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Oil: A world on the brink of full-blown crisis, over a commodity drying up day by day



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Published Date: 28 May 2008
FOR some, it is a matter of life and death as the cost of food and heating slips out of reach. For others, it is simply the rising cost of travelling to work or running a business.
But governments around the world can be in no doubt about the anger felt by millions struggling to cope with the knock-on effect of record oil prices.

Gordon Brown yesterday faced protests from his own MPs, as well as hundreds of angry hauliers, about the rising price of food and fuel. In Scotland, fishermen are threatening to blockade Grangemouth, the country's largest container port, in a dramatic escalation of their protest over increases in the cost of diesel.

The problem has forced up ferry fares for islanders and prompted a bus firm in the Borders to pull out of a £1 million deal to provide public services, because it was no longer viable.

In many countries, the global energy crisis has brought lower disposable incomes and more expensive shopping bills. In the snow-covered streets of central Asia, crippling rises in the price of coal, flour and meat are hitting much harder – forcing the poorest families to pick through rubbish tips in order to survive.

With temperatures as low as -30C, the Mongolian capital, Ulan Bator – the world's coldest – has more than 800 families waiting to join a sponsorship programme run by the Christina Noble Children's Foundation (CNCF).

"The poor in Mongolia face a double whammy," the charity's local manager, Eamonn Thornton, said. "If you have a limited income, the choice in winter you face is: do I buy food and freeze, or buy fuel and starve?"

In Indonesia this week, angry students hurled Molotov cocktails at police after the government increased the cost of fuel by nearly 30 per cent. Ministers said they had no choice but to lower subsidies on fuel in order to avoid an economic meltdown – a decision that sparked riots in a country where millions are already feeling the brunt of the rising cost of food.

While experts are undecided on whether this marks a return to the dark days of the 1970s, most agree on one thing: oil prices will continue to rise.

"Fundamentally, there is very little the UK government can do, given that the problem is so global," David Hunter, an energy analyst at McKinnon & Clarke, said. "It has been suggested that the current spot price of crude oil will continue to rise from $135 a barrel to as much as $200. Even if that doesn't happen, we can bet on massive rises in our domestic fuel bills this summer, because the price of gas and electricity is so closely linked to the cost of oil.

"The nervousness over supplies will play havoc with prices that are already at an all-time high due to exorbitant world commodity prices."

He went on: "The government's inability to make long-term energy security decisions over the last decade is coming home to roost. Since the 'dash for gas' in the 1990s, the lack of political will to make tough decisions has left Britain short of power."

Adding to the headache for ministers, steep rises in the cost of public transport come at a time when motorists are being encouraged to abandon their cars in order to meet environmental targets on emissions.

Around the UK, the most vulnerable consumers are being hardest hit.

Councillors yesterday agreed to impose fuel surcharges of 25p per passenger fare on lifeline Orkney Ferries services, while bus passengers face increases after Munro's of Jedburgh quit its public contracts, saying it could no longer afford to provide services. The fuel protests hit hardest in the south of England, where scores of hauliers headed for the centre of London and the steps of Downing Street.

Travelling from many parts of the country, they lined a specially closed section of the A40. Many left their cabs for a rally at Marble Arch before a delegation handed in a letter to No 10, urging the Prime Minister to save the haulage industry by reducing the duty on diesel.

Meanwhile, Ban Ki-moon, the secretary-general of the United Nations, has warned that rises in the cost of living threaten to spark off "social unrest on an unprecedented scale".

The riots in Indonesia, which saw more than 100 protesters arrested as students burned tyres in the streets and threw home-made fire-bombs, were just one sign of how the impact of fuel price rises are spreading.

In France, localised fuel shortages yesterday were prompted by recent blockades of oil terminals by disgruntled fishermen outraged at the price of diesel, while in Germany, households were told to expect gas bill rises of 25 per cent as demand for energy increases.

There were also fears among German car makers, such as Volkswagen, Daimler, BMW and Porsche, that high fuel prices may hit sales of their cars in the United States, which is still the largest importer of German goods.

