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Salmond welcomes banking rescue package



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Published Date: 08 October 2008
Scotland's First Minister Alex Salmond today welcomed the £50 billion rescue plan for UK banks as a "very substantial" set of measures.
But he insisted more action was still needed and repeated his calls for a cut in interest rates and greater protection for UK deposits.

He also said that "leaks and rumours" surrounded the dramatic fall in Royal Bank of Scotland's share price yesterday.

"It's substantial – it's very substantial," SNP leader Mr Salmond said of Chancellor Alistair Darling's rescue package on BBC Radio Scotland's Good Morning Scotland programme.

"For the first time we've seen action to open up medium-term funding which has been one of the missing links in the previous attempts to help the situation.

"So that's welcome."

But more needs to be done, Mr Salmond added.

"I think there will have to be a decisive cut in interest rates to restore confidence in the real economy and I still think more assurance will be needed for depositors.

"But let's accentuate the positive shall we – this is a substantial package and addresses one of the missing links in previous attempts to stabilise the system."

The Treasury plan sees eight UK banks and building societies – including RBS, Barclays, HBOS, Lloyds TSB and Nationwide – signing up to an initial £25 billion scheme.

And the Government said it stood ready to make at least another £25 billion available for other eligible institutions.

The Bank of England is also extending the existing £50 billion Special Liquidity Scheme to £200 billion, while a further £250 billion being pumped in under a debt guarantee scheme.

Mr Salmond said speculation surrounding the future of Royal Bank of Scotland chief executive Fred Goodwin was "not helpful" while the stabilisation package was being announced.

"It doesn't respond to the enormity of the challenge that everybody's facing and doesn't really address the seriousness of the position for families and countries around the country," said the First Minister.

He hailed RBS – where he worked as an oil economist before entering politics – as one of the "best performing and profoundly strong" financial institutions in the world.

"The fact that it came under such pressure yesterday is an indication of the very peculiar, unusual circumstances of leaks and rumours that were circulating around yesterday," he said.

"I'm sure everybody who was in that process would have much preferred that hadn't happened when they look back – but it does show any institution can come under pressure."

Mr Salmond said Government should "fire all the guns in its locker" to tackle the situation, including interest rate cuts and depositor guarantees.

"Show authority and confidence and then you will find the markers start following you, as opposed to you following the markets."

Mr Salmond accepted that 98% of depositors are covered by current protection measures.

But he said the remaining 2% covers accounts of local councils, housing associations, voluntary organisations and companies.

"They can account for between a third and a half of all deposits.

"That's what I've called for protection to be extended to all depositors – to give people an absolute cast iron assurance that they don't have to move their money about looking for safe havens."

It is hoped that the measures announced by Mr Darling today will provide the capital boost needed and help restore confidence to get banks lending to each other again.

But the Government is demanding that in return for the public-backed cash injection, banks must cap executive pay and shareholder dividends and commit to supporting lending to homebuyers and small businesses.

Mr Salmond said he had "no difficulty" with the cap on executive pay.

"That's part of the lesson that people will have to learn across the sector," he said.

"I think pay curbs will be widely welcomed by the public."

The full article contains 631 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

 
1

Linda,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 09:17:40
Salmond also called for 1% cut in Bank Rate. But moves 18 months too late by Brown and Darling FSA and Bank of England who are supposed to be in charge and stop excessive lending in the first place.
2

Fidelio,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 09:30:27
Mmmmm Alex, maybe this Scottish independance thing is not such a great thing as it would appear that Scotland does not have an economy or a stable banking system.

I can't imagine Shrek and the the other jonnies from the Scottish Parliament digging into our shortbread tin to help HBOS and RBS stay afloat?

3

tommytommy,

08/10/2008 09:45:17
An independent Scotland is hailed by Nationalists as the solution to economic problems north of the border.

People fail to realise that poverty stricken Bolivia has a nationalist government as does the mighty U.S.A .

The fact is that Capitalism is universal and Nationalist Govts. are no answer to economic booms and slumps.

As it stands Scotland could be considered bankrupt.

Where does that leave the argument for Scottish Independence?
4

The Answer,

Glasgow 08/10/2008 09:47:27
I understand why they call "the obese one" a roll model, or has that pic been manipulated to make him look more obese than he really is?
5

BIG EYE,

Paisley 08/10/2008 10:01:46
The saddest thing about this crisis is that it has brought out all the worst traits in the unionist community who seem to be trying their best to make Scotland's problems worse.

Such a parcel of rogues has never seemed more appropriate.

Before they pass out with excitement I suggest they have a look at the situtaion in Norway, the country most closely associated to Scotland's economy.

