Help Sitemap Home Skip Navigation Contact Us Disability Statement


Home reports are 'like a new poll tax'

Premium Article !

Your account has been frozen. For your available options click the below button.

Options

Premium Article !

To read this article in full you must have registered and have a Premium Content Subscription with the The Scotsman site.

Subscribe

Registered Article !

To read this article in full you must be registered with the site.

Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image
Click on thumbnail to view image

Published Date: 01 December 2008
HOME Reports, which are being introduced for every house sale in Scotland from today, will become as hated as the poll tax, lawyers warned last night.
Anyone putting their house on the market north of the Border must now have a home report, including a survey, costing between £350 and £820.

Critics have warned that the change will depress the already fragile Scottish housing market still further and could bring it to a virtual standstill.

Ian Ferguson, of the Scottish Law Agents Society, said: "I predict that home report costs will become as despised as the poll tax.

"Today is Black Monday. It's the birth of Home Reports but, quite possibly, the death of the Scottish property market."

Ian Smart, vice-president of the Law Society of Scotland, said the real problem was the seller's survey.

He said: "To introduce the seller's survey in the current climate is a policy initiative that makes the poll tax sound like a great idea. It cannot make things better, and I suspect it will make things significantly worse."

The Scottish Government has argued the new reports – which include a survey, an energy report and a property questionnaire – will ensure those buying a house have the best possible information. A spokeswoman said claims they would damage the property market were "scaremongering and irresponsible".

Ministers have the support of consumer organisations, which have argued for more choice and information for buyers. But there are increasing fears among estate agents, solicitors and surveyors that such a major change – which could have been accommodated in more prosperous times – will cause the Scottish housing market to collapse.

They fear it will erode confidence still further and burden sellers with extra costs they will be reluctant to take on.

There are still major questions over the report's acceptance by lenders. The Woolwich, which is Barclays' mortgage arm, has said Home Reports are not a reliable indicator of value in a fluctuating market. Other lenders are waiting to see how the new system works in practice before taking a definite decision on the reports.

Mr Ferguson said the Scottish Government had dismissed its calls for the scheme to be postponed for two years and rejected a plea for the scheme to be voluntary rather than compulsory.

He said: "We learned only last week that the Scottish Government does not even have all the major lenders on board to back the scheme. That should have been secured from the outset. To have gone ahead without this was breathtakingly irresponsible.

"What is despicable is the government has broken promises to the public on its website that purchasers could rely on the Home Reports and would not need their own report. Sellers were also told they would pay once only for the sale and not for their new purchase.

"They also now accept that the reports will become dated and will need refreshed, but it is not reflected on their website.

"Those promises are now worthless. By any standard, this is a failure of government."

The Conservatives also called for the introduction of the reports to be postponed.

David McLetchie, the Scots Tories' chief whip and a qualified solicitor, said: "It is all too evident that Home Reports are a disaster waiting to hit the Scottish housing market.

"We have continually warned that our already fragile property market would be further damaged by their introduction."

But the Scottish Government spokeswoman said: "It is essential that those buying a house – one of the most important decisions that people will ever make – receive the best information possible. The home report will provide buyers and sellers with this information.

"The Scottish Government has considered carefully the representations for delay from the legal profession, against the strong representations from other professions and consumer interests to implement Home Reports on 1 December."

She went on: "The view of the Council of Mortgage Lenders, representatives of the Law Society, the National Association of Estate Agents and the Royal Institution of Chartered Surveyors – which we share – is that the home report will have a neutral effect on the housing market, and claims to the contrary are both scaremongering and irresponsible.

"A significant problem in the housing market at the moment is the relative lack of first-time buyers, and this measure will help hard-pressed first-time buyers by cutting the costs of bidding for a house. As nine out of ten sellers are also buyers, they will benefit too."

Martyn Evans, of the Scottish Consumer Council, said there was a strong case for the introduction of Home Reports.

He said: "Home Reports is not a legal question – it is about buyers and sellers. The question is whether the reports are there to improve that process, and of course they will. It will give more information, and benefit buyers, sellers and the market.

"The connection to the recession would be much more plausible if Home Reports were not opposed during the boom years, yet they were.

"Home Reports are an unremarkable, consumer-focused introduction into the housing market."

Will the new Home Reports make Scottish property deals fairer or deepen the slump?

SCOTLAND has grabbed a once-in-a-generation opportunity to put consumers, rather than the house buying and selling industry, at the centre of the process in Scotland.

At present, nine in ten buyers obtain only the cheapest basic valuation survey – so most Scots make their biggest purchase with very little information. Sadly, it is not uncommon for people to spend thousands in their first few months in a new home putting right problems a valuation survey didn't uncover.

Home Reports offer a more detailed survey giving information on a property's condition, accessibility and value. There will also be a report with recommendations on how to improve the building's energy efficiency and cut bills. A property questionnaire will give practical information such as parking arrangements, factoring and alterations. As the Home Report is commissioned by the seller, first-time buyers will pay nothing. As most sellers also buy, they pay only once.

We are convinced buyers will quickly understand their value, and not having one may place sellers at a disadvantage. They mean people who put a home on the market have something to prove it is worth buying.

• Sarah O'Neill is Principal Policy Advocate, Consumer Focus Scotland


Information packs may cost sellers a packet


THE Home Report pack, which buyers should receive within nine days of asking for one, will need to include three documents:

• Single survey – this is an assessment by a chartered surveyor or another approved provider of the valuation and condition of the property.

• Energy report – this gives the property an energy efficiency rating and provides advice on improving energy efficiency. This should also be provided by a chartered surveyor or another provider approved by Scottish ministers. The energy reports will be a requirement from 4 January for all property sales across the European Union, although ministers have admitted there are still questions over the enforcement of this new regulation.

• Property questionnaire – this is to be completed by the seller and will contain information on the house such as alterations, factoring costs and council tax banding.

There are no concrete prices, but, as a guide, reports for properties of around £170,000 are likely to cost between £500 and £700, paid for by the sellers, with reports for properties from £500,000 upwards costing up to £820.

Some properties are exempt, including new homes, properties awaiting demolition and seasonal accommodation.

Your questions answered on the new packs that will change the way we buy and sell our homes

What are home reports?

They are information packs that will have to be provided by the seller of any house in Scotland that goes on the market for the first time from today. The pack will have to include a single survey, an energy report and a property questionnaire giving information on the property. They will cost anything from £350 to £820 depending on the size of the house.

Do they have a shelf life?

Ministers are working on the forecast that home reports will have to be renewed, in part, every three months. But they have insisted this will only involve a revised valuation and an update of any changes, not a new full report.

Why are they being brought in now?

Home reports were first suggested by the former Labour/Lib Dem Scottish Executive and carried forward by the current SNP administration. The European Commission has set a deadline of 4 January for all countries to introduce energy reports for all property sales. As this was coming in, Scottish ministers felt this was the best time to bring in the full home report, including the energy reports.