Even in the oil-rich Middle East, many countries are experiencing double-digit inflation because wealthy governments there are spending their way out of the twin problem of plummeting wages, most of which are paid in weakening US dollars, and a heavy reliance on imported food.

In the US, where three airlines have filed for bankruptcy in as many months and others have cut flights to save fuel, both contenders for the Democratic presidential nomination, Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton, have pledged to renegotiate the North Atlantic Free Trade Agreement in order to protect the weak dollar. Mr Obama even called for trade tariffs on China.

Christine Lagarde, the French finance minister, said: "You know that the world has changed when the British nationalise a bank at huge cost, when investment banks ask us to bring about more regulation… and when the IMF encourages countries to spend more money."

Hauliers issue seven-day ultimatum to Brown – cut fuel duty by 25p or we'll cripple ports and refineries

CABINET ministers last night hinted Gordon Brown was preparing to perform a new U-turn on tax in the face of mounting pressure from his own MPs and hauliers.

Amid angry protests by lorry drivers in London and Wales, the Prime Minister faced calls to reverse plans to raise road tax on the worst-polluting cars from next April, and halt the planned 2p rise on petrol tax due in October.

John Hutton, the Business Secretary, hinted at a U-turn, by comparing how he expected Alistair Darling, the Chancellor, to act on road taxes and how he dealt with the 10p tax row. "The Chancellor is listening to what people are saying about vehicle excise duty, as he has done on a number of occasions recently about tax rises," Mr Hutton said.

Jack Straw, the Justice Secretary, hinted at the possible timing, saying: "If there are going to be decisions about this, they could be announced in the autumn (Pre-Budget] statement."

Mike Greene, the leader of hauliers' protests in Wales, said Mr Brown had seven days to cut fuel duty by between 20p and 25p a litre, or they would blockade refineries and ports.

Peter Carroll, one of the hauliers to deliver a petition calling for a fuel duty rebate to Downing Street, said: "If we don't get a rebate, an industry could be wiped out."

Opposition politicians have warned of a "summer of discontent" if the government presses ahead with both tax hikes.

About 18 million motorists are expected to be hit by the additional road tax of up to £245 a year, which is due to come into effect next April. Although the government claims the move is necessary on environmental grounds, even Greenpeace has dismissed it as counter-productive, as it applies to cars bought in the past.

John Sauven, Greenpeace's executive director, said the policy "gives green taxes a bad name" and high taxes should not be used to penalise people for choices made in the past.

More than 30 Labour MPs have so far have signed a Commons motion urging a rethink on road tax rises, and Mr Darling is due to meet a delegation of MPs next week.

Meanwhile, the SNP is set to bring forward an amendment to the Finance Bill which calls for a fuel duty regulator, where higher oil prices would trigger lower fuel duties, which make up 60 per cent of prices at the pump.

Stewart Hosie, the SNP's Treasury spokesman at Westminster, said: "Gordon Brown faces a summer of discontent unless he abandons his unfair plans to increase road tax further."

George Osborne, the shadow Chancellor, urged the government to perform a U-turn on the issue, claiming poorer families with older cars would be hardest hit.

Q AND A

Why are oil prices rising?

Oil prices fluctuate according to supply and demand, and increasing demand from the developing economies of China and India has pushed prices to record highs. International tensions, such as relations between the US and Iran or problems in Nigeria, also cause prices to rise. Crude oil currently offers a more attractive investment than many bonds and shares, especially at a time of a weak US dollar, further increasing demand.

How does the price of oil compare to previous years?

Last week, oil hit $135 a barrel – compared to $65 a year ago. Yesterday, the price dropped below $130 a barrel.

What does this mean for petrol prices?

The AA estimates each $5 leap in the price of oil adds 2.5p to the cost of a litre of petrol – currently around 114p a litre. Diesel costs around 126p a litre. Higher fuel costs also affect food and energy bills as they add to the costs of transportation or firing generators.

What is OPEC and what does the Prime Minister want it to do?