That is what is possible when a potentially rich, small country has full powers and is run by politicians whose sole loyalty is to their own country.

Woe betide the Labour Party if anything happens to RBS as on top of the HBOS shambles Scotland would never forgive these Labour chancers.
6

JoeMiddleton,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 10:08:48
Independent Ireland has already guaranteed the deposits in their banks. Scotland is as capable as any other country of running our own affairs whether there is a financial crisis or not.
7

Border Scot,

08/10/2008 10:09:00
#5 - So the Arc of prosperity is now reduced to Norway is it? I notice that you do not mention that both direct and indirect tax rates in Norway are substantially higher than they are in Scotland. Are you advocating the introduction of Norwegian levels of taxation here?
8

Border Scot,

08/10/2008 10:10:04
#6 - But independent Ireland cannot guarante the deposits because independent ireland does not have the money to do so. Which is why share prices in Irish banks are still falling.
9

connaughtboy,

stonehaven 08/10/2008 10:16:35
Salmond was talking common sense on GMS. It's tragic that Brown and Darling have delayed taking this action for so long.

This country is now paying the price for the Labour Government taking their eye off the regulatory ball for so long. The "light touch" of regulation is now seen to be a major Brown failing.

Just look at the decisive action taken by Ireland. Independence cannot come soon enough, as the Union is proving to be a liability rather than a benefit.
10

tommytommy,

08/10/2008 10:29:05
Does it matter if you are hired and fired by a Scottish employer or by say an English or a Spanish one.?

Does it matter what the political colours are of the people who" manage"an economy that is market driven?

It seems not if you look at the world today.
11

Border Scot,

08/10/2008 10:29:37
#9 - Ireland is in deep, deep trouble. The decisive action you talk about has not prevented a continued slide on Irish banking stocks and should Irish banks go bust Ireland will not have the money to pay up on the guarantees it has made, just as iceland does not have the money.
12

Border Scot,

08/10/2008 10:30:36
10 - I agree 100%. The last few weeks have shown just what an interconnected, interdependent world we live in.
13

Auld Twa,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 10:33:28
Independent Scotland would have had its own financial regulation and our problems would be dependent on how good or bad was our regulation.
As far as the union goes the UK is in a worse state than most small countries and it is almost totally due to GB's lack of regulation of the financial sector.
Neither GB nor AD seem to have a clue how do take a lead in this situation, probably because neihe of them have any background in the subject.
GB certainly put an end to boom but in spite of wjat he promised has clearly had no influence on the bust part of the equation.
14

Huntly loon,

Aberdeenshire 08/10/2008 10:44:23
The financial sector does not generate wealth. It creams off the wealth of others and takes lavish salaries and bonuses to themselves. Only those countries which have natural resources and have avoided debt are protected from this present crisis.

Unfortunately, despite Scotland's rich natural resources of agriculture, fishing, forestry, oil, wind and hydro power and its ancillary industries of whisky, food and tourism, its citizens have lived on credit on the back of inflated house prices.

The rest of the UK is even less well provided with natural resources. All the countries in the 'Arc of Prosperity' are well provided with natural resources, unfortunately Iceland played at the 'Casino' way beyond its size and has come unstuck. It still remains a prosperous country in terms of resources despite having its fingers burned.

The moral of this crisis is to be wary of relying on the financial sector to give prosperity, a position which the UK with the City of London is currently in.
A burgeoning Edinburgh financial sector is not what Scotland should put its faith in.

The unionists on these boards seem to be taking delight in the crisis in which RBS is in as they feel it as a stick to beat Salmond with. Alas Salmond and Vince Cable have been consistently ahead of the game here, leaving Brown and Darling dithering, with policies of too little, too late.

This is an international crisis affecting all economies, and no respecter of the size of the country. The unionist/nationalist debate is of no relevance.
15

Hoops man,

08/10/2008 10:50:39
#4
I am intrigued where Salmond has got the alias as "the obese one " as clearly Nanny Broon is about the same tonnage, I suppose its may just be liebour supporters worried, sort of pot calling kettle black and stones and glass hooses come to mind lol
16

W U Merchant,

Aberdeen 08/10/2008 10:58:05
Salomd supports this? Wonders will never cease.
17

Royster,

08/10/2008 11:12:20
Does anybody care? Alex Salmond = Mr Nobody.
18

Royster,

08/10/2008 11:15:50
Looks like Iceland has fixed its exchange rate...
19

Royster,

08/10/2008 11:16:46
Can anyone see an 'arc of prosperity'?
20

danielrober,

08/10/2008 11:32:08
Really good to be reading about Alec.S been a team player. Good man.
21

Doh,

08/10/2008 11:35:02
#14

I think I am going to have to agree with you.