What are the home reports designed to achieve?

The initial aim was to save house buyers from having to invest in commissioning multiple surveys on properties that they lost through the bidding process.

Their backers also claim the reports will give buyers much more information on properties and so help the market become more transparent and workable.

The inclusion of the energy report is also intended to help improve energy efficiency, with buyers able to see easily which properties are more environmentally friendly and which will cost less to heat.

Will they have any effect on the way we buy and sell houses?

Yes, experts have forecast that the Scottish "offers over" system will now fade away, to be replaced with something closer to the English 'offers around' system.

This will be because the home reports will include a valuation submitted by the seller's surveyor.

It is more likely that potential buyers will offer less than this valuation, rather than more.

The practice of sellers putting their houses on the market with an unrealistically low upset price, in the hope of starting a bidding war, will probably disappear.

Who is in favour of the home report system?

Consumer groups such as Which? and Consumer Focus Scotland have backed the move. Labour and the Liberal Democrats were the first to adopt the new system when in government, and the SNP has taken it forward as well.

Who is against the home report system?

A large number of solicitors and estate agents and surveyors outside the Scottish Parliament, as well as the Scottish Conservatives inside the Scottish Parliament.

What are their concerns?

They believe that the home reports are unnecessary and expensive. They have warned that the reports will not do away with multiple surveys, because buyers are likely to commission their own surveys rather than take one for granted that is provided by a seller.

Also, they warn that the new system will place an added financial burden on the housing market, just when it is going through its worst period for decades.

The fear is that this new change could bring the market to a standstill.

Is there any chance of the Scottish Government changing its mind?

No, by the time you read this, home reports will be part of the home buying system in Scotland.




The full article contains 1851 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

 
1

Brian the Barbarian.,

the slums 01/12/2008 00:09:08
More unnecessary bumph at an enormous cost to all of us.

All you had to do was make an offer subject to survey.

Who are the pinhead politicians behind this nonsense?

2

Conan the Librarian™,

01/12/2008 00:11:25
Lawyers.

They make all the money.
3

Fifi la Bonbon,

01/12/2008 00:17:54
Oh no! Lawyers think this is a bad idea!

I think it's excellent, but then I'm not a lawyer or a buy-to-let landlord trying to cash out. Though it would have been a good idea for the Parliament to legislate to force lenders to accept the deal as sufficient to enable a mortgage loan to be made. The fact that lenders can apparently still insist on a separate valuation survey is a big mistake.

Anyway - the prediction is welcome that this will see the end of "offers above" whereby a flat formerly worth £150k is advertised at offers over £120k and some desperate numpty offers £170k will be over.

Actually, they're over now, as vendors still expect £170k and buyers can't get finance for that price, but vendors are too greedy to accept that the flat is now only worth £100k.

A system which says honestly that the flat is worth £100k, but it needs £10k of work done, will not kill off the market. It will maybe bring some realism. Which is probably bad news for lawyers and their greedy clients who can't accept that the market is benefiting from a much-needed correction, but good news for everyone else.
4

Ewan C,

Edinburgh 01/12/2008 00:27:09
It's only ever the lawyers and surveyors you hear complaining about this - not the buyers! Having paid for a number of surveys for flat's I didn't get (including paying £100 for the surveyor to simply print out another copy of a survey already done for someone else) I think this is an excellent idea.

When the market is at its busiest you can't simply offer 'subject to survey' because you are competing with people who have had a survey done, and whose offer is therefore more attractive to the seller. And how do you know what you can bid until your had a valuation? I always doubted the valuations anyway - when making an offer on a fixed price flat, or for a remortgage, they seemed miraculously to always confirm the amount you needed them to!

These home buyers reports are long overdue, even if it does dent the surveyors' gravy train (although if they are charging £500 for this, instead of £100 or so for a valuation report, it would seem they are getting their money anyway!)
5

,

01/12/2008 00:28:51
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
6

Maisie from Morningside,

01/12/2008 00:30:59
So the scottish exec thinks that a bank or building society is going to approve a substantial mortgage based on a valuation made on behalf of the SELLER.

I don't think so.
7

Wardog™,

01/12/2008 00:31:50


Good move, long overdue.

8

Conan the Librarian™,

01/12/2008 00:33:48
7
Good Morning Aberdeenshire Scot.
9

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 01/12/2008 00:34:25


Its a big,...'diddums sticks'!

A measly few hundred pounds, after one makes ten of thousands of pounds profit!

My heart really bleeds!,.....'NOT'!

Plus the fact, why should one 'Buy a Pig, in a Poke'?

Protection is needed when you are speding Sooo much money. we dont want a,....

.........'House that Jack Built'!







10

Conan the Librarian™,

01/12/2008 00:37:09
9
Ah, a troll.

How amusing.

To yourself.

11

Conan the Librarian™,

01/12/2008 00:41:57
11
Charles, when you were a harmless poster, worried about your young(sonsy) wife and her tribulations; we were all for you.

Start posting political and you are fair game.

Slaphead.
12

whatisthis,

01/12/2008 00:42:01
What if you just refused to provide one? Would you go to prison? What would they do to you for daring to offer your house for sale without providing one in the specified 9 days?

OK - you might say, 'Well you wouldn't get any offers then'. Fair enough!

But what if you had a very desirable property, the kind that always generates a lot of interest?

Do you seriously think buyers would think, 'Oh well, we'll just not consider that one then - even though it is desperately gorgeous and just what we've been looking for and they don't come up very often'.
13

Conan the Librarian™,

01/12/2008 00:43:14
13
Hoos poos...if you.
14

,

01/12/2008 01:07:40
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
15

Edward,

01/12/2008 01:08:47
Hate to rain on Hamish's parade
BUT It was the previous Labour Libdem Administration that started this 'new' system. In reality its a copy of the one Labour introduced in England, to supposedly speed up house sales but didnt
16

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 01/12/2008 01:13:40


For Gods Sake!

I have just been, locked out the Zoo!


17

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 01/12/2008 01:15:35



The "Bear" needs a Home, NO "HOME Reports" required!


18

notime4anovice,

glasgow 01/12/2008 01:18:33
#15 Whatisthis

Failure to provide a Home Report results in a fine of £500 under the Housing ( Scotland ) Act 2006.
This will be enforced by Trading Standards.
Might be worth taking the risk if the reports get expensive. Say for a larger house. The fine would then be less than the cost of the report
19

Conan the Librarian™,

01/12/2008 01:19:56
Aw Charles, how can I get annoyed at you...

If I were your english teacher I suppose.

Comma, ellipsis, apostrophe, tilde...

%Charles%--- £is£ *King.*
20

Champion Haggis Slayer of Fife,

01/12/2008 01:21:59
With all this huffing and puffing from the lawyers and surveyors confirms that this is going to reduce the amount of money they can fleece from you.

