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Police chief dismisses call to jail anyone carrying a knife

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Published Date: 28 May 2009
SCOTLAND'S top police officer has dismissed calls for mandatory prison sentences for carrying knives as a "headline-grabbing" move that would not tackle the country's lethal blades culture.
Stephen House, chief constable of Strathclyde Police, warned that locking up everyone carrying a bladed weapon would only create a "law of exception" and said the problem of knife crime needed to be dealt with in an "intelligent way".

His comment
s put him firmly at odds with the Conservatives and Labour, who are both calling for mandatory jail sentences for anyone who illegally carries or uses a knife.

The scale of knife crime in Scotland was yesterday highlighted once again by new figures which show stab victims are being admitted to hospital at the rate of more than three a day.

But Mr House, whose force has to deal with the vast majority of Scotland's knife attacks, this week cast doubt on the wisdom of a blanket policy of jailing knife-carriers.

"This weekend we've had three homicides and 40-odd serious assaults. Knives will figure heavily in all of those," he told the Scottish Parliament's justice committee, which is examining the Criminal Justice and Licensing Bill, which has provisions to lock up fewer offenders.

He said: "Possession of knives and use of knives is an issue – we need to deal with it sensitively and intelligently and not in a dramatic headline-grabbing way that sounds like the obvious answer to it.

"To put down in law that everybody should in the first instance is simply opening ourselves up to the law of exception. There will be exception after exception coming forward."

He later told The Scotsman a young boy who carries a knife "because of peer pressure or fear" needs to be educated about the consequences of knife crime, not locked up. "However, a second offence should probably be met with a jail term," he said.

Bill Aitken, the committee's convener and Tory justice spokesman, said the new figures on knife-related hospital admissions represented a "shocking tip of the iceberg". He added: "We need to send a message loud and clear – go out with a knife and you'll be going inside."

However, the SNP last night claimed the Tories' stance was "all over the place", after leading QC Paul McBride, who recently defected from Labour to the Tories, said there should only be a "presumption" in favour of jail sentences for knife-carriers.

Stewart Maxwell, a Nationalist justice committee member, said: "The Scottish Government is already taking the tough action needed on those who carry and use knives by doing more than ever before. Jail terms for knife carrying have already increased by a third and courts have been given powers recently to impose four-year sentences just for carrying a knife."





The full article contains 472 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

 
1

Fifi la Bonbon,

28/05/2009 00:32:25
Mr House should get a job with Lothian and Borders police. Then we will be able to say "The Leith Police Dismisseth Us" in the context of the headline to this story.

Seriously, it is always interesting to hear the point of view of the uniformed services in matters of public debate. But just because a cop doesn't like a law that politicians propose doesn't mean the idea is bad. I mean the police van that drove ahead of me today was easily doing forty in a thirty zone. Doesn't mean the police driver was right, does it? She was just breaking the law. Something that cops do all the time.

If you get caught carrying a knife, you should expect to get the jail. Even if you're a "young boy" and even if some senior cop doesn't like the idea.
2

,

28/05/2009 03:46:36
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
3

W Smith,

Middle East 28/05/2009 03:48:00
BTW
MacAskill has become a one man arguement for the Union!
4

Ursus arctos horribilis,

28/05/2009 04:56:38
Just how out of touch with public opinion is this guy?

Let's be frank the Scottish police don't want to know about real crime as it takes them out of their "comfort" zone-ie dealing with speeding offences. Most police are overpaid glorified traffic wardens-and even any who do have the right idea are hampered by our gutless pinko politicians who are more concerned with 1) rehabilitating the crims rather than actually punishing miscreants and 2) safeguarding civil liberties at all costs.

There should be automatic flogging for anyone caught carrying a knife and re-introduction of the death penalty as a priority ASAP. Some kind of boot camps/national service for the army of NEETS might help to instill some discipline. Moreover we need to recognise that the welfare system in the UK should be scrapped or significantly overhauled as it is a big part of the problem and perpetuates the scum underclass that is destroying our society.
5

Jason,

Japan 28/05/2009 06:42:13
A bad blow for Swiss Army knife sales. Try preparing the ends of electrical cables with anything other than a knife. Cold PVC insulation tends to grab the blade, so a locking blade prevents the sharp edge folding on your knuckles. A knife can be a tool or a weapon, so electricians and chefs will become endangered species. Glad I live in law-abiding Japan rather than UK, where slammer beckons if your toolbox contains a pocketknife. Why only the other week I spotted a Samurai sword in my local re-cycle shop, but £25.00 seemed a little expensive for a wall decoration. You guys will be reduced to chopsticks before you’re much older. How do you feel about chisels?
6

Prester John,

Pots_n_Pans 28/05/2009 07:02:03
I come from a generation where a folding pocket knife was carried by most boys and - yes - a fair proportion of girls. None of us ever thought of them as weapons. They were - and are - remarkably versatile tools. This is, of course, why they developed.