It is a pity that New Labour has not taken this opportunity to remove the banks from the stock markets
not by nationalisation but by enforced mutualisation.

Nothing has been changed that will stop this credit boom and rampant speculation from recurring.
22

connaughtboy,

stonehaven 08/10/2008 11:42:28
#11 Border Scot

I am well aware that the Irish situation is bad, but at least theie Government have been able to act directly to support their banks.
23

Miss H,

08/10/2008 11:44:28
3 As it stands most western countries are bankrupt. The UK is bankrupt. The USA has been bankrupt for years. So what's your point?

12 Border Scot. You are absolutely right that the past few months have shown not only how inter-connected the world is but also how much we are all at the mercy of events.

When we are to a large extent at the mercy of global events beyond our control it is lunacy to advocate having no control of the economic levers which are in fact available to us – or would be if we were a normal independent country.


24

Robert Mason,

Larkhall 08/10/2008 11:56:21
And if the Blessed Alex says it's OK, it must be OK, musn't it?
25

Stephen Cowley,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 12:02:01
"Mr Salmond said "Show authority and confidence and then you will find the markers start following you, as opposed to you following the markets.""

That sounds like an attempt to outbid the market to me. I don't think government should ignore or seek to disguise market signals on unsustainable banking practices.
26

Cpt Incredible,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 12:16:54
The simple facts,make the case for Independance all the more compelling.
Like Norway, an Independant Scotland would have had huge cash reserves,thus underpinning the financial stability of both the RBS and HBOS.
The "runs" on these banks due to lack of confidence would simply not have happened in the first place.
I'd also like to point out that any money that is being used to help RBOS and HBOS,would have been more than funded by Scotland in the first place.
27

peteedinburgh,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 12:25:49
It seems like only last year that the SNP wanted Scotland to be more like Iceland and Ireland and copy their rapidly expanding economies.

Gosh, it was only last year! Now we want to be just like Norway. I wonder who we'll want to be like in a years time

28

donald,

glasgow 08/10/2008 12:36:31
So Bolivia want to be ruled by London, according to someone's logic?
29

donald,

glasgow 08/10/2008 12:36:52
I'd prefer to be rule by Bolivia.
30

tommytommy,

08/10/2008 12:48:46
23

I thought the point was clearly made?

I stated that Nationalist Governments are as impotent in this market driven economic crisis as are all Governments-be they Multinational, Unionist, Federations, Socialist, Communist or whatever name they take.

Its there for all to see.

You can see for yourself that an Independent Scotland for example would be bankrupt today.

Im not scoring points.
Simply stating a fact.

31

Cpt Incredible,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 12:54:16
30#
Why is Norway not bankrupt today then?
An Independant Scotland would be flourishing today as every day.
32

frank mcbride,

lusitania 08/10/2008 12:55:39
It's interesting to read the comments of Unionist Alliance supporters on this situation.

Scottland couldn't have protected itself.
Scotland would be bankrupt.
Alex Salmond is wrong, fat.........

They are correct, of course, but all the problems that we are facing are a result of UK regulatory failings.

The Unionists give no credence to the idea of a different Fiscal model for Scotland.

It is interesting to note that all the initiatives being put into place, at this moment, are almost exactly what the fat, stupid, ignorant, out-of-touch Salmond has been advocating. It should also be noted that other measures e.g. the suspension of "short selling", advocated by Alex Salmond have also been adopted by the UK Government.
33

Lance Boyle,

Linlithgow 08/10/2008 13:00:54
I bet that the leading financial experts are relieved that Alex Salmond has endorsed this package. Ho ho ho ... .
34

"Hoots" Fandango,

08/10/2008 13:01:49
16
W U Merchant,

"Salomd supports this? Wonders will never cease."

But does Salmond?
35

Lance Boyle,

Linlithgow 08/10/2008 13:02:06
32

Frank, Alex is not fat. He is plump(ish). Ho ho ho ... .
36

Grahamski,

Falkirk 08/10/2008 13:17:25
32
Aye, you're right enough, Mr Salmond does seem to have the uncanny knack of being correct about issues after the event and he's very impressive pontificating on issues for which he has no responsibility.
It's just a pity that on issues which are his responsibility he seems to do little more than offer excuses and blame others for his administration's shortcomings....
37

frank mcbride,

lusitania 08/10/2008 13:36:28
# 36, Grahamski.