Opec is the oil producers' consortium and represents Iran, Iraq, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia, Venezuela, Qatar, Libya, Indonesia, the United Arab Emirates, Algeria, Nigeria, Ecuador and Angola. It controls 40 per cent of production. Gordon Brown wants Opec to force members to up production in the hope greater supplies will cut costs. But Opec says all but three members – Saudi Arabia, Kuwait and the UAE – are operating at capacity.

How do speculators affect the oil market?

Opec blames the high cost on speculators. It claims there is no shortage of oil, though production is thought to be near its peak and supplies may only last another 40 years. Speculators are able to buy or sell vast holdings of oil and make money by betting on the change in price. The scale of the reserves they are trading is large enough to influence prices.

What about North Sea oil?

It has also been hit by the rise in demand and prices have varied accordingly. In 1982, North Sea oil cost £18.85 a barrel. This fell to £10.94 in 1992 and, last year, the price stood at £36.23. This year's soaring prices – and the jump in petrol prices – is good news in one respect for the government, as it gets extra duties from oil production and VAT – estimated by the Scottish Chambers of Commerce to be a £505 million windfall since the start of April.

Grangemouth faces seaborne blockade
THE FISHERMEN


SCOTTISH fishermen are threatening to blockade Grangemouth, the country's largest container port, as part of a dramatic escalation of their protest action against soaring fuel prices, The Scotsman can reveal.

Leaders of a nationwide action group, formed to highlight the industry's desperate plight, have begun planning a series of co-ordinated days of action at ports and harbours around Britain's coast.

Discussions are also being held with fishing industry leaders in Ireland, France, Belgium and Spain to begin a campaign of concerted action throughout Europe.

The British campaign is being led by the Mallaig and North-West Fishermen's Association, which called industry leaders from across Britain to a secret summit meeting in Inverness on Monday.

John MacAlister, the association's chairman, said yesterday: "The mood is one of anger and desperation. Once again, little is being done to help our industry in our time of need.

"We have met politicians at EU, UK and Scottish level and, while they offered sympathy, they could offer little in the way of industry-sustaining, short-term support.

"The time for speaking is over and we now need action. There is now talk of blockades," Mr MacAlister said.

Routes too costly to run
THE BUSES


A SCOTTISH bus company is giving up more than £1 million of contracts on rural routes because of the soaring cost of diesel.

Munro's of Jedburgh says it is no longer viable to operate the services because of the inflated fuel prices.

It has given three months' notice to Scottish Borders Council that it no longer wishes to fulfil the contracts in its current format.

The company intends to re-tender for the journeys between Edinburgh and Kelso and Jedburgh and also the Galashiels to Berwick route, but will take into account the fuel costs in its bid.

Berwickshire and Roxburghshire Tory MSP John Lamont said the situation was of real concern and called on the Westminster government to assist bus operators in rural areas.

Most expensive diesel
THE PUMPS


FUEL prices have been steadily increasing since passing the £1 barrier.

The average price of a litre of unleaded now stands at 114p, while diesel costs 126p.

But huge variations are found across the country.

Latest figures from PetrolPrices.com found the cheapest litre of unleaded selling for 108.9p in Mansfield, while the most expensive was 126.9p in Newport, Isle of Wight.

Scotland was offering the cheapest and most expensive litres of diesel in the UK, 115.9p in Banff and 140.9p on Mull.

The full article contains 2315 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 28 May 2008 12:41 AM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Fuel prices
 
1

Daft Old Git,

28/05/2008 00:31:16
I know we are the most expensive in Europe but is there anywhere else in the world where fuel tax is so high?
2

Tris,

28/05/2008 00:43:25

You'd think that with all that tax the London Government would be able to provide decent services. Somehow it seems they never do. Not this government, not the last one. Britain is always broke despite the oil and the highest taxes on just about everything (except executive pay).

So the English - based government is either stupid or corrupt........

Or could it be that they are both?
3

Alan Reid,

Aberdeen 28/05/2008 00:49:45
Greenpeace and the like have been saying it would run out years ago, why did'nt you listen.

