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New headache for Forth Bridge as 2,000 bolts may need replacing



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Published Date: 13 October 2008
NEARLY 2,000 bolts which help hold up the Forth Road Bridge may have to be replaced after several were found to have cracked nuts.
Laboratory tests are being carried out to determine the cause of the problem, which is believed to be a world first on a suspension bridge.

Any repair would add to a growing list of work required on the bridge, which includes installing dry-air blowers in an attempt to halt corrosion of its main cables.

It also comes a week after officials revealed they faced funding problems because the replacement of worn-out carriageway expansion joints will cost £5 million more than expected.

In the latest headache, nine of 1,888 nuts on bolts fixed to the bridge's main cables have been found to be cracked, just ten years into their expected 30-year life span.

The bolts are attached to the top of vertical steel wire hangers, which connect the main cables to the bridge's carriageways.

The cracked nuts are attached to bolts in groups of four to six at the top of the 192 hangers. The four cracked nuts and their bolts found on the west cable have been replaced, while five on the east cable will be changed in the next year. There is no pattern to their location.

Barry Colford, the chief engineer and bridgemaster of the Forth Estuary Transport Authority (Feta), has already stressed that the bridge remains "perfectly safe" despite the problem.

However, he has now told the Feta board: "It may be that we have to replace all the bolts, in a rolling programme over the next years. As far as we know, investigations have shown we are the first (to have encountered this problem]."

Mr Colford said the cracks had been spotted by officials doing routine inspections. He said: "Staff were not looking for cracks in the nuts and had not expected to find them."

Mr Colford said news of the problem had sparked interest from staff of several bridges in the United States, whose bolts are horizontal, like those on the Forth Road Bridge. Those on the Severn and Humber – Britain's other major suspension bridges – are vertical.

Mr Colford said a £25,000 investigation of the problem was underway. It would consider whether more of the 3.5cm-long nuts were likely to crack. Each carries an 80-tonne load and weighs about 8oz (225g).

The bridgemaster said the cost of complete replacement was not yet known, but any work would not disrupt traffic.

Neil Greig, the Scotland director of the Institute of Advanced Motorists' Motoring Trust, said: "It is reassuring to hear the bridge is perfectly safe, but it is always worrying for drivers to hear of yet another new problem. The good news is that this problem has been caught early and can be addressed without causing extra congestion.

"In the long term, we remain most concerned about rust and other deep-seated cable issues."

Mr Colford said the price of the expansion-joint work had increased because the cost of building bespoke ramps to take traffic over the work had been underestimated.

WHAT NEXT

REPLACEMENT of the cracked nuts has delayed other vital repairs on the bridge.

The work – along with wet weather this summer – has put back the installation of air-drying equipment in an attempt to halt corrosion of the main cables. Completion has been put back from October next year until the start of 2010.

However, officials said the project could be speeded up if a second work platform is bought from the Severn Bridge, which has installed similar equipment on part of its cables.

The full article contains 617 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 12 October 2008 9:32 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Forth Bridges
 
1

,

13/10/2008 00:07:07
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
2

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 13/10/2008 00:34:27
If they worked out how much it cost to replace 4 bolts and nuts then they could surely work out how much it will cost to replace the rest?

And this time I wouldn't worry about the 30 year guarantee - the bridge won't last that long.
3

Navvy,

13/10/2008 01:07:09
build an immersed tube tunnel

The Maas tunnel in Rotterdam was opened in 1942 and is still fit for purpose
4

SkeptikScot,

13/10/2008 01:14:06
I've got to say that as headlines go, this was not exactly sexy:

"2,000 bolts may need replacing"

Note the use of the word "may", in case we got too excited.

(thou some might say it was "rivoting", I suppose!)
5

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 13/10/2008 01:16:25
3 Navvy
There are bridges built by the Romans 2000 years ago that are still fit for purpose.
6

SkeptikScot,

13/10/2008 01:17:25
#4 Even more excitement is promised!

"What next? Replacement of cracked nuts."

I can't wait for that story (admittedly it's probably a v painful condition).