To liken it to the Poll Tax is gross exaggeration. The Poll tax affected every adult in Scotland over the age of 18 irrespective of one's ability to pay. This is hardly the same thing.

Its a great idea, from a responsible "in touch" Government and the masses applaud such iniative. To the retractors, tough luck, you have lost your cash cow.
21

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 01/12/2008 01:29:52
Structural defects do not manifest themselves overnight and are not part of the valuation process, per se.

Charles and his structural problems are becoming like repeats of soap operas.

Estate agents and quantity surveyors want multiple valuations of the same property.

Work it out for yourself.

Charles, please start keeping your personal life to yourself.
22

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 01/12/2008 01:44:16


Jock Tamson~24,

"Charles and his structural problems are becoming like repeats of soap operas"

The 'scroll' button is in the centre of your mouse.






23

viking nz,

new zealand 01/12/2008 03:59:39
Over here the old gov wanted an energy report , so when you were looking at the house it told you if it was insulated , doubled gazed etc , now this lot say its not required , meanwhile children and older people suffer colds dragging on for months hospital , doctors visits , days off work through dampness , costing millions .
24

Navvy,

01/12/2008 04:17:38
This is an EU directive. Where are all the SNP supporters of an independent Scotland being part of the EU. You can't be an EU mamber without enacting EU directives. Ha-Ha

The Netherlands, England and the rest are ahead of the game and have these systems in place. They are part of the greening of Europe, energy conservation and openness and yes they have a shelf life and yes they cost money
25

Navvy,

01/12/2008 04:22:03
The much maligned poll tax was badly introcuced but no bad in concept.

We achieved "no taxation without representation" long ago. The poll tax was, in part, intended to right the equally iniquitous "no representation without taxation" which is rife in our country.

Just why should people who pay no tax decide how much to tax those of us who do pay?
26

,

01/12/2008 06:21:26
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
27

,

01/12/2008 06:25:30
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
28

yockel,

01/12/2008 06:46:06
Hey Fifi 3#, it's no skin off the lawyers' nose, its you the punter that is going to have to pay. Sell you house before the bank call up the loan? Na, cant afford it, you're stuffed.
More NuBlab policy enforced by the SNP and no doubt more to come.
Ewan 4#, how many houses do you buy a week? That's why its lawyers and surveyors who complain because they can see the problems unlike our infalable masters.
This is another in a long stream of idiotic nonsense to come out of Holyroood yet. An other pile of legislative junk produced solely for the purpose of keeping the law commission occupied while pretending Holyrood is doing constructive.
Get a grip Holyrood, stop tinkering with irrellevancies and learn to govern!
If this is EU driven, come clean and admit you are powerless.
29

yockel,

01/12/2008 06:47:23
Dyslexia Lure KO
30

nabodican,

Rural Scotland 01/12/2008 06:48:47
Home reports are governance where no governance is required and an insult to poll tax.
If I were selling a house I would simply add the cost of the home report to the asking price. A house is still worth what people are prepared to pay and in sought after areas they will always command a higher than valuation price.
If I were buying a house I certainly would not put much faith in a report paid for by the seller, after all, who pays the piper calls the tune.
Then we have the lagal situation if something in the home report is wrong, is the seller liable or the Scottish Government who are the instigators of these reports.
Is there anything to stop someone selling privately ?

The whole scheme is simply unnecessary and I hope doomed to failure.
31

Thomas1,

// 01/12/2008 06:56:36
When Hamish was a laddie he and his friends would sit around the camp fire and Hamish would tell scary stories.
32

,

01/12/2008 07:35:30
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
33

,

01/12/2008 07:47:42
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
34

scottishcoffindodgerno1,

Tram City 01/12/2008 07:52:21
15# what part of (you cannot sell your house untill a report has been done)do you not understand.
35

,

01/12/2008 07:58:04
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
36

Unimpressed one,

01/12/2008 08:01:54
Green lunacy forced on us by the European super-government, enacted on by a supine Scottish Executive. Independence but part of the EU? You must be joking Salmond. We can't control house sales, fishing policy, competitive tendering. The list goes on. If the Nats can extricate us from the EU then they will have our eternal praise votes in droves. Unless or until then, they will be the puppet of the European dictatorship.
37

cabrach loon,

inverness 01/12/2008 08:08:49
the timing could not be worse and why not make it optional to start with and see how it goes, maybe if it makes a house easier to sell it ewill be accepted but the waythings are the UK is FINE country / far far worse than Singapore could ever be!
38

Duncan in Edinburgh,

01/12/2008 08:18:11
Anything that provokes such a storm from the vested interests must be a good thing. Ever since the surveyors and lawyers started bad-mouthing the scheme I have been convinced of its worth. Well done the SNP for following through on this having been given the opportunity to drop it.
39

Tomdonald,

01/12/2008 08:33:09
Yes. Most people know a builders' workman to have a look. Most houseowners keep bills and would discuss their nature in so far as they might affect a survey. The hidden auction of the "offer system" is the trouble in Scotland. If people don't have enough common sense to run their own affairs they should not be buying a house
40

,

01/12/2008 08:38:41
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
41

Duncan in Edinburgh,

01/12/2008 08:40:20
#44 I sense a great deal of anger in you. And stupidity, ignorance, unfulfilled yearning, arrogance, selfishness, regret and envy. But let's focus on the anger for now - what is its source? You can tell us, we're all here to help.
42

Duncan in Edinburgh,

01/12/2008 08:42:09
#46 Suchaparcel, you see everything as being anti-SNP. These same vested interests were anti-Labour when the policy was introduced by them. You need to get over this victim mentality. I happen to agree with the SNP on this - why not build bridges instead of shouting "s'no fair" at every opportunity?
43

yockel,

01/12/2008 08:45:03
The price of houses with good reports will go up, so more money for the lawyers, which is good for them.
There is already a new Home Pack industry in place to skin off a margin and milk the punter as of today, which is what they deserve.
The price of bad houses will fall allowing poor folk to buy houses which they can't afford to fix.
The houses with poor reports will deteriorate and become shanties allowing homeless folk to aquire them which will be hailed as a great Socialist redistibution of wealth.

None of this will happen of course because according to our masters everyone who puts thier house on the market will on recieving their report rush around and at vast expense fix all the defects. They will then have to get an updated report to correct what then becomes miss-statements in the first report. Aye right.
Or is it intended to make this compulsory also?
44

Duncan in Edinburgh,

01/12/2008 08:47:15
#49 Or perhaps, just perhaps, people will fix the defects they are aware of before commissioning the report and putting their home up for sale, in order to maximise their profits from the sale. Which will drive up the quality of the housing stock.
45

Webbie,

mullingar 01/12/2008 08:53:33
Tomorrows headline "Vampires complain about sunlight".
Lawyers will complain about anything which seems to raise any costs but their own. As these surveys are legal and independent then they as acceptable to lenders as the current/previously used system BUT by shouting about it some buyers will ask for their own survey, which the lawyer will arrange, and ad extra expence to their purchase.
Why do we need vampires...lawyers every step of the way, if I agree to sell a house to someone at an agreed price then all we should need is a notiary and not full lawyers fees.
I feel my blood draining at typing the word lawyer so much.
46

yockel,

01/12/2008 08:54:33
#50 That will speed up the selling process.
47

paulr,

edinburgh 01/12/2008 09:07:28
Who is doing all the shouting about this?
Surveyors
------ 5, 10 maybe 12 surveys on a property, lost fees.