Cue: the usual crap from rednecks.
4

Guga II,

Rockall 28/05/2008 01:07:34
#5 Don't blame us for incompetents like Maggie Broon and Des Browne. The English are in the majority in Westminster, they are the ones that voted them into positions of power.

In any event, the New Labour Sleaze and Corruption Party has always been a party of tax and spend. They have been continually hiking taxes since they got into power; direct, indirect and stealth taxes. I'd really like to know what they are spending it on though; other than illegal wars and dodgy expense claims for themselves.
5

Charles Linskaill,

Edinburgh 28/05/2008 01:20:47

The case IS and will, always be!

The consumer is at the 'Bottom of the Barrel' and will be treated as such.
6

,

28/05/2008 01:55:33
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7

Edward,

28/05/2008 02:08:06
'What about North Sea oil?
It has also been hit by the rise in demand and prices have varied accordingly. In 1982, North Sea oil cost £18.85 a barrel. This fell to £10.94 in 1992 and, last year, the price stood at £36.23. This year's soaring prices – and the jump in petrol prices – is good news in one respect for the government'
Why the inacurate prices?, Why inacurate information?
North sea oil last year was USD 90.00 (which is £ 47)
The government are working off figures based on oil price of USD 110 a barrel. Currently the price is
USD 135 a barrel
When the Grangemouth refinery was on strike we were advised that the Government were looseing £ 50 Million a day with the closure of the Forties pipeline
This article is attempting to make out that we have ran out of oil already. The fact is we havnt , its currently good for another 50 to 100 years, without new fields coming on stream
8

Hmm ...,

28/05/2008 03:13:24
According to a mate who is an oil geologist working for BP, so far we have used less than one half of KNOWN reserves and as prices increase, further sources will become viable, so we have used rather less than half of known resources.

So how can it be argued that oil is running out?

Only by lies, prompted by Greens who want to disable the capitalist economy - and cash hungry oil companies, of course!
9

Samcafe,

Glasgow 28/05/2008 03:50:18
I wonder how many of the banks that caused the credit crunch are now playing the oil futures market and effectively making us pay for their incompetence?
10

W Smith,

Middle East 28/05/2008 04:00:37
"Fundamentally, there is nothing the UK government can do do, given that the problem is so global"

David Hunter.

Nothing the UK government can do, eh?

How come the americans are only paying 53 pence a litre seeing the problem is so 'global'?

11

,

28/05/2008 04:04:31
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12

,

28/05/2008 04:12:19
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13

,

28/05/2008 04:17:05
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14

,

28/05/2008 04:20:13
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15

Tobe ornot,

28/05/2008 05:06:53
# 12 - Americans are paying $4.00+ a gallon. Here in BC we are up to $1.40 a ltr. It is going up again in July by 7% because of a carbon tax put on by the BC Govnt. The plus you have the majority run cars at 40mpg. We didn't foresee this rise in gas prices and have gas guzzlers!!!we have a motorhome and get 10 mpg. can't use it. too expensive.
16

Kokako,

Edmonton 28/05/2008 05:43:19
What makies me really angry about all this is that it isnt even true. Shell Canada are about to embark on a program to extract oil for the oil shale in Alberta's boreal forest where there is enough oil to last for 200 years. Until now its been too expensive to extract but they have been perfecting the process for 30 years, as have others, and they are starting their pilot project now in Alberta. So... where is the darned shortage?? These prices are being jacked up intentionally, sorry.
17

Kokako,

Edmonton 28/05/2008 05:44:47
Re: How come the americans are only paying 53 pence a litre seeing the problem is so 'global'?