Hi Grahamski, I see the McKrapinatinkan bunker is still in darkness.
38

The_Reiver,

08/10/2008 13:41:22
Salmond welcomes banking rescue package

God, things must be really bad if Salmond is supporting the UK government instead of trying to undermine it.

Was he the man who effectively said that RBS was in a very strong position a few days ago?

Perhaps his endorsement of the plan is the kiss of death.
39

The_Reiver,

08/10/2008 13:43:09
#38

Repeat after me slowly:

"The economic arguments for independence are melting as the snows in spiring"

Now again.....
40

AJM,

08/10/2008 13:51:30
Salmond seems to have nothing like the insight that Vince Cable has of the situation, or the ability to make us understand what is going on and the dangers of inaction or action. That is not a ppb for the Libdems but an acknowdgement of a able politician.

However this instability does rock the independence argument, not among those commited, but the average person would get very nervous of such a leap at this point especially if it were to last for another year.

After all the committed are not after a better financial country, just independence. Just as hanging better economy was a useful peg to hang the hat when it was going ok, so was pointing to other independent countries such as Iceland. The world has changed and political parties will find out how much it affects them in the coming months, if appetite for independence drains away then it will be interesting to see what the SNP do.
41

Kenny,,

Glasgow 08/10/2008 13:57:59
So let me get this right. The unionists/British nationalists are arguing that Independence in the current globnal financial crisis means bankruptcy. Therefore every Independent country in the world is bankrupt because they are Independen?!

Unionist arguments get more bizarre with every pasing day.
42

Kenny,,

Glasgow 08/10/2008 13:59:49
40 The_Reiver

So the UK's Independence cannot continue then?

Perhaps you are right.
43

AJM,

08/10/2008 14:24:21
#40 Kenny, I am not arguing that at all, as much as SNP supporters were arguing that independence meant instant prosperity like Iceland, Ireland etc. No it just narrowers the argument. Your and others strident note seems to support my view, that the crisis will make a vote for independence harder. You have to convince the majority in a time of distinct difficulty that another great change is for the better after 300 odd years of reletive stability.
44

AJM,

08/10/2008 14:27:21
#44 Norway has to pass at least 90% of all EU legislation in order to gain access to the market, so they are not really outside. So the SNP position is shifting to outside of the UK and then out of the EU? seems to me by the 2 examples you want to learn about.
45

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 14:31:37
44 fed Up
You (and others) while talking about HBOS and RBS are forgetting that both of these banks have the majority of their business in other parts of the UK. This means that, even if Scotland were independent, the banks would be mostly regulated by another country as banks are subject to the regulations of where they do business - not where their head office is.

What then would the actions of a Scottish govt have been if they had been faced with this crisis. Would they have pumped in billions to support businesses operating in another country? Would they have guaranteed all deposits? Either of these moves could have resulted in billions flowing out of Scotland.

This is not a nationalist/unionist point I am trying to make. I am just trying to ensure that people have an appropriate perspective on these issues.
46

tommytommy,

08/10/2008 14:34:44
Nationalists argue that if only they had control of Capitalism they would make it work "differently"- in the interests of everyone in their little part of the globe.

There isn't a Nationalist Govt. in the world who has managed that. There isnt a Nationalist Govt.that is in charge of their economy in this crisis.

When businesses and economies go down the tubes it happens irrespective of the colour of the party in Govt.

People lose jobs and income and all that follows even under Nationalist Govts.

Nationalist Govts. cant stop that process.

Even the mighty USA(Nationalist) Govt. cant stop it happening.

If you disagree or if you have the answer to the problem then please get in touch with Gordon Brown and George Bush because they are looking for a solution.


47

Kenny,,

Glasgow 08/10/2008 14:34:47
#45 AJM

Sorry what strident note and who argued that Independence meant instant propserity.

I have no doubt that unionists will use the current global financila crisis for their narrow ends. They do tend to use fear and scaremongering as their tactic of choice. If their black propoganda works then that doesnt reflect well on anyone.

The reality is that all countries are in the same boat. Those who have made poor financial decisions will suffer the most. I have no doubt an Independent Scotland woul be well capable of making the right decisions.

48

Miss H,

08/10/2008 14:50:20
48 What nonsense.

Nationalists do not claim that if they had control of 'capitalism' they could make it work better.

They claim that if Scotland was independent the government would be in a better position to respond to global uncertainties and change.

Two quite different things.
49

Miss H,

08/10/2008 14:54:44
46 No the SNP is pro EU and pro euro.
50

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 15:06:08
50 Fed Up
You have launched a tirade against me by ascribing to me points I have not made and views I have not expressed. You have also assumed opinions of mine with no substantiation. Can you deal with the points I made not with some imaginary points that somebody else may have made that, for some reason, you are ascribing to me.