Estate agents
------- COMMISION COMMISION COMMISION

Building societies
----- their pet surveyors lose out
------ COMMISION COMMISION COMMISION

Lawyers
------ COMMISION COMMISION COMMISION
48

thistle do,

here n' there 01/12/2008 09:17:06
#54 Spot on Paulr. Where's the problem? Only a smaller trough for the lawyers and surveyors snouts to get into. A seller's report done by a profesional surveyor of integrity should be enough. This is just another step to bringing some archaic pratices into the real world.
49

Duncan in Edinburgh,

01/12/2008 09:18:55
#52 If that is seriously the downside of this then I hardly think it's a deal-breaker. Selling is currently taking months anyway.
50

Brian Ferrari,

01/12/2008 09:24:53
Sooooo uninformed comments above.

If a lawyer has to commission a Home Report, this gives the lawyer/estate agent an opportunity to charge an extra fee, right? After all it is work they would not otherwise have to do. So they are quite entitled to raise their fees

And, at the moment a lot of property is not selling, and the surveyor therefore does not get any fee.

Now the surveyor gets an enhanced fee for every property that is put on the market, whether or not it sells.

Bear in mind oh witless masses, that legislation such as this invariable results in an increase in costs.
51

Calum10,

01/12/2008 09:26:03
Anything that upsets the lawyers is worth doing.

At last we have a process that knocks some sense into the housing market.
52

Brian Ferrari,

01/12/2008 09:29:00
This will have an upside for sellers though, as first time buyers will get more information and may tempt them back to the market.

And fewer people will put their properties on the market speculatively and so that will constrain supply giving more of a balance to the market.
53

Offcumden,

Yorkshire 01/12/2008 09:30:39
We've had home reports, which seem to be the same as in Scotland WITHOUT the survey, for more than a year. Like many people, my house has been on the market for most of 2008. We have probably had twenty viewings. Not one has asked to see the Home Report, which is really a useless collection of energy information. Are people going to be put off a house because it doesn't have the latest skin cancer inducing energy saving lightbulbs? Does the vendor need to spend £350 for the purchaser to discover if there is loft insulation? All the purchaser needs to do is look at the latest utility bills. And what about the energy wasted and CO2 created in producing the useless Home Report? Typical Labour party - it sounds good in theory but is rubbish in practice.
54

yockel,

01/12/2008 09:31:01
When will the ejits realise the only vested interest here is with the organisations set up to pedal the Home Buyer Packs and the information freaks who will trawl the web for the reports. In the case of Glasgow this is the Lawyers themselves.
There will be little change for surveyors who will be offered work in the same manner as before and will be paid MORE because of the nature of the survey. As stated above they will also be paid whether the house sells or not. They will be paid even if the house never goes on the market.
It will now be much easier for lawyers to arrange a survey, press a few buttons on-line and commiserate with the seller about the cost.
It is pointless legislation, which will put seller's personal details on-line rendering them vulnerable to all sorts of abuse, spam building contractor offers being the least of it.
No doubt the council snoops who already masquerade as potential tenants to spy on potential landlords will find a reason to drive around posing as prospective purchasers.
It just another part of the growing nosey parker culture the ejits are sleepwalking into. Shooting the messenger isn't going to make things better.
55

Alan B,

01/12/2008 09:37:27
#Duncan

A serious argument against this type of proposal is that if it takes say 6months to sell the property the valuation part of the survey become outdated and will require a new survey for purposes of the lender. (many surveys at the moment are valuation only).

I think the current arrangements of buying and selling property were very poor. However I think this has not neceesarily sorted out the problems.

The biggest problem for me is the closed bid system. Why? What is the advantage? Something nearer the english system minus the gazzumping.

From personal exerience the worst aspect of buying a house was arranging the mortgage. You cannot have a confirmed mortgage agreement in place for a property before you have a property offer accepted. This results in getting an over the phone agreement in principle which is fine. But then it donkeys for the mortgage lender to confirm agreement of the mortgage. About 6 weeks. Largely because they did not botther doing anyting for most of this time. We really need guidelines that mortgage lenders will give a yes or no within 10days.

In my case after having waited for so long you were being put under pressure from my own lawyer to sign the deal but was not wanting to do so until written agreement from the bank.

The whole thing decended into farse when after receiving written approval of the mortgage and then signing the appropriated docs to buy the house the mortgage lender then decided they did not do the mortgage they had sold me. This then went back and forward for a week with one person saying they did and then another in the same company saying they did not.

If i had moved to another mortgage lender at that point i would have had to take bridging loans to cover the fact it would take the 2nd lender another 4-6 weeks to get written approval.

In the end after going up the mgt chain the first mortgage lender decided they sold a sufficient close mortgage to what i had initially been offerred but with
56

Alan B,

01/12/2008 09:41:27
The other problem with home reports is this is not just changing the way surveys work but also other things like energy info. It is better to change the survey in isolation rather than bringing other things to the change which can ruin a reasonable idea.
57

Alan B,

01/12/2008 09:42:11
should have been:

Something nearer the english system minus the gazzumping would have been better.
58

Queen D,

Glasgow 01/12/2008 09:43:24
Good morning Yorkshire and thanks for the information.
Do you mean that the home packs south of the border are useless and the ones North of the border seem like a good idea to stop Lawyers and surveyors from making loads of money out of the buyers?
59

Alan B,

01/12/2008 09:43:46
cont from 62:

In the end after going up the mgt chain the first mortgage lender decided they sold a sufficient close mortgage to what i had initially been offerred but with a different name and we agreed on that.

The other problem i noticed in the one and only time i bought was the fact that surveys were not really worth the paper they were written on despite supposedly being the more indepth level 2 survey. The survey was scant with so many get outs that made it irrelevent and virtually worthless. It was only by getting a separate roofing report suggested by someone else that you got a more accurate idea of the work needing done on the house.

So my view of these changes is they do not fundamentally deal with the 3 main problem areas of buying and selling a house.


