaires(leading business figures, the players). Yet they mixed freely, and were all equal as they were all Rangers Men.

Dignity in action.

READY
108

Paulmac2,

surrey 05/12/2008 11:48:54
115

Are you still posting sh@ite...

About sums you up..

Never mind Moron....Margaret(NB)from fruin street, Possilpark is on the thread.....he's right down your street....you will find him very like minded...

Good luck...

Ps..It's a football thread...Hertz fans don't own it
109

Jambo83,

05/12/2008 11:49:55
117, I agree entirely, but what your missing out on is the fact that Hibs fans are ready and waiting to tell us Berra, Kingston & Driver are not worth £2m+.

We turned down £1.5m for Berra just 5 months ago, and he has only improved since then.

I just wish Hibs fans would at least debate logically instead of letting their bitter hatred get in the way.
110

Jambo83,

05/12/2008 11:50:30
#124 - "Are you still posting sh@ite...

About sums you up.."


POT KETTLE BLACK you trumpet
111

Weel Kent Jambo,

05/12/2008 11:50:44
#123 What you meant was "were all equal as they were all members of the same Lodge".
112

Paulmac2,

surrey 05/12/2008 11:50:46
123

And how much did they raise for the MIH charity trust?
113

_NB_,

05/12/2008 11:51:49
#124

Yet again folks I would like to apologise on PaulLing's behalf, he is an embarrassment to himself and his estranged family.
114

_NB_,

05/12/2008 11:52:32
#127

Lodges have a very strict Heirarchy.
115

Paulmac2,

surrye 05/12/2008 11:53:32
122

I will be in my seat in the Jock Stein stand a week on Saturday.....as our reserves add Hertz to our list of victories....

Where will you be?...a back close with a needle no doubt!
116

Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 11:55:40
jambo83

i would like to introduce you and all those who post on these threads to........

PART TIME PAULMAC! the guy who likes to have his say on other teams yet doesnt even properly support his own.

Round of applause for part time paul WHAT A GUY!
117

Maroon tinted glasses,

05/12/2008 11:57:47
131

of course you will!
118

Iain Bhern,

05/12/2008 11:58:28
I'd have to agree with them as far as Kingston is concerned as I haven't really seen him do anything that values him too highly. He strikes me as a player in the same mould as Benji i.e. he only turns it on when he's in the mood, which in Benji's case wasn't very often!
119

Paulmac2,

surrey 05/12/2008 11:59:34
129

And Margaret is still ashamed of where he grew up....

Your sycophantic aaarrse licking to the Hertz fans is to be expected....you've always needed the gang approach when posting....

It's the Rangers way you know!
120

Paulmac2,

surrey 05/12/2008 12:02:56
133

You won't need to worry about your support fur Hertz......they won't exist as a club in 12 months time....



121

Weel Kent Jambo,

05/12/2008 12:03:26
#130 I didn't know they had hereditary leaders.....oh you mean hierarchy! Given the dictionary (Chambers before your ask) definition of a hierarch as "chief priest, prelate, an archangel" I wouldn't have thought they would have had anything to do with it. Ach well, will bow to your superior knowledge of this anchronistic bunch.
122

Weel Kent Jambo,

05/12/2008 12:04:51
#136 Remember hearing the same tripe 18 months ago...incidentally, what's the difference between an Essex girl and a Surrey girl?
123

Paulmac2,

surrey 05/12/2008 12:04:58
132

I hope you have plans a bucket collection on Saturday....yer club needs you!
124

_NB_,

05/12/2008 12:08:35
#131 PaulLing

Why all the anger wee man? Have you forgotten that this is a forum for sports comment?
125

Weel Kent Jambo,

05/12/2008 12:10:35
#139 - What good would a collection of buckets do ;o)

No need anyway - players payments now up to date.
126

Weel Kent Jambo,

05/12/2008 12:10:49
#139 - What good would a collection of buckets do ;o)

No need anyway - players payments now up to date.
127

Da Riot Survivor,

05/12/2008 12:26:33
Looks like Aguiar may be a straight swap for Bawwy Ferguson.

Hearts will be the losers on that deal!
128

_NB_,

05/12/2008 12:31:39
#156 soraisis

Do you think that this is the weekend that Celtic get a taste domestically of what they have been getting in Europe? Danish minnows Aalborg cannot be that much better than Hibs...
129

Daillyman,

05/12/2008 12:35:05
Paul why so smug regarding the possible financial predicament of other SPL clubs. Would you not prefer to see clubs in a more solid financial state.

It was not that long ago that the wolf was at the door of Parkhead, until an expat jumped in to bail the club out.

Hearts I think will survive the crisis that is Romanov, should things turn REALLY bad, a consortium will get control of the club, do a Motherwell and be stronger than ever in a couple of seasons.