The American public are paying up to $4.00 a gallon.
18

Pilrig.,

Livingston 28/05/2008 06:17:22
There was a woman on the radio yesterday who had been in holiday in Egypt where the petrol price is the equivalent to 11 pence per litre.
The UK Government and the petrol companies take us for mugs over here.
19

,

28/05/2008 06:28:53
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20

George F,

Michigan 28/05/2008 06:42:48
Americans are paying around $4.18 for a gallon of petrol, about 2 quid a gallon. Bear in mind the value of the dollar against the pound Americans aren't having it easy either, as well as petrol everything else except wages has gone up. With 11% of the cost of petrol going to the Federal Treasury and then State tax as well which in Michigan is 6% politicians are in no hurry to to anything about it, why should they be? The higher the prices go the more Central and State governments get in tax revenues.
21

SouthernSkye,

28/05/2008 06:48:09
Heard on Radio4 news yesterday that pres. Sarkozy is putting the idea to the EU to remove VAT on fuel and so drop the price by (roughly) 17% in most countires.I know this idea applied to private and commercial Petrol and Diesel. Not sure if it also covered fuels for heating etc.
Seems like a good idea to me. After all, there is nothing "value added" about current fuel prices!
22

SouthernSkye,

28/05/2008 06:52:08
#1 Daft Old Git.
There's a few places more expensive than UK.
Netherlands was last I looked and I think the Nordic states (Def Norway) are also.There are a few...but not many.
Prices here in Germany are floating at around €1.48 - €1.50 for diesel, benzine and super benzine. super plus is about 6 cents up on those.
23

,

28/05/2008 07:02:23
Comment Removed By Administrator
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24

Isonomia,

Lenzie 28/05/2008 07:12:36
Apparently research has shown that people will grumble about petrol prices but they don't change their driving habits until petrol hits around £3-5 / litre. In a situation where demand exceeds supply that suggests oil prices will almost inevitably reach that figure in a very short time unless there is a massive new discovery of oil.

Isn't it funny to think that some idiots are still yapping on about a 0.4C rise in world temperatures in the 20th century (followed by less well publicised cooling in the 21st) at a time many people are literally having to choose between starvation or freezing to death!
25

,

28/05/2008 07:17:08
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26

,

28/05/2008 07:28:18
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27

,

28/05/2008 07:54:36
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28

Unimpressed one,

28/05/2008 08:07:02
"Even if that doesn't happen, we can bet on massive rises in our domestic fuel bills this summer, because the price of gas and electricity is so closely linked to the cost of oil."

So investing in gas fired stations was a totally daft move. But will they correct this gaff by investing in coal and nuclear? Oh, and of course the greens want more pain so we can 'save the planet'. This is what happens when successive governments cave in to misguided environmental pressure groups. Had oil and gas exploration been allowed to proceed without such interference, and we had a new generation of nuclear stations, perhaps things would not be so bad.
29

Tatties ower the side,

Johannesburg 28/05/2008 08:25:59
#17 I am just back from a trip to the US and #12 is correct. It is about 50 pence per litre. ($3.66 for a US gallon which is 3.78 litres)
30

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 28/05/2008 08:27:10
The article says that most experts agree "oil prices will continue to rise". Comments such as this have to be taken with several tons of salt. Many "experts" are dealing or advising in the futures markets and as such it is in their interests to "ramp" or talk up the price of oil. The arguments for the continued rise in the price are the same as those used in the eighties - rising demand but limited supply. However the price crashed from $40 per barrel to $10 per barrel in a very short time.
As Kokako pointed out in post 18 there are huge supplies of oil in North America - the Athabasca tar sands in Alberta, the Bakken formation in North Dakota and the Green river formation in Colorado. These have not been considered as reserves in the past as they have not been economically viable at $20 per barrel but they are viable at as little as $40 per barrel. Exploration and production is now under way in all of these sites. Once production builds up we may be in a totally different scenario.
31

Duncan in Edinburgh,

28/05/2008 08:31:26
#1 Norway, Finland, Denmark, Belgium and the Netherlands all pay more for fuel than we do. Funny how things you "know" can turn out to be untrue.
32

Paul Carline,

Scotland 28/05/2008 08:33:24
#29 has got it right. Iraq is not producing to capacity. It's producing less than when Saddam was in power.
That was what the invasion and occupation were/are about: not to GET the oil, but to CONTROL it - to restrict supply so that the prices remain artificially high. Meaning massive profits for the oil companies and much larger tax revenues for governments. Brown needs the money to fight the illegal and immoral wars in Afghanistan and Iraq which cost 10% of the tax revenue.
33

ddmc,

28/05/2008 08:42:10
if wikipedia is correct about oil shale, then there are 3 trillion barrels of crude waiting to be mined.