60

Stan Butler,

01/12/2008 09:46:25

A number of posters seem to think that surveyors are opposed to this scheme. They are not, and for good reason. It looks like lenders aren't going to accept the valuations provided by a surveyor paid by a seller. Lenders will be asking for their own valuations. More work for surveyors. Nice.
61

yockel,

01/12/2008 09:48:12
#66 Alan B your point about surveys being usless is absolutely spot on. In the past your lawyer might have had a chat with your surveyor and got some background information for you. Not now, because the surveyor is working for the seller and the seller probably has no idea who the surveyor was because all he did was go on line and press the button saying "SurveyMe."
62

cataibh,

Over the Struie 01/12/2008 09:57:42
1# Who makes the offer -aye lawers.If you want a good reason for something always look who is against it.

63

Alan B,

01/12/2008 09:58:00
#yockel

When i bought it was the old system. But the survey was so full of get out clauses that it was useless. The surveyor does not go up to the roof to inspect it but looks at the roof from the garden. And does not go under the house either. From what i have heard they just say they cannot get access and that is it.

We really need not matter where or when the survey is done that the surveyor has to write a proper report in which there is not get out clauses and there will be come back if they are wrong. They are the professionals after all.

After alreally having got the level 2 suvery i was told by a tradesman that you were better getting a valudation survey and roofing report and some other report as the level 2 survey was effectively a waste of time.
64

Alan B,

01/12/2008 10:03:39
apologies for the typos
65

yockel,

01/12/2008 10:06:03
#70 Alan B, agree again, your tradesman was absolutely right. In the future though you are never going to find out that the surveyor did not get access to the roof. In what is now the past a verbal report following a simple valuation would be laced with the same caveats and warnings to be found in your scheme2 plus possibly a few off the record expressions of doubt which added up to a true valuation not a mechanistic goverenment imposed form full of boxes to tick.
66

yockel,

01/12/2008 10:06:52
Thanks Alan there is no need to apologise for my typos ;->
67

carrottop,

Dumfries 01/12/2008 10:15:07

Bottom line is if you were a home buyer would you trust it, the fee is paid for by the home owner so to gain custom the producer of the report must favour the owner as they have to offer something to beat off the competition.

Still money for the boys though and the old boys (masons, lawyers etc) that run third world Scotland will look after themselves no matter what. If ever a profession was ripe for computerisation it is the law profession but ask yourself why this is not happening.
68

A Crofter,

Western Isles 01/12/2008 10:20:08
The big problem is that most surveyors are utterly incompetent - I wouldn't believe a word written by any of them.

Ditto for lawyers and estate agents.
69

Ron S,

Edinburgh 01/12/2008 10:24:17
#74
..."to gain custom the producer of the report must favour the owner"...
Not true. The Scottish Government dictates the purchase of the report and Trading Standards enforce it. The owner has no choice at all.
70

wilfredthehairy,

The Scottish Asylum 01/12/2008 10:27:28
So, surveyors think it's a good idea. I wonder why? I have moved nine times now. When I bought I asked to see the utility bills, the roof report and the factoring charges. It cost me nothing and the seller nothing! When I thought there might be structural issues, I asked for a full survey. And I will in future. Would YOU believe a survey commissioned by the seller? Nanny state rules. Politicians fiddle while Rome burns. Pass the bottle.

ps I'll give it 6 months. Any advance?
71

yockel,

01/12/2008 10:37:44
#76 Ron S, Not true.
There are competing organisations offering reports and a seller could still go direct to his pet surveyor and have his report uploaded to the system.
Glad to have your confirmation though that the cooncil will "enforce" it.
That is a surprise!
72

scots-r-tops,

Boness 01/12/2008 10:42:51
I just had my energy report carried out.
I think it's costing £50 but the surveyor was unable to tell me how much it was.
The expert said my report had to be in place for 1st december, but as I read the law mine is not required till 4 January, since my house is already on the market.
I tried asking the expert what the purpose of the report was but he didnt seem inclined to say, all he said was it would benefit me. I cant see how.
He claimed to be a building expert, but when he asked when my extension was put up, when I don't have an extension, I did begin to wonder.
He made no comment about my house other than to say I didnt have any energy saving light bulbs, so presumably that will appear in the report. Now as my house has been for sale since July and I've not had a single enquiry, I am not expecting anyone to look at my house or this report for quite some time. So if I change a few things after reading the report, such as fit these magic bulbs, can I get the report updated to reflect the changes.
Frankly I see it as a scam, a cash cow for supposed experts, to state the obvious and get paid for it.
The report is meaningless.
73

puskas,

East kilbride 01/12/2008 10:50:46
Well I'm pretty confident some of the posters have had similar experience to myself. Both sides of the coin.

During a good spell in the sellers market I was lucky to have had many offers.
I became fed up with the same surveyors arriving at my door supposingly doing another survey for another interesting buyer.
A walk in and out within minutes on each occasion.
Each survey had the same characteristics with minimal alteration. This became obvious due to potential buyers return visits and contact by telephone.

Money for duplication.

Now as I said these were in the better times for the seller. 21 seperate offers arrived at my lawyer.

8 surveyors reports from the same company ( although only 3 named surveyors ). Another 3 same company plus a few others with duplication. Info came from potential buyers who were indeed shocked.

Now this was many years ago and the fees at the time ranged from £150-£220. These fees were for a basic survey / valuation that was suitable/acceptable for banks and building societies.

As the seller, and in a wonderful position, I and my family found ourselves in a system that was rotten to the core.

Duplication with lawyers also unknown to their clients.

" HOMEPACK "
Yes hopefully with the homepack much of the gravy train will come to an end. Probably a little fine tuning to combat the professionals who will attempt ways to profiteer using small print.

Back to the previous. Eventually when deciding who to sell my home to (not the highest bidder) I was in need of a full time secretary with telephone calls from many of the other potential buyers who had been disappointed.
Ladies in tears accusing myself of letting them down and selling to another. Gentlemen/husbands with tempers inflamed at the cost of these surveyors reports. Indeed many had failed to purchase a suitable house on many occasions after paying for surveyors valuation reports. Some out thousands of pounds.

Due to many of th
74

Ron S,

Edinburgh 01/12/2008 10:52:21
#78 yockel
In practice you go to your lawyer, sadly more recently estate agent, and they sort out the sale including the information pack.
My recent experience of home info. pack (in England) suggested it is a total waste of money. What's more you can't send it back (because of major errors in it) if it is no good. You don't pay the Estate Agent, you pay directly to the 'Surveyor'.
75

puskas,

East kilbride 01/12/2008 10:54:22
Cont.


Ladies in tears accusing myself of letting them down and selling to another. Gentlemen/husbands with tempers inflamed at the cost of these surveyors reports. Indeed many had failed to purchase a suitable house on many occasions after paying for surveyors valuation reports. Some out thousands of pounds.

Due to many of the potential buyers now getting back to myself the info became very accurate regards the duplication of lawyers/surveyors who had been involved.
It is said often about MP's and the trough, gravy train etc. include the spivs in the housing market.

If the homepack has the effect I believe it will have the only winners in the long run/term will be both the buyer and the seller.