I did not say or even imply that this would stop Scotland from being independent.

But it was you who raised the topic of saving HBOS in post 44. You bemoaned the fact that Scotland could not save it as it was not independent. All I asked was how would you have saved it if Scotland had been independent as most of its business is elswhere.
51

New Town Resident,

08/10/2008 15:24:34
#6, 8 and 11. re the Irish Bank Guarantee

Just for the record the Irish PM said today that legislation to put this in place would be significantly delayed and subject to further discussion.

i.e. it doesn't exist.

I think maybe the correct technical term, as used here also, is "aspiration"?
52

Brian Hill,

08/10/2008 15:29:28
This unionist delight in the current discomfort of the Scottish Banking Sector is very revealing. In order to further their unionist cause they are happy to see a major plank of the Scottish economy being destroyed.

This will not go unnoticed by the voting public in Scotland. unionists can expect to be 'rewarded' for their efforts at the polls beginning with Glenrothes.

As I write, Alex Salmond is giving a live interview on the UK financial crisis. He speaks fluently, quickly and intelligently, more so I have to say than either the Chancellor or Prime Minister on the same topic.

This is a major reason why the SNP is so high in the polls, confidence in Alex Salmond reflects confidence in the SNP.

Others raise confidence too of course, Nicola Sturgeon and John Swinney to name but two.
53

Alan B,

08/10/2008 15:34:09
#Miss H

You say the snp are pro euro. Something i completely agree with. Why then is there policy to stick with sterling after independence? I can sort of understand it for political reasons so the euro can be put on the back burner.

I would have thought having fiscal autonomy and scottish memership of the euro should be the core policy even when scotland is within the union.

Parties like labour and lib dems who support the euro for scotland but are not willing to join unless england do seem to be putting the union before scotlands economic interests.
54

tommytommy,

08/10/2008 15:40:04
54

You raised an earlier point at 23 and I assume that you accept my response in its entirety at 30.

Nationalist Governments present capitalist solutions to economic problems.I cant think of a single Nationalist Govt. advocating the abolition of the wages system money buying and selling .

The present Scottish Nationalist Party advocates alternative policies within the wages system money buying and selling economy.

If Nationalists don't advocate an alternative way of running Capitalism what do they offer?

Of course they offer their brand of Capitalism as an alternative to say a Unionist Govts. brand.

The U.S.A. has a Nationalist Govt.Italy has a Nationalist Govt.France has one etc etc.

These countries are not immune from poverty economic recession and all the paraphanalia of modern day Capitalism.

Why do you believe that Scotland would be any different?

Is it down to the personalities running these economies? 51 thinks so.

Your last paragraph displays naivety in the extreme.

I note your failure to evidence this claim and indeed if you switch on your television to BBC world news you will quickly change your position.
55

AJM,

08/10/2008 15:46:50
#Miss H has the position changed, I thought that it was your parties policy that an independent Scotland would withdraw from the common fisheries policy, I am sure that I heard him say that. To me mind that means no to the EU you cannot pick and choose which bits you want. The French and Spainish are never going to agree to that. But that is an aside.

I see that you avoid my central point that this crisis will lead to a weakening of the pro independence support. Nothing to do with Unionists, it is just that people will think it too great a risk.
56

tommytommy,

08/10/2008 15:48:15
Iceland has a Nationalist Govt.

Why has it gone bankrupt?

The currency is in freefall.

People are being paid off in their droves.

Whats the Nationalist solution to that problem 54?
57

Alan B,

08/10/2008 15:50:33
# AJM

The snp position is pro EU. That has been a long standing policy.

You may be right that the current crisis will weaken indenpendence. Or alternatively it could strengthen it. Much of the unionist argument over the yrs has been to play the fear angle.

So will fear over logic win. Who knows.
58

Alan B,

08/10/2008 15:58:53
#tommytommy

I think you are confusing issues.

A country only performs aswell as it is managed. Capitalist economies are implemented slightly different in different countries but in general have done better than fail socialist models (government running all industry). Capitalist economies are managed by governments and globalisation while benifical in some aspects means government have less control over the economy.

The argument for scottish independence would be scotland would be better managed. Economic policies would be designed for the scottish economy with scottish issues as the priority.

While all western economies are up in a mess, some more than others (the uk is worse becuase of Browns mismanagement than German say), the fact is over a prolonged period of time small countries in europe tend to have performed better.

Luxembourg, Norway, Ireland, Switzerland, Iceland, Netherlands,Austria, Denmark, Sweden, Finland , Belgium

have all gpd per capita ppp higher than uk, france, germany and italy.