130

Weel Kent Jambo,

05/12/2008 12:36:26
#157 You mean doing a Rangers? Horsed out of Europe by our feeder team then humped by us? Can't see it - Celtic aren't as bad as you and Hibs are worse than us - league tables don't lie.
131

_NB_,

05/12/2008 12:40:22
#158 DM

Not doubt Fergus McConman saved Celtic. However, he did so leaving a legacy of three sides of a stadium that will require significant refurbishment or replacement by 2015. Wee Fergus cleared £10 million on the deal when Celtic were floated on the stock exchange. Without him, Celtic would have gone to the wall; with him they were sold a dream but may end up in a nightmare...
132

Helter Skelter,

05/12/2008 12:41:42
I think the rearrangerz have more to worry about this weekend than the champions.

In their last two outings, hamilton have drawn at tannadice and beaten falkirk, both of which are ver impressives results...in hamilton terms, they are on a run. T hey will go to the dark star tomorrow full of belief that they can take something.

Although the rearrangerz' home results look impressive, recently they have looked unconvincing : an injury time equaliser against Dundee U, a close 2v1 win over st mirren and an anxst ridden 2v0 win against aberdeen.

Generally they are still winning at home, but the margins have been close of late ...they are not burying teams at home, far from it.

The rearrangerz players go into this one knowing that if they put one foot wrong they could open the door for Celtic to stretch their impressive lead further...the pressure on the rearrangerz players is close to 'season-ending' proportions, and they face a team who have no pressure on them at all, but who will fancy their chances.

The whole combination of circumstances tell me that whilst rearrangerz will probably win, I wouldn't bet heavily against hamilton stealing a point.
133

_NB_,

05/12/2008 12:45:29
#161 HS

Some reasonable points in there HS, you could be right on some of them. Let me put another reasonable point to you; Celtic's results have been achieved in spite of the performance level, which might have justified a few dropped poits, all other things being equal.
134

Da Riot Survivor,

05/12/2008 12:53:37
#157 - (h)oplus. Aalborg was indeed a lesson and I expecr Hib to be better than the Danes.

However, despite the defeat in Denmark, we still pocketed Scotlands money from the champs league

to reiterate:

Since '92 when the Champs League began, 13 teams have won the big cup. Both Celtic and ReaRangers have played 8 of that elite group.

Mighty Celtic have beaten 7 of the 8. ReaRangers have beaten 1 (post Mourinho Porto).

Poor ReaRangers...all that money spent, all that debt accrued and no real tales of glory...

135

Helter Skelter,

05/12/2008 12:55:14
162

Every team will go through a period of poor performances, but the only one I would single out was last week's show against inverness.

But I think there was good reason for that. It seemed pretty clear early in the second half that Caley were holding back hoping that Celtic would tire in the last 15 minutes after their midweek champions league exertions.

I think our players spotted that, and were content to move the ball among the back line as much as possible : just keeping possession with the minimum amount of energy being expended. It made for an eye-wateringly boring contest...the number of backward passes by Celtic in that second half was just unbelievable ...I wouldn't watch that 90 minutes again for anything less than £500.

But i think the truth is that the players were mentally and physically tired and were concerned about pushing forward only to find themselves out on their feet going into the last 15 minutes but one goal to the good. So although we were poor to watch, I think there were tactical reasons for it ...tactics which, in light of subsequent remarks, I don't think were given prior approval by Strachan.
136

Daillyman,

05/12/2008 12:56:27
161 Helter

Giving the tic their due they are in a good run of victories, doing the job, and squeaking out victories some by the odd goal, getting the 3 points, but you're clubs form on the park is hardly the stuff of legends.

An extra loss and 2 draws are the difference in the league standings with a long way to go.

I'd wish the Hibs well against the tic, but I think we all know where the 3 points will end up.
137

_NB_,

05/12/2008 13:07:45
#164 HS

Celtic's recent run in the SPL has been formidable, helped by every key decision going their way may I add. In the Aarlborg game, wee MacDonald dived in the box and got nothing for it. In an SPL game the ref's thoughts would have been, better a dubious decision in Celtic's favour on your conscience, than a brick through the window in the middle of the night.
138

Helter Skelter,

05/12/2008 13:09:24
165

Brian, I think we'll win on Sunday. I don't think hibs are playing particularly well at the moment and it would take a big turn around in their performances of late for them to take anything.

Normally going to easter road I am very uncertain about the outcome, but I think hibs are in disaray just now and the champions should be too good for them.

I think our players were in desperate need of a break many of them having played 9 games in 28 days combined with the fact that our squad has been down to the bare bones during most of that period. Many of our players have been carrying injuries as well.

So getting this 8 day lay off has allowed all the niggles to heal a bit more and a bit of respite from having to psyche themselves up for a game every 3 days...players eventually become jaded as much by the mental demands as by the physical.