7

livilion,

livingston 13/10/2008 01:46:18
5 Ugly George
Aye but were they built by the company that put in the cheapest tender?
8

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 13/10/2008 02:36:08
7 livilion
I don't know about the cheapest but I'm pretty sure that the Romans did have some kind of competition between engineers over whose plan would be used so there could well have been a competitive tender.
9

Slioch,

Scottish Highlands 13/10/2008 07:32:24
Cracked nuts sounds really painful. I'd recommend Paracetamol and a bottle of whisky.
10

Goat Boy,

13/10/2008 08:00:41
The toll money would have been handy. Never mind.
11

Man of Reason,

13/10/2008 08:20:08
Isn't this the same story that was reported by the BBC and every other national newspaper ten days ago?

Come on Scotsman, get with the programme!
12

Heretic_,

13/10/2008 08:24:21
#11 That's exactly what I thought when I read this.

There's even a link on the right hand side of the page to the story that appeared in the Evening News on 2 October!
13

Heretic_,

13/10/2008 08:26:52
Sorry, that link isn't there any more - here it is:

http://news.scotsman.com/forthbridges/Forth-Road-Bridge-inspection-finds.4550486.jp

The Scotsman are clearly doing their bit to save the planet by recycling old news.
14

danielrober,

13/10/2008 08:31:06
Repair and refurbishment are the most sensible options here. If some people are worried about capacity there any number of cost affective solutions for increasing the capacity of the existing bridge, i.e supports, an extra deck on one lane for cars etc (difficult but not impossible).

This is a good bridge and a great national inheritance. We just need to take care of it and not allow penny pinching to let neglect take over.
15

drunken proffet,

Tassy 13/10/2008 08:54:34
I have the same problem with the tin roof on my house, the screws are rusting away. They do not seem to be producing the same quality of screws and nuts and bolts as they did in the old days.
16

fresian,

edinburgh 13/10/2008 09:10:02
Vivas, No 1, The ones from Gordon Brown's neck are no good. The bridge requires high tensile steel.. Brass ones will be too soft.
17

fresian,

edinburgh 13/10/2008 09:11:01
5, Ugly George, There is an aquarium at North Queensferry which is eminently fit for porpoise.
18

Joe,

St. John's Road 13/10/2008 09:23:51
#3.. The SNP don't like tunnels..
I wonder what Freud would analyse?
19

Andrew,

13/10/2008 09:50:15
re title. If the story is about the Forth ROAD Bridge then the title should state the Forth ROAD Bridge and NOT "Forth Bridge".
20

sonofhamish,

edinburgh 13/10/2008 09:54:33
Yeah smart move getting rid of tolls just to appease voters in Fife. No tolls, more cars, more load, more maintenance. It makes no sense that those of us that DONT use the bridge should pay for those that do.
21

Alternative (High-Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 13/10/2008 10:15:23
The removal of the tolls has not resulted in more traffic.

However, I agree with you regarding their removal. If the SNP wanted to stampe their mark on Scotland, they should have done so by scrapping the trams---which is what they originally promised to do.
22

paulmort,

Quezon City 13/10/2008 10:31:27
Well it will create jobs, any of those commenting need a Job. Hard hats and Toe protectors are supplied.
23

AJ Fife,

13/10/2008 10:38:08
The bridge is another example of how Scotland's infrastructure has been run into the ground by successive Labour controlled administrations.

At least the SNP make decisions in Scotland, for Scotland and for the Scottish people. The solutions to all the Labour induced problems, will be among Mr Salmond's greatest achievements.
24

Americanbob,

13/10/2008 10:52:08
Call me an old pedant if you will, but a 3.5cm (1.5 inch) nut seems hardly likely to be able to carry a load of 80 tonnes. Perhaps the bolts to which they are attached may be capable of doing so, in which case why does this story not say so? Who in their right mind would design anything that required a nut to take that much strain.
25

morris,

Edinburgh 13/10/2008 10:54:52
20 Whilst its true that Fife commutes in large numbers over to their employment in the M8 corridor area,there are many people who travel over to FIFE and beyond for a variety of reasons.Rosyth dockyard for a kick off. Fifers pay road tax as does everybody and should not be punished on grounds of topography. I don't drive along your street but I still pay road tax for the privilege of doing so!It makes infinite sense that you should pay.What do you do when you drive north? Go to Kincardine or travel to Perth on the motorway and add miles uneccessarily? Or do you never travel north and if so why?