Growth in the group of small countries known as the arc of prosperity in economic circles has been 3.6% over the last decade while the uk has had 2.8% and scotland a lowly 2.2%. Over the last 30yrs scotland has had a disasterous growth of less than 2%. With the obvious implication for living standards.

What this crisis shows, no matter big or small everyone is hit by a global crisis, particular when the root cause is the US which underpins so much of the global economy.
59

P Rayner.,

Great Britain 08/10/2008 16:07:02
Breaking off from his curry and pies the obese Salmond confirmed that RBS and HBOS in that " power house" Edinburgh were in fact in serious economic difficulty and without the intervention of Westminster would most likely have collapsed. He went on, between munches, that maybe, so-called independence, might not, afterall, be such a good idea. He further stated that although many of his ilk had recently, on these pages, been praising such as Iceland, in the light of Icelands borrowing from Russia to stave off bankruptcy he would prefer they desist from further comment until he and his superb team at the SNP think of something.
60

An Beal Bacht,

08/10/2008 16:07:32
A lot of posters on here are deluding themselves re: Scottish Independence. It is inevitable. This crisis just speeds up the process.
61

A Better Way,

Scottish Republic 08/10/2008 16:12:23
Tommy isnt the Westmonster Government a National Government?.

Tommy does that make them a British Nationalist Government?.

What the helll are you talking about laddie. For christs sake fight your case with some truth and you wont look such a silly person. The Scottish National Party has absolutely never demonstrated anything other than being firm supporters of the Democratic System. Brown broke his parties promis to the electorate, by going back on his parties commitment to give the British People a Vote on the EU Constitution. He continues to stay in office even though he is despised by the People of the three nations. He was never democratically Voted For By The People. He is a fascist nutcase that is entirely responsible for the bad governance of the financial system that has led to this tradgedy. He stole Peoples Pensions and now because of his mismangement the fiasco on the Stock Market will have wiped out the rest. Exactly what have you unionists got to say to the Scots without pensions that they paid into for many years.

Now while you numpties are on this forum. Please explain to the Scottish People where the money from this baleout money is coming from. Please include the National Debt, not borrowings. Please explain the Borrowings?.

Please explain to the Scottish People how countries that are in as much debt as the Three Nations are get out of it, when the largest share of their income comes from a financial system that is not trading, and according to analysts will not be for at least the next six months to a year?.

I dont expect an answer from you Numpties because you really dont have the intestinal fortitude to actually blame your london masters.
62

P Rayner.,

Great Britain 08/10/2008 16:13:18
Oh and by the way, more than kilts, haggis and the saltire is needed as the basis for independence from the British state. Not withstanding those fools who contribute to these pages there is NO CHANCE of independence, no matter how much referenda, simply because most Scots, by far, don't want it.
63

tommytommy,

08/10/2008 16:19:48
65
Alan

I am saying that Capitalism is Universal be it under laissez faire or command economies.

In todays world where we are economically interdependent economic recessions hit everyone irrespective of their ideology.

It must be evident to any objective person that every country in the world is feeling the impact of this recession.

Its not down to having the "right" people in charge and all will be well because the recession will impact irrespective of who is in charge.

Nationalist Governments cant escape the real world and people like 54 are politically naive if they believe that they can.
64

P Rayner.,

Great Britain. 08/10/2008 16:22:49
An' annuvver thing; its Scots, in London, at the head of a BRITISH government calling the tune, not the insignificant Salmond and his team. The recent, relative success, of the SNP is due entirely to unhappiness with Labour. This won't last. In due course the Westminster parties, including Labour, will be resurgent in Scotland and SNP will fade into the ether.
65

A Better Way,

Scottish Republic 08/10/2008 16:24:46
P Rayner of Great Britain,

I assume you are a little bitter twisted little man/woman or in betweeny, when you mentioned Alex Salmonds Weight or eating habits. Perhaps you are in fact one of those people who are having problems with your weight. Personally I am six plus and slim. Being an adult and a real man, I do not insult people who are not the same as me. I live my life with some honour and feel good about me and my Nation of Scotlands People.

Why dont you try that yourself laddie. I suppose you are the type who hide in the corner sqeaking away, or hang around bigger guys because you live in fear, that you are incapable of looking after you and yours.

Go to your nearest hospital and ask the if they can give to you a spine transplant. The one you have right now doesnt work laddie.
66

tommytommy,

08/10/2008 16:30:22
68

I havent said anything in support of anyone.

I am simply pointing out that a Nationalist
Govt.cant stop an economic recession or claim responsibility for an economic boom.