The only concern I have if I am correct is the going out of date homepack. This I'm sure will be fine tuned if it is seen to be abused by the professional spivs.

I shall not bother working out the total expenditure / outlay by the potential buyers of my home I will leave that to others. Remember these were basic surveys that were acceptable to the lender not complete surveys..

76

yockel,

01/12/2008 10:54:30
The bottom line is why should government in any shape or form be interfering in how we the public choose to buy and sell our houses. It is none of their business.
There was no law saying it had to be done the way it was and there is no need nor justification for a law to impose a new practice.
The old system developed as it was the best in the prevailing circumstances. Circumstances may have changed suggesting a change in the system was in order. If so, buyers and sellers were free to negotiate their own change. Now they are bound by a law imposed by the state who will be too busy with more important maters when time proves the need for further change.
Rules rarely work.
77

Phil C,

01/12/2008 11:02:28
Like most things dreamed up by Labour and the EU, this is unnecessary, expensive and beureaucratic. Yes it's important to improve energy efficiency, but the rest is guff. An energy report could have been tagged onto the seller's schedule and a buyer will usually want their own survey done anyway, and these were often shared, even if lawyers didn't pass on the benefits!

The SNP should have ditched this immediately along with those flamin' trams. Two mistakes they have made, aided and abetted by the majority opposition.

I don't think Information Packs will damage the market though. Brown and his chums are already doing that.

When all is said and done, a house is worth what sellers and buyers agree to, so 'offers over' 'offers around' or 'fixed price' tags are meaningless. We should tighten up on concluding sales very quickly though, so that we don't drift into the dishonest English system involving changes of mind, gazumping, gazundering etc. It's already creeping in here.
78

Tukhachevsky,

01/12/2008 11:11:58
Surely the cost of the reports are simply added on tothe asking price of the property?

Instead of Estate Agents and Lawyers making loads from surveys this seems in tehory a really good idea. One report for anyone interested in to view.
79

puskas,

East kilbride 01/12/2008 11:12:28
No81 Ron.
Hi,

My interpretation is that in any homepack that is flawed their will be a means to either sue or non-payment of the fees attributed to you the seller.
Surveyors will be liable.
In the past unless you payed for a full survey and not for just valuation the surveyor was not liable to pay damages. That will not be the case now with a homepack.

The cost of a full survey could be at least 3 times more than a valuation. Lenders were only interested in valuation.

I certainly would not comment on any if that is the case differencial with England
80

puskas,

East kilbride 01/12/2008 11:17:06
No 84 yocket
Hi,

The old system was legislative. Did the government get involved. ?

You said that its none of government business. ?

Their you go.
81

cataibh,

Over the Struie 01/12/2008 11:19:55
#70 Alan B Spot on. I understand that if a seller produces a report that is not accurate and true as presented the seller can be prosecuted.
82

puskas,

East kilbride 01/12/2008 11:22:36
No85 Phil C

Hi,

Flaming trams again ?.

Had the Liebour, Tories, Libdums not have anything to do with that.?

A new progressive SNP Government would have been seen to be undemocratic.




83

Stan Butler,

01/12/2008 11:34:18


The commercial reality is that most seller's packs will be instructed by estate agents on behalf of sellers. The estate agents will have their own tame surveyors who will be grateful for the instruction. The estate agent will suggest a valuation to the surveyor. I doubt many surveyors will stray too far from the figure suggested by the estate agent. You don't want to kill the goose that lays golden eggs.
84

cbrammeld,

Fife 01/12/2008 11:36:41
When ever I purchased a property, I stipulate the price subject to a satisafactory survey. This offer is only open for 24hours then it is withdrawn. No cost to me or the seller. Then once or if we agree the survey goes ahead and missive completed ASAP. No long dragged out visits from surveyors and time wasters. The seller has the deal done and dusted in a few days and the purchaser has had no cost until they agree a deal with the seller.
This stops multiple bids and auctions so the seller may get a reduced price but a firm sale.
Most surveyors ask their client 'how much do you want to pay' or 'how much do you want for your property' No scientific formula, just a rough estimate at what the property may be worth at that date and time.
85

ddmc,

01/12/2008 11:44:54
ROFLMAO , biggest opponents seem to be solicitors, surveyers & estate agents, wonder why ?
86

yockel,

01/12/2008 11:49:46
Puskas., what are you smoking?

91# Stan How true. There is even a question on the online instruction form "Asking Price?"

Strange question for a survey that has to be done before the property goes on the market.

92# cbrammeld, yes and the surveyors answer usually is "OK, I could support it at that."
87

Morry,

Hebrides 01/12/2008 11:52:54
I read the first paragraph, that was enough.
I think these home reports are a good thing and the only true people upset by them are the rogue landlords and landowners wishing to sell or rent a pig in a poke, them and their agents, whose desks are full of paper mountains.

These reports safeguard those who are buying or selling,that can only be good for them.

The lawyers are getting their money regardless,
at least "they" can be thankful that their "industry" will never die out.
88

Stan Butler,

01/12/2008 11:57:50

#93

Please pay attention.

Surveyors are in favour.

89

notime4anovice,

glasgow 01/12/2008 11:57:52
#92

I also used to put in an offer 'subject to survey' and just walked away if the seller wasn't interested. This was after paying for numerous surveys at £200 a pop.
The problem with the Home Reports is that this will no longer be practical.
If a seller has a valuation backed up by legislation then your offer will probably have to be equal to or more than their own valuation or they will refuse to sell. With a diving propert market it looks like the Home Reports will be the coup de grace to the twitching corpse of the Scottish Housing market.
90

yockel,

01/12/2008 11:59:23
#96 Buckpool Loon, and the law in England is ......?
91

Stan Butler,

01/12/2008 12:33:43
#100 lawyers don't share surveys, it's surveyors who do/did that.

Surveyors are in favour of this new scheme.

Go figure.

92

ddmc,

01/12/2008 13:02:47
#97 & #101

I realise it's stupid to belive the hootsmon but it does state quite clearly in the article

"Who is against the home report system?

A large number of solicitors and estate agents and surveyors outside the Scottish Parliament, as well as the Scottish Conservatives inside the Scottish Parliament."

A google search on "surveyors in favour of home reports" only gave me this snippit from Hansaard last year "The Royal Institution of Chartered Surveyors was originally in favour, but now regards the pack as poorly conceived and has launched a judicial review"

So go figure & pay attention !
93

English flag,

01/12/2008 13:04:17
England and Wales has had these for some time,about time Scotland had a dose of it.
94

morris,

Edinburgh 01/12/2008 13:12:58
It was interesting that the TV news a couple of days ago sounded out the "man in the street" and both buyer and seller alike seemed to be happy enough,although a few people is hardly a test of public opinion.
I can see only good coming from this as far as Joe Public is concerned ,and where the idea that it compares to the Poll Tax comes from,I would love someone to explain if they can!
So far I have seen only people who are broadly welcoming this,and the few who have voiced objection cannot explain why, or choose not to do so?
If some do not like it the parliament must be doing something right would be my first response!