You shouldnt have to pay for things you dont use, you say. Fair enough,we wont tax your brain then!
26

sicasapig,

tura 13/10/2008 10:57:42
**20** sounds a wee bit selfish i suppose being a tax
payer you would stop people on benefits from crossing
27

daveserviceman,

edinburgh 13/10/2008 11:08:52
With the rise in costs of upkeep and continuing problems and the cost of a second bridge it would be more cost effective to build a tunnel
28

daveserviceman,

edinburgh 13/10/2008 11:14:10
Cracked Nuts The Scottish Parliament is full of Them
Miss graham for a start
29

Alternative (High-Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 13/10/2008 11:44:33
#24:

A nut can be knowne by two common descriptions... The thread within it or a description based upon the hexagon (assuming it is a hexagon) itself.

You generally only use the description of the hexagon if you are talking about tools to move it, otherwise you use the thread description. for instance, an M10 nut has a thread running through it of major diameter 10mm, however, you would generally us a spanner of 19mm to undo it as that is the distance across the flats of the hexagon.

In this case, they are talking about 3.5cm "long" nuts which (surprise, surprise) is a completely meaningless description in any case. I suspect that the 2.5cm to which they refer is actually the major diameter of the thread inside the nut---whcih would easily be able to support 80 tonnes.
30

Alternative (High-Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 13/10/2008 11:45:48
Sorry, meant to say 3.5cm, not 2.5cm.
31

bluehead,

edinburgh 13/10/2008 11:54:40
never mind the two thousand bolts missing for the forth bridge,what about the millions of screws missing from the heads of our hopeless politicians,after listening and watching them,I cannot help but believe that there is much unexplored territory between the ears of some this political pile,that are mismanaging this country
32

danbob,

13/10/2008 12:29:21
So that it's fair for all. Not discounting the fact that Scotland is still part of the UK, and a lot of traffic that originates in England use this very strategic bridge. extra costs of repair should be paid for from central government. Minus the amount of money lost in tolls because of Salmonds silly posturing.
33

Luke Skywalker,

City getting the Trams 13/10/2008 12:53:24
21 Was in Manchester at the week-end. Its trams are superb. Reliable, fast and extremely well used. Effortlessly into the City Centre. Each time I was on one it was packed. Changed my view of the trams
34

G,

dundy 13/10/2008 13:07:38
A good day to bury bad news????
I wonder if the SNP wanted this story hidden behind financial turmoil......
35

123456789,

13/10/2008 13:22:56
no. 20 Yeah smart move getting rid of tolls just to appease voters in Fife

I dont know any fifers who actually bothered with the £1 charge, i know many who are so peeved that the ridiculous bit of road from South Queensferry to the bridge can be classed as a slip road. It causes more traffic to come to a standstill to allow the vehicles to join the mainstream. The Engineer who designed the road layout should be shot! Delays are not much better even though the main line from edinburgh shouldnt need to stop anymore. Ridiculous!
36

danbob,

13/10/2008 13:25:34
33# They are good and well used, You are right. Same in Sheffield as well. Also Sheffield will shortly get the tram trains. Imagine what it could be like Tram trains from Glasgow or Fife, forget getting off a Haymarket for Murryfield. The tram train would leave the rail network and straight to the door. Sometimes I wonder if the moaners on here really know what they are moaning about.
37

cramond1,

Cramond Ferry 13/10/2008 13:59:40
One bridge - with road, rail, and light Fife railway. See the Tsing Ma Bridge (to the airport) in Hong Kong - the world's seventh-longest span suspension bridge.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/43/LAR_ga_map.png

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Tsing_Ma_Bridge_(1).jpg

It looks beautiful, like the Forth Road Bridge. Another idea (for looks) might be a cable-stayed bridge (Severn Crossing and many more) though I don't know if they can take 3 simultaneous forms of transport.