oil is the latest in a series of commodity trading bubbles, with the dollar devalued so much it will soon be used for ar$e paper
34

,

28/05/2008 08:43:55
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35

Mugen,

Livingston 28/05/2008 08:45:22
The great thing about the oil price increase is that it has shaken people and make them think about issues that have been force fed to them, like global warming, oh sorry climate change, makes it easier to change tak i guess.
The eco-mentalists will be seen for what they are, scare mongering nutters and the government for what it is.. basically a bandwagon jumper in the name of tax.
Sadly scientists will be held in the same esteem as bankers, dodgey science to get the grant.
36

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 28/05/2008 08:46:58
34 Paul.
Your analysis does not match events. Two weeks ago Bush went to Saudi Arabia and asked them to increase production. Why would he do this and restrict supply in Iraq at the same time?
No president of the USA is going to make himself popular by ramping up the price of oil.
37

Jock ex 45Cdo RM,

THORNHILL 28/05/2008 08:47:24
I'll tell you what 'life and death' is, yet another Royal Marine Commando is killed in Afghanistan, neither of the infamous Broons can comment. They have run out of words like' saddened-deeply saddened-etc etc etc. Now we have this newspaper cannot even headline the killing of a member of HM Forces.
I see one of the Murray Tennis players gets a mention.
A great bit of journalism and priority.
38

Boy Wonder,

28/05/2008 08:50:28
Oil ... just another drug we are dependent on.
39

11+failed,

the pans 28/05/2008 08:51:36
The oil companies make 2p profit on every litre. Gordon takes 77p from each litre. So Gordon talks to the oil companies today about reducing the price. Seems in this case Gordon would be better to do his usual trick and talk to himself!
40

Trade-wind,

USA 28/05/2008 09:01:50
We had 38 years to prepare for this day. The OPEC consortium was formed and the first oil embargo was back in 1970. There was fear mongering then but it was to come to pass that there was truth to that fear. They
cried about the American people freezing to death in the dark. They talked about solar and wind and coal and nucler and soon the people were lulled into forgetting all about it and big cars and hummers came rolling off the assembly lines. Motor homes hugh things were sold like cars. If it took gas or Diesel it made no difference it got bigger since 1970. 38 years 38 years 38 years. Thats how long we have know about this, and done nothing to curb our demand. The public cannot claim ignorance. So shut up and live with what you have ignored for so long. IT is going to go higher! This is only the start. I stopped driving about two years ago.
I only leave my place about once every two months and when I do if the weather permits I drive my motor cycle a small 250CC at about 80 mpg. You can curb your driving and if everyone only drove for ecential needs and not just to run around or cruise the streets we could put the Oil people back in the sand business.
Just a thought from a man who has lived to long.
41

bluehead,

edinburgh 28/05/2008 09:16:53
the world has become rip of happy
42

morris,

edinburgh 28/05/2008 09:20:55
Considering the deregulation of the bus services was the brain child of a Tory government, the removal of bus routes anywhere should come as no surprise,and as for Berwickshire and Roxburghshire Tory MSP John Lamont said "the situation was of real concern and called on the Westminster government to assist bus operators in rural areas", clearly he has a brass neck asking this government to intervene and sort what is primarily the handiwork of his own Ferengi Party stupidity and obsession with money.

I agree petrol prices are high and the government needs to act and remove some of the taxation to ease the burden(or face wipe out at the polls),but its a bit rich when the Tories preach on the bus industry!

They have probably never been on a bus since schooldays!

Munro of Jedburgh provided a service which was vital to the borders ,but they too have followed FIRST BUS and abandoned the Borders, because the economics simply do not add up.
The fares structures would have to increase so much to make these services pay that they would cease to be used at all.Subsidy from the Borders Council appears to be the only possibility,and we all know that none of the councillors will support that for fear of being kicked out and doing what they were elected to do and look after the area RICH AND POOR!
Fat chance of that with three Unionist Tory parties !
At least the Waverley line might start paying if the removal of bus services continues.
Just one wee problem,how do we get to the line?
Most Border Region people live too far away from the Waverley line to use it anyway.