The majority clearly DO LIKE IT!
95

Displaced Scot,

UK 01/12/2008 13:14:34
They have brought this into England already, but the reports are generally ignored by the buyers, as the lenders reguire a proper survey to be done anyway. I believe the fine for not doing one is £200 less than the cost of a report.
All you have to do in England is commission a report, it does not need to be completed before the house is sold.
I looked at training to be a Home Inspector earlier in the year, it was going to cost £7000, and I was advised by those I know in the trade not waste my money. Labour are not going to be the next Government, and the Tory's have promised to do away with the reports, along with ID cards and the ban on hunting south of the border.
96

Corstorphinery,

Edinburgh 01/12/2008 13:15:06
Ian Ferguson quotes - 'quite possibly the death of the Scottish housing market'.

A touch of hyperbole there, no? What is someone in his position doing coming out with this guff? The more I hear lawyers protest about home reports, the more I am convinced it's a good thing.

97

nostress,

grangemouth 01/12/2008 13:16:32
Let's see...who's against this? Ah lawyers, estate agents and Tories. Must be a good thing then.
98

,

01/12/2008 13:19:19
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
99

The Federalist (the poster formerly know as NAUON),

01/12/2008 13:22:54
#64 Alan B

"Something nearer the english system minus the gazzumping would have been better."

I have to agree. Both systems have their weaknesses. Perhaps we should consider having the strengths of both combined?

The "Offers Over" system is so open to abuse - many a valaution has been done just to get the mortgage on an over-inflated property price. I don't go and buy a car, a pint of milk or a loaf of bread with "offer over" on it - why should buying a house be any different?

Also with the Home Reports buyers at least have an idea of the property's value instead of resorting to guess work - and they can still get their own valuation as before if they don't trust it. That being said - we still have the problem that many surveyors just give clients a copy of a valuation report that another client has asked for.
100

puskas,

East kilbride 01/12/2008 13:24:03
The buyer can still agree to accept a lower bid from a customer...The Homepack is a guide to both on asking price. Yes and a potential buyer may wish to bid higher.. Their you go..
Any devious surveyor report is liable by law.

It amazes me that some abhour any change in past practices.

BTW..... The photograph in the Scotsman's heading is an utter disgrace...
101

puskas,

East kilbride 01/12/2008 13:28:06
Hi Yockel,

I try to be nice.

Maybe you should read some of the pro-submissions from other posters..

Their you go.............Have a nice day.
102

Busymale,

In the Chief Execs office 01/12/2008 13:32:06
Due to recent economic circumstances the loss of income for the ESPC can partly be made up through this new pig in the poke.

Home Reports milking the Solicitors? Oh, I thought thats what they were doing to pay for the movemachine project! Blind leading the blind.
103

Sumlogic,

01/12/2008 13:35:19
When we are talking about the largest most significant purchase an average person makes in their lifetime, why not offer added protection.

I imagine its only a matter of time before some Estate agents add this into their service package and offer some sort of finance deal on the initial cost to be repaid with commission after sale completion.

I agree that the old system of having in many cases numerous identical surveys done on the same property, often simply charging a lump some for a reprint of an earlier survey was a real con.

Same though that lenders are not legally obliged to accept these reports as I can imagine in many cases buyer and seller now shelling out for a survey.
104

La5t_minit,

01/12/2008 13:39:34
One report paid for by the seller, cost added to the sale price. Great idea. Interested buyers dont have to fork out for valuations etc before they make offers and dont loose money if they dont get the property. sounds fair.

Unless your an estate agent or solicitor who regulary ripped people off when the old system meant buyers paid for valuations. One property, one valuation, clean, simple and stuffs the solicitors into the bargain.... Bonus..
105

Scunner,

Aberdeen 01/12/2008 13:46:00
It should put an end to the crazy situation where people have to bid thousands over the valuation to secure a property. Of course lawyers won't like it. Lower selling prices means lower estate agency fees.

It can only be a good thing for buyers IMO.
106

yockel,

01/12/2008 13:48:49
You're still not getting it.
The "Pro Posters" argument seems to be that if lawyers don't want it, it must be good. The average lawyer couldn't give a monkey's about this.

There was no financial advantage to lawyers under the old system. Buyers will now have to pay to access the Home Buyers report, in addition to the seller having paid for it and they will almost certainly have to get their own valuation anyway.

The issue is that yesterday you could buy or sell a house anyway you wanted without fear of the government looking over you shoulder, other than to collect stamp duty, together with the extensive data now required on the stamp duty form whether any is due or not, get paid to search public records, demand a fee to record you title, charge you vat on your bill and have your Bank, lawyer and accountant report you for money laundering just to cover their backs in addition to storing your personal details so their controlling bodies and the police can inspect it at will.

Otherwise the process was essentially a matter of agreement between private individuals and subject to civil law.

As of today you are forced to conduct the sale in a manner prescribed by government and failure to comply with whatever diktat may be handed down is a criminal offence.

Your selling will be subject to official scrutiny and coercion should some plastic badge wearing numpty not like the look of your face. Home reports will no doubt in future be referenced to assess your council tax.

Rest assured the scheme will not stay as it is but will grow arms and legs in order to justify the existence of the local authority departments which will be set up to ensure compliance and generally interfere in the process. Just as it has with Landlord Registration, the Charities Regulator and the Public Guardian. You might never buy or sell a house, give or receive Charity or go ga ga but in time you will sure pay for this unnecessary bureaucracy in increased taxation. They have not j
107

yockel,

01/12/2008 13:51:03
cont :-

They have not just passed a law they have created a new role for government.

This just another piece of nanny knows, Nuliebor fascism, heartily endorsed by the Socialist National Party. What next, must you have an privatised organ harvesting card to open a bank account? If this is the free Scotland you want you are welcome to it.
108

The Federalist (the poster formerly know as NAUON),

01/12/2008 13:56:36
#118 Don't mince your words yockel - tell us what you really think . . . .
109

notime4anovice,

glasgow 01/12/2008 14:04:53
#118
Yes good post yockel. The reports will create more jobsworths with associated pensions etc. Plus the government can sell your info and the police can use it at will.
110

Brian Ferrari,

01/12/2008 14:11:41
It all goes to show how empty the promises of the SNP were.

They said smaller government. We got bigger government.

They said bonfire of the quangos. We got more quangos.

They said an end to sealth taxes. This is one more stealth tax.
111

Hugh Roscombe,

01/12/2008 14:21:24
121

Hogwash.
112

Stan Butler,

01/12/2008 14:24:57

#103

The RICS in SCOTLAND are in favour of this scheme.