That being so I expect the champions to be back on song, and as I don't rate hibs highly at the moment, I reckon we will take all three points back along the M8.
139

_NB_,

05/12/2008 13:18:24
#167 HS


Or if the M8 is snarled-up:

Easter RdEdinburgh, City of Edinburgh EH6, UK

1. Head west on St Clair Ave toward Easter Rd 131 ft
2. Continue on Lorne St 0.2 mi
3. Turn right at A900/Leith Walk 0.3 mi
4. Slight left at Leith Walk 105 ft
5. Slight left at A901/Great Jct St 0.4 mi
6. Turn left at A902/Ferry Rd
Continue to follow A902
Go through 1 roundabout 3.4 mi
7. Turn right at A90/Hillhouse Rd
Continue to follow A90 1.8 mi
8. Slight left at Maybury Rd
Go through 1 roundabout 1.5 mi
9. Turn right at A8/Glasgow Rd 0.7 mi
10. Turn left at Gogar Station Rd 1.0 mi
11. Turn right toward Addiston Farm Rd 1.2 mi
12. Slight left at Addiston Farm Rd 0.4 mi
13. Turn right at A71
Go through 1 roundabout 6.5 mi
14. At Lizzie Brice's Interchange, take the 1st exit onto A71/Bankton Rd
Continue to follow A71
Go through 2 roundabouts 3.7 mi
15. Turn left at B7008/Grant St 75 ft
16. Turn left at B7008/Harburn Rd 0.2 mi
17. Sharp left at Parkhead Crescent 279 ft
18. Turn left to stay on Parkhead Crescent 243 ft
19. Turn right at B7008/Harburn Rd
Continue to follow B7008 0.2 mi
20. Turn left at A71/E End
Continue to follow A71 13.3 mi
21. At the roundabout, take the 3rd exit onto A71/Morningside Rd 0.4 mi
22. At the roundabout, take the 1st exit onto A71/Main St
Continue to follow A71
Go through 1 roundabout 3.8 mi
23. At the roundabout, take the 3rd exit onto A71/Cornsilloch Brae
Continue to follow A71
Go through 1 roundabout 2.9 mi
24. At the roundabout, take the 5th exit onto A71/Swinhill Rd heading to M74/Glasgow/M73 0.3 mi
25. Slight left to merge onto M74 toward Glasgow 13.4 mi
26. At the roundabout, take the 2nd exit onto A74/Fullarton Rd
Continue to follow A74 1.8 mi
27. Turn right at Kerrydale St
Destination will be on the right 299 ft

Celtic ParkKerrydale St, Glasgow, Glasgow City, UK

140

Daillyman,

05/12/2008 13:25:25
167 Helter

9 matches in 28 days, thats tough!! You're post has a familiar ring to it when you mention injuries, eg. last season.

I have rarely seen a Gers supporter, mention the injuries we have had this season or last.
141

Daillyman,

05/12/2008 13:31:50
The president of the players union has been very quiet regarding the late payment of wages to the Hearts players.
142

_NB_,

05/12/2008 13:35:49
C'mon folks, IT'S FRIDAY! The weekend starts here...

You have gotta love the weekend, it is the Daddy of the whole week. If there was no such thing as the weekend, then weeks themselves would have to be abolished and life would become one long monotonous trudge from cradle to grave. But every week, we are given back 2 days to live as we should. Lets here it for the weekend; HIP HIP...

143

Jambo-ree,

05/12/2008 13:39:14
#170 Maybe because it really is a non-issue?
144

Daillyman,

05/12/2008 13:48:26
172

I hope you are correct.
145

_NB_,

05/12/2008 14:33:36
Did you know, that since WGS took over Celtic it's value has doubled. When he took over it was worth £15 million, now you could buy the whole club for circa £30 million.

How much of this doubling in value can be attributed to the good work of WGS?
146

_NB_,

05/12/2008 14:36:08
If WGS gets a chance to make the step up from Celtic to Sunderland, does the wee man have the balls to take on the challenge? He has done very well in the SPL and has taken FULL advantage of some very favourable and unprescedented circumstances.
147

Roscoe's P Clonetrain,

05/12/2008 14:42:37
Ah, poor wee TIIIMMMMMMYYYY!!!

Will you never learn? Just because something bounces around your empty head doesn't mean it's true.

"On the point of selling players in the window to obtain income nobody seems to register that
Romanov pockets transfer fees.

There are millions of pounds missing from transfer fees.

If they were in Hearts accounts then the players would get paid"

Unless you've got actual, verifiable facts to back that up, it's libel. You are accusing an individual of Fraud.

Two economics degrees MY BACKSIDE. You're a twisted, deluded fantasist who revels in the pain of others by just making up nonsense with absolutely no basis in fact or logic.

I pity the fool, I really do.
148

Helter Skelter,

05/12/2008 14:58:26
169

It is a bit of a throwback to what the rearrangerz faced last season ...the difference is that we lost only 1 game during the run, drew once (man u) and won the rest.
149

Helter Skelter,

05/12/2008 15:00:16
my head says rearrangerz 3 hamilton 1 , my heart says Rearrangerz 1 Hamilton 1

 

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