Boom and slump is the normal behaviour of Capitalism.

Nothing personal mate.
67

BIG EYE,

Paisley 08/10/2008 16:35:54
Despite the bluster of the Unionits who seem to delight in talking Scotland down perhaps one of this merry bunch whose confidence in the Union seems to have reached unprecented levels, despite the UK being virtually alone in already being in recession might like to explain to the uncommitted reader why they are desperate not to put this confidence to the test in a referendum on Independence.

According to them Independence is dead, personally myself I am convinced this will prove to be yet another nail in the Union coffin.

I am happy for this to be put to the people to decide. Why aren't the unionists?
68

A Better Way,

Scottish Republic 08/10/2008 16:50:19
Tommy you state he obvious, every person and P Rayner know how the Global System works. That is exactly why we know that Scotland, Poland, Ukraine etc etc can be RELATIVELY SUCCESSFUL in the World.

What this RECESSION has shown is that Britain isnt Working (Maggie Thatchers Battlecry). The Capitalist System of a Global Economy, only works IF Governments run their countries properly, with regulations that ensure best practice in their stewardship of ALL Companies and their Managers.

It was the Westmonsters Resonsability to ensure they did their job properly, which is why Gordon Brown should take full responsability for his criminal actions. Westmonster and Gordon Brown/Tony Blair should be held accountable in just the same way as a corporation Boss does when they stuff up. Brown should serve a jail sentence for stupidity and vanity.

Scotland should leave the sick dying UK, and set up a Republic that only participates in he EU, on matters that suit Scotland.

The one thing that will never happen in Scotland, is that we will give up our sovereignty to the EU. If Alex Salmond or any other politician did do that, then I would fear for their long term well being. Scotlands People have had a gutfull of politicians that tinker with our heritage.
69

tommytommy,

08/10/2008 16:55:21
74 Why expend all that energy to get a change of master?

Its a bit like the Christians being taken to the lions.

"No not a lion please.Burn me alive. Chop me up and feed me to the dogs.But not the lions please"
70

The Man Who Knows,

Republic of Perth 08/10/2008 16:57:02
I'll sleep a lot easier tonight knowing that Alex Salmond has welcomed the rescue package.
71

P Rayner.,

Great Britain. 08/10/2008 17:02:40
A BETTER WAY. What a strange post! It is a matter of supreme indifference to me what you assume for I have no intention of describing myself to you, unlike your describing what you evidently see in yourself. I leave it to you to think about your self praise.
72

Rufus T. Firefly,

08/10/2008 17:21:56
Alistair Darling and Gordon Brown must be delighted that Salmond (The Ben Bernanke of Scotland)has welcomed the package.

Their decisions have now been totally vindicated.
73

Stuntman Mike,

08/10/2008 17:30:38
Maybe now the bankers will return the compliment and say how much they'd welcome Supernat's separation policy.

#6 JoeMiddleton:

"Independent Ireland has already guaranteed the deposits in their banks. Scotland is as capable as any other country of running our own affairs whether there is a financial crisis or not."

But Ireland's such a wee country that many aren't convinced it really has the capacity to guarantee all deposits in its banks. I know Nats love to refer to the "Scottish cringe", but a separatist Scotland would look just as ridiculous in such a situation. Am I right or am I right!
74

Rufus T. Firefly,

08/10/2008 17:32:36
A lot of posters on here are deluding themselves re: Scottish Independence. It is as far away as ever.

Our economy is going to be more intertwined than ever with the English economy. Two of our biggest companies are going to be in hock to the Bank of England for many years to come.

Indeed, both of these companies can thank their continued existence to the Union.

Otherwise RBS and HBOS would have ended up like the Icelandic banks, and Scotland's economy would have been decimated, with the only people working being those in the public sector.

Oh and by the way, Oil is heading towards $50 a barrel.

Independence is further away now than it has ever been.
75

Mr. Lachie Todd,

Edinburgh 08/10/2008 17:34:57
Since the end of the Second World War, the United Kingdom has been in unremitting economic, military and political decline.

Todays events are just further evidence of the instability of this unitary state.

Last week, it was learned that the Royal Navy has insufficient warships to protect a shrinking fleet, and is short of 4,000 personnel? Indeed, according to 'Jane's Fighting Ships', the Royal Navy now has the smallest fleet of vessels in modern day history! The reason: the U.K. state cannot afford it.

The present government has led the UK into an illegal war in Iraq and, under pressure from the United States,
as a junior partner and U.S. satellite state, has joined a so-called coalition of military forces in Afghanistan which the head of the UK Army has stated is in all probability an unwinnable conflict! The servicemen fighting in these conflicts are ill-equipped
because of constraints placed on the U.K. Defence Budget.