The old Forth (railway) Bridge (keep calm, and don't laugh either) could be used as an exciting extension of a Lothian-Fife cycle route-come-tourist excursion trail, linking up with other local disused railways and country lanes.

So - two bridges - very similar in aspect to today's (with slightly different approaches - with real, proven promise for Scotland's future.
Please think about it.
Cramond
38

cramond1,

River Almond 13/10/2008 14:14:12
One Bridge. By that I mean one NEW one (see above). The old rail bridge which now requires painting every 27 years will remain until it's unsafe I presume.

A tunnel would never have excited me as much as my first crossing of the road bridge. Tunnels are fine in cities (e.g. Hong Kong, Boston) but unaesthetic and always unpleasant for the motorist. I can't see how a 3-in-one bridge such as I propose could cost more than an equivalent tunnel. Modern materials can easily handle a bridge (c.f. Millau - a cable stayed bridge) whereas tunnels are surely always going to be dangerous. Thanks for your patience.
39

Saoghal Beag,

13/10/2008 14:34:39
20 That will be toll roads for all then? If you don't use them you don't pay for them.
40

Farky,

Edinburgh 13/10/2008 14:48:06
Clearly the real cracked nuts are in the Labour party! I guess someone said that already...!
41

Nevsky,

Moscow 13/10/2008 15:39:00
How can a bridge have a headache?
42

Jobs4TheBoyz,

13/10/2008 16:09:21
"... replacement of worn-out carriageway expansion joints will cost £5 million more than expected"

Quite frankly that will be a bargain considering the cost over run of the scottish parliament. What I cannie understand is why on earth it will be 2016 before we can expect the new bridge to be completed.

If we throw in some contingency into that, we should expect actual completion closer to 2020.

The smartest thing to do would be to put the tolls back up on the current bridge, just slightly offset from their old position to avoid any criticism from the nay sayers and charge £50 per crossing for all fifers and free crossings for all english people and edinburgh folk (same difference).

The fifers can use the train to get to their call centre jobs.

43

livilion,

livingston 13/10/2008 16:24:25
#33 Luke Skywalker #36 danbob
from the Times Online:
Trolleybuses which draw power from overhead lines via long poles attached to the roof, are being revived as a cheap alternative to tram networks, which the Government has said are too expensive.

Modern articulated trolleybuses, which operate in dozens of European cities such as Lyons, Milan, Rome and Athens, have either batteries or small diesel engines that enable them to operate under their own power if the lines come down or the route is blocked.

In normal service, they are much quieter than diesel buses and produce no harmful emissions. Trolleybuses also have faster acceleration, going from 0-30mph in 10 seconds compared with 15 seconds for a diesel bus.

Leeds yesterday(June 16, 2007)won funding for a 12.5mile (20km) trolleybus network, including a city centre loop, routes to Headingley and Stourton, and a service to new development in the east of the city.

Other cities, including Sheffield, are also considering trolleybuses after the Department for Transport refused to support new tram lines or extensions to existing lines.

The Yorkshire and Humber Regional Transport Board granted £150 million for the first phase of the Leeds network, which is expected to cost a total of £300million.

The tram scheme that Leeds had originally proposed would have cost around £750 million. “Unlike trams, a trolleybus system does not cost a fortune or take years to install.

“Also, it doesn’t require any major road works or utility re-routing. Add to this the greater acceleration, improved fuel efficiency and reduced maintenance requirements.

“More than 350 cities worldwide already benefit from trackless electric traction.

“Once again the UK finds itself falling behind in the quest for green transport technology.”


44

jerrymanders,

13/10/2008 16:24:32
Is it true that B&Q is on the preferred supplier list? If so they can borrow my discount card and save a bit of money and I get all the points. If not they could always take out a bridging loan.
45

celtic4,

USA 13/10/2008 16:31:54
Is the bridge still usable? Is it safe?
46

livilion,

livingston 13/10/2008 16:38:20
20 sonofhamish
Stationary traffic produces tailbacks across the bridge and increased loading.
Getting rid of the tolls helps keep vehicles moving and so reduces loading and emissions. A modern engine on overrun (no throttle input) uses no fuel at all and so greatly improves air quality over that of queueing/stationary traffic.