I think you'll find the article you found on google refers to England.
113

Brian Ferrari,

01/12/2008 14:29:46
122

Sheepdip
114

agent,

edinburgh 01/12/2008 15:36:15
123

I recently attended a seminar hosted by one of the Home Report providers. In attendance was the Chief Exec of the RICS. He informed us that the RICS had been lobbying AGAINST the home reports for nearly two years but now had to accept that the Scottish Exec were bringing them in regardless. Although I am an estate agent - and will doubtless be ridiculed - for what its worth, the main problem with the Home Reports are that we will end up with more surveys being carried out. If we kept to the "Subject to Survey" offer system then at least you know what YOUR surveyor thinks the house is worth rather than trusting the vendors survey.
115

Hugh Roscombe,

01/12/2008 15:40:22
124

LOL
116

,

01/12/2008 15:42:57
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
117

Alan B,

01/12/2008 16:03:01
#agent

I can see problems with the new proposals. But the current system is a mess.

- blind bid is a joke
- quality of level 2 surveys are a joke
- multiple surveys pre bid is a joke
- offer to subject to survey is a joke as it then opens up the whole blind bid to renegotion and uk lenders (dominated by english lending practices) take so long to approve in writing mortgages it is almost unworkable.

118

agent,

Edinburgh 01/12/2008 16:14:58
128 Alan B

- Dont blind bid. In the current market there are plenty of fixed price or guide price properties.
- I agree. Up to the purchaser to not pay unless they are staisfied with the quality of the report.
- Agreed. Subject to survey is the solution
- Not true. As an agent, I give the buyers 24 housrs to get the survey done and another 24 hours to let me know of they are going to proceed.
119

Keith Lagden,

01/12/2008 16:22:28
Scotland following the yanks, Be original, if you must.
120

Embra Don,

01/12/2008 16:36:08
Lawyers and estate agents don't like it eh? Wonder why..... I suppose they are worried about their clients. Aye right - that will be a first.
These will be the same people who have been putting properties on the market at "offers over" a price which the vendors will not accept because they expected 25% more - inducing buyers to waste money on multiple "valuations".
About time their cosy little earner was exposed.
121

Embra Don,

01/12/2008 16:40:31
#117 yockel
Yep - you are right - until now houses have been sold the way used cars are by back street dealers.
122

Alan B,

01/12/2008 16:42:21
#agent

I am talking about the system not the fact that the collapse in the housing market has meant there are now fixed prices available. When the housing market gets back to some normality in a few yrs after the recession is behind us then i would expect offers over to return.

"Up to the purchaser to not pay unless they are staisfied with the quality of the report."

That is pretty difficult. Level 2 surveys are generally pretty poor quality. You would end up with surveyors suing you for not paying and going to court if every time they did not match your expectations of what a survey should be you did not pay. You would also never get a house.


re subject to survey: "Not true. As an agent, I give the buyers 24 housrs to get the survey done and another 24 hours to let me know of they are going to proceed."

In my own case both were true.
1)if the survey shows some defect and lets face it there will be issues if the house if not brand new then you could then lower your offer.

In my case i was concerned that the survey did not look at the roof, it basically said they had a cursory look fromt he garden which is rubbish. Someone in the trade told me to get a roofing report. (it was the one and only time i bought so was very green). Fortuately the seller agreed and then the roofing report suggest 10G worth of work and i then lowered the offer accordingly. (this was then accepted).

2)with regard to mortgage approval that is also true. After agreeing to procede the mortage approval took about 6weeks. As such pressure was even being applied on me from my lawyer to sign without written confirmation from the mortage lender. Which is simply daft.

My issues got worse after the mortgage lender after approving in writing that they approved the mortgage then decided they did not sell the mortgage that they had i had agreed to and that went back and forward for a while until resolution with me having to look at bridging loans to go else where for the type
123

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 01/12/2008 16:43:47
Could be fair to do a survey on the living standards of the journalists at the Scotsman, based on their attitudes towards anything to do with housing.

Probably mostly double income households, living in property beyond their means.

This would have the effect of severely affecting any impartiality on articles to do with housing.

From the LIT to the Homepack the self interest ia apparent.
124

Alan B,

01/12/2008 16:44:10
... of mortage i wanted. In the end the mortgage lender decided they sold the package i wanted and agreed to under a different name and it was sufficiently close enough for me to agree to.
125

SandyD,

Edinburgh 01/12/2008 17:28:46
There is so much mistrust of solicitors shown in the comments above. Solicitors are against this solely because of the fact they think it will disadvantage the clients and create a system which will not benefit either seller or purchaser in the long run.

Part of the reason it was introduced was to prevent multiple surveys. In fact there was no problem with multiple surveys in the last few years in Edinburgh and most of the rest of Scotland. The offering subject to survey system prevented the need for more than one survey in all but a very small minority. The new home report system will bring in the problem that it is designed to prevent. Sellers may commission more than one survey to get the best valuation and that will be the published one- as a result as the purchaser will you rely on it? Surveyors valuations can easily vary by 10% or more.

Would you consider testing the market by putting your house on to see if it may sell when you now have to fork out another £700 over and above the previous costs? This will slow down an already faultering market. Prices may well drop further. Yes, maybe that will sound good to a first time buyer, but the sad fact is that the majority of residents in Scotland may lose out, with the double whammy of investments having fallen, an increase in unemployment caused by the financial crisis and all of a sudden the first time buyer is unemployed and having his house repossessed. It is a vicious circle and the timing of it can't be worse for the Scottish economy. The timing of it was the main bone of contention raised by the solicitors, although there is a view that this is a bad law which is fundamentally flawed.

It is a concern that 90% of people rely on a scheme 1 survey if buying a house that is anything other than relatively modern- if you have a decent solicitor they will recommend a scheme 2 report. I know that my solicitor instructs 90% of scheme 2 reports for older houses.

The government will soon be very unpopular on
126

Quark99,

Chandler's Ford 01/12/2008 21:36:30
The survey element of the 'Home Information Pack' has been dropped from the requirement in England. It proved to be worthless with buyers commissioning their own survey despite the seller already having done so. The entire HIP concept is totally flawed and has done absolutely nothing to speed up house purchase time here in the south. By the way, you definitely do not want to move toward the English selling 'method'. It allows a potential buyer to make as many offers as he/she wants with utter impunity. This also leads to 'chain breakage' where a buyer withdraws causing the 'chain' of sales/purchases to collapse leaving all members in the brown stuff. Stick to the 'once an offer has been made and accepted then that's it' approach. It makes for a much clearer and tidier system.

 

Comment on this Story

 

In order to post comments you must Register or Sign In

 
 
 
  

 
 

Featured Advertising



Sister Newspapers:
Press Complaints Commission

This website and its associated newspaper adheres to the Press Complaints Commission’s Code of Practice. If you have a complaint about editorial content which relates to inaccuracy or intrusion, then contact the Editor by clicking here.

If you remain dissatisfied with the response provided then you can contact the PCC by clicking here.