I believe there is a grey area in law about them if their blades are less than 3.5 inches as there is about multitools which have blades as part of their kit.

Anyone who thinks that people should be locked up for carrying knives of that type needs to get out a lot more. We had perfectly adequate laws extant which dealt with the inappropriate use of knives. Enforcing them would actually have been the correct response.
7

Prester John,

Pots_n_Pans 28/05/2009 07:07:14
It seems ludicrous to me that I can walk around France and Germany and many other countries with knives in my pocket as a sensible law-abiding person but not in Scotland. (Obviously, I would not normally be carrying knives but a multitool or a folding penknife.)

The point about a blade which has a locking spring to prevent you from injury is well made (#5).

However, I can walk around in Scotland with one knife with impunity - the sgian dubh tucked into a sock whilst wearing the kilt. So if that's legal, so should the knives I've described above. End of story.
8

Prester John,

Pots_n_Pans 28/05/2009 07:50:42
I have long held to the belief that "Ban it" is the bleat of the bigot and a substitute for rational thought. In fact there are three further points :

1. The actions of a minority should not be used as a reason to curtail the actions of a sane and sensible majority.

2. Banning things often leads to them being glamorised and turned into 'must-haves'.

3. I have just spent a few minutes thinking and looking at various items. I can lay my hands on no less than seventeen items in common usage (and which would not excite even the most febrile policeman) and everyone is actually lethal if used with than intent. Are we going to ban pens with a diameter of less than a certain number of millimetres for example ?
9

Prester John,

28/05/2009 07:51:55
"and everyone is actually lethal"

should be

and every one is actually lethal

10

Prester John,

Pots_n_Pans 28/05/2009 07:53:42
"everyone is actually lethal if used with than intent."

Oh dear, oh dear.

Should be

every one is actually lethal if used with that intent.
11

Kenny A,

28/05/2009 08:49:46
Now for the no knives brigade what about people who need them work, tradesmen, farmers, gardners and fishermen for example, What about anglers and other sports that require a knife. What about people who live in the country and often need a knife for daily use. An easy example if you find an animal trapped in wire or vegation what do you do cut it free or let suffer a painful death. Even if you called the animal help they would then probably be jailed for using a knife to free it.

Locking up probably half the population is a bit extreme I would think.

I however do think people carrying knives for no reason should be delt with and people with a history of violence face the slammer.

Bit of common sense required on this issue. It seems politicians have yet again demonstrated just how moronic some policies are.
12

Curious Yellow,

Edinburgh 28/05/2009 09:47:22
I think the offence is actually possession of a knife (or other instrument) without reasonable excuse, so all this claptrap about tradesmen, farmers, gardeners, fishermen etc is just that - claptrap. However, if the statutory defence fails, then possession SHOULD lead to jail. I'm afraid all the education in the world won't make a blind bit of difference to some of these people, but if you lock them up, and keep locking them up, the message will eventually filter through.

That's education.
13

Prester John,

Pots_n_Pans 28/05/2009 12:09:42
It was only last year that a fisherman was taken to court for having a knife with - wait for it - a ONE-INCH blade. The case was thrown out. This suggests, however, that the law is not as clear as #12 would have us believe.
14

Prester John,

Pots_n_Pans 28/05/2009 12:19:41
The law, prior to the latest nonsense from the numptocracy, was actually quite common-sense. Penknives with short blades were more or less exempt from any regulation UNLESS actually being used as a weapon. Other knives were subject to the principle of the butcher's knife : carried by a butcher within hours where it could be reasonably inferred that it was being carried to or from work and for working purposes - no problem. Found, even on a butcher, at an ungodly hour, then charges would be brought. Equally, any knife being used as a weapon resulted in charges being brought.

My understanding is that, when Glasgow was affected by the razor gangs, razors were never banned but their use was 'rewarded' by serious punishment. That's is as it should be.
15

Finbarr Saunders,

28/05/2009 21:37:46
#7 - Prester John - "End of story."

If only ...
16

Bobh,

St Augustine, Florida, USA 30/05/2009 05:36:03
I've carried a pocket knife without fail every day for 58 years, since I was 8 years old. Never once has a knife jumped from my pocket and stabbed anyone.
Your problems are due to barbarians running loose, not from responsible citizens with knives.

 

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