The bridge was actually paid for by 1995 from toll money but the government broke its promise to remove the tolls once the bridge had paid for itself. The motoring public subsidises the non-motoring public to the tune of £billions every year through the Road Fund Licence, very little of which goes to fund road maintainance. Road fund, geddit?
47

livilion,

livingston 13/10/2008 16:51:07
#45 celtic4

Notice has been served that at the current rate of deterioration the bridge will be closed to Goods vehicles years before an alternative crossing can be installed.

In fairness we have known about this issue since before Scottish Devolution and before both the Severn and the Golden Gate Bridges were treated, during the time of Margaret Thatcher.

The last Labour First Minister to his credit promised that if his party won last year's Holyrood elections he would have his people talk to the bridge's people and see if they could come to some arrangement to keep vehicles crossing the Firth of Forth, subject to PFI funding being available(nudge wink, elections due, know what I mean guv?) and feasability studies etc being carried out.
48

danielrober,

13/10/2008 17:12:01
# 37 cramond1,Cramond Ferry

Nice idea for a cycle route for the old, railway bridge. Probably ahead of time by at least 50 years, but its a good idea. Old Victorian infrastructure has a lot of life left yet, so long as we can keep up the good ideas following.
49

Hagbard Celine,

Under a cloud 13/10/2008 18:58:07
#46 The road fund licence was abolished in 1936, since when roads have been built and maintained from general taxation. I think you are confusing it with vehicle excise duty, which is no more spent on roads than beer duty is spent on pubs.
50

Central Station,

13/10/2008 20:23:51
Surely the headline should have been: 2000 Bolt Shock!

Missed opportunity I think.
51

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 13/10/2008 23:10:53
Glad I stopped paying for the Erskine Bridge.

52

livilion,

livingston 14/10/2008 00:26:42
49 Hagbard Celine,
No I'm afraid the Road Fund Licence is still alive and well, seven decades after the government realised what a nice little earner it was and robbed it out to pay for more pressing projects like submarines and missiles for the Royal Navy etc.

The Road Fund is no more but the licence remains under any number of guises, in fact the reverse of the tax disk starts off: REFUND OF DUTY This Licence...
Car tax, road tax, off-road tax, tax disk, Vehicle Excise Duty and road fund licence etc are all still in common use and recognised at Swansea DVLA and any post office or local polis nick.

53

livilion,

livingston 14/10/2008 01:01:34
37 cramond1,
Cycling across the old forth Bridge exciting?
I should say so, just be sure to be wearing long trousers and closefitting bicycle clips.

Have you any idea of the effect the breeze at that height above the Forth will have on a bicycle?
To get the idea just cycle along any trunkroad and enjoy the sensations as artic lorries fire past you and catch you in their wake. Then imagine you are hundreds of feet above the Firth.

btw Didn't they close the public walkways and viewing platforms on the Tay Bridge in order to stop jumpers committing suicide from them?
54

cramond1,

Newbridge 14/10/2008 15:10:18
Briefly. The new bridge has to come first. It has to be good - a new icon. The old rail bridge needs to be preserved - though the coastline without it might look nicer!
thin ice (I know). If you move house especially to a smaller one can you keep the old ramblin one. not most people. Though try to keep it in the family...

Meanwhile check this out! Rio Antirio Bridge Gulf of Corinth, Greece! 2004 completed.
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Image:Rio_bridge_-_wave_1.jpg
55

Dragonhead,

Dalian,China 15/10/2008 12:47:55
What a fuss! While you are still discussing it.Here in much maligned China.The whole bridge would have been replaced by now. Forget the snipes about Chinese quality.As for trams, this city of 6million souls, has trams,tram trains,Light rail(elevated)which is rapid, clean, efficient and cheap.Modern buses,clean,and frequent.Taxis in abundance. Tickets can be paid for with cash or using a prepaid Hard thick plastic electronic ticket.The ticket can be used on all forms of transport, including taxis. Isn't it time you lot realized the world is moving on and you are not?

 

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