According to 'Jane's Defence Weekly' the U.K. has also been in long term negotiations with the U.S. Department of Defense to purchase 'second hand' nuclear weapons to replace its clapped out Trident nuclear submarines because it cannot afford new multi-billion
WMD!

The longer this unitary state stretches the bounds of credibility the old saying "furcoat and nae drawers" springs to mind!




76

guenevere,

08/10/2008 17:39:56
You're right,Stuntman,salmond's been mouthing off as usual,but his credibility's zero since he blamed everyone but the bank itself for the end of HBOS,just because it was scottish so could do no wrong to someone like him. Noone listens to a junior oil economist anyway,it must be embarassing for him to be compared to Vince Cable who had a decent job as chief economist as Shell,nuff said LMAO
77

The Master,

08/10/2008 17:48:32
Alex's just out to stir when he calls for a greater protection for UK deposits: he must know that Darling's effectively guaranteed these anyway with his pledge that he will always step in to safeguard the interests of depositors in the way he did with NR, B & B and of course Alex's cherished HBOS.

All I can say is: thank the heavens someone who has seriously convinced himself of the merits of a Scottish separation policy will never be given his way by the Scottish people! Would any non Nat really trust this man in an economic crisis?
78

Suomi,

Salo,Finland 08/10/2008 17:49:17
The banking crisis is not an argument for bigger countries,or for Scotland to forget about independance.The problems appear to have been caused by irresponsible lending by some banks.Interestingly,banks in the USA and the UK appear to have a leading role in causing the current panic in the financial world.

In Scotland,the Clydesdale bank has never given 100% mortgages,never mind 125%.hey seem to be more stable than other banks in Scotland and England.In Finland,where I currently live the banks seem stable.As a senior member of the Nordea Bank put it,"Finnish Banks have more inside,than outside"

If anything,the current financial crisis is an argument in favour of independance,since it would allow a competetant Scottish government to act quickly to global events.
79

P Rayner.,

Great Britain. 08/10/2008 17:54:39
According to radio discussion this morning Irelands and Germanys guarantee of funding is unlikely to be met since neither country effectively has its own central bank, being members of the eurozone.
80

Rufus T. Firefly,

08/10/2008 17:58:04
Looks like Finland is the new Norway!

Anyway, what happened to Salmond's 'Celtic Lion'? It has all gone quiet on that front. Is that because the Irish economy is down the tubes?

And what about Salmond's Arc of prosperity?

Remember this?

"SNP Leader Alex Salmond has today called for Scotland to join northern Europe's arc of prosperity, with Ireland to the west, Iceland to the north and Norway to the east all small independent countries in the top six richest nations in the world. In comparison, the UK is 14th and devolved Scotland 18th ­ with similar, oil rich Norway over £12,000 per person better off."

HA HA it has all gone quiet on that front.

The ARC of prosperity only has one point on it, and thats Norway.

NOT MUCH OF AN ARC EH ALEX?

81

P Rayner.,

Great Britain. 08/10/2008 18:06:30
Mr Todd. Obviously Britain has declined in many areas, but not in others. But for a tiny island such as ours to have retained so much power and wealth is a testament to its endurance which ill behoves you to denigrate. Throughout its rich history there have been many periods of military decline, particularly that of the Royal Navy, followed by resurgence. Sadly in this time of ever more complex and expensive military requirements, of air power etc, the Royal Navy no longer enjoys the importance of the past, except in its nuclear fleet. It is not true the Navy intends to purchase second hand equipment from the US.
82

Rodster,

Glasgow 08/10/2008 18:22:14
There is another difference , alex Salmond is a staesman enough to congratulate the British government on these measures .
when have you ever heard such statesmanship form any unionist .
they could not even pick up the phone and congratulate our First minister after the magnificent victory in May 2007.
Alex Salmond showing his class yet again , and Labour will never learn or be able to show such magnificent behaviour .
83

guenevere,

08/10/2008 18:29:26
89.The trouble is,salmond's never done anything worth congratulating,except very narrowly win the election on protest vote's,then rely on labour's unpopularity to make everyone ingnore his broken promises,too many to begin to mention here.

Anyway,cameron congratulated him and we all know he'll work better with his fellow son of thatcher than with Brown LOL
84

Rodster,

Glasgow 08/10/2008 19:18:10
90 in true Scottish tongue " you give me the dry boak"
if Alex Salmond and the Scottish government suggested healthy diet and excercise for the nation a Labour troll like you would still try and bad mouth it .
There is none so blind as those that will not see.