Looks like the car rules in the Borders for some time to come.but we still pay inflated prices of course.

People have been noticing prices increasing by 1p per litre every day at certain stations.Since deliveries are once or twice per week surely this cannot be justified.There is a campaign to force the petrol stations to lower prices or go bust and its quite simple to organise.Buy your fuel at TESC
43

Liz,

Edinburgh 28/05/2008 09:23:08
This is a stupid argument and we are in a stupid situation.
We have not 'suddenly' come to a position where oil is scarse. It has been known for years that we would run out one day but we do not go from having lots of oil to having hardly any within a year,something else is going on here. Much of the problem at the moment appears to be coming from people speculating in the market and therefore pushing up the price as they buy up more oil that they expect to sell on for a profit later.
44

morris,

edinburgh 28/05/2008 09:23:41
44 cont

People have been noticing prices increasing by 1p per litre every day at certain stations.Since deliveries are once or twice per week surely this cannot be justified.There is a campaign to force the petrol stations to lower prices or go bust and its quite simple to organise.Buy your fuel at TESCO MORRISON ASDA etc and abnadon the local garages.They may go bust of course,but its nake your mind up time people because Maggie Broon does not give a sh you knwo what about your problems.New Labour Policy is Its a case of mind over matter.

Maggie Broon disnae mind and you dinnae matter!
45

,

28/05/2008 09:23:51
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
46

Linda,

Edinburgh 28/05/2008 09:23:53
Successive Westminster governments have squandered Scotland's Oil in the headlong rush to bail out the UK economy. We should have copied Norway and conserved oil while investing in a Future's Trust.
However there is still half of known North Sea oil reserves left for an independent Scotland to husband properly. And more if prices do reach $200 a barrel.
On current prices an Independent Scotland would have an annual budget surplus of £6 billion.
47

glassbenmhor,

28/05/2008 09:24:08
Scotman.com-----HERETICS

LIES, MORE LIES, and DAMMED LIES.

OIL RUNING OUT MY *RSE

Aye that would just suit the Unionist Agenda to a Tee would it not, no the powers at be are panicking, their end is in sight!
48

glassbenmhor,

28/05/2008 09:28:08
Yes,

I wonder just what could be done with that little, little point of 505 million sterling, across a little country with only 6-7 million people, huhh, 'probably too, too small to manage it!
49

glassbenmhor,

28/05/2008 09:38:12
Every day now when reading the news and thinking of the Union, I hum Bob Dylan's tune,

When the Ship Comes In

except I change the word SHIP for OIL,

NEMO ME IMPUNE LACESSIT
50

Goat Boy,

28/05/2008 09:40:34
The fact is that we have evolved into a society that is dependent on road transport. The number of people commuting is increasing daily and this uses more and more fuel. It doesn't matter if you drive a VW Golf or a 4x4, you are still using fuel. We drive to the shops, to the cinema, to holiday destinations, to work, for leisure and even to the gym. Now add the huge quantities of fuel that is being used by the aviation industry. How many of these journeys are necessary? We are wasting fuel simply because it is available. Goods are transported from central distribution centres to locations up and down the country, using huge quantities of fuel.

This is the problem - our way of life. And I see that there is growing pressure to build more homes in locations where there is no work. This is madness and highlights that our leaders are incapable of joined up thinking. Such a move increase the commuter problem and exacerbate what is already a fast growing problem. Taxation is not the solution, as it only hits the people who are already struggling financially. We need to look at how we are now living. It’s simply not sustainable.
51

morris,

edinburgh 28/05/2008 09:41:51
48
Whilst there is no doubt that what you say is true Linda,and we would be crazy to remain in the United Kingdom,nevertheless you can see from our Press and the contributors on here, that common sense is the last thing the electorate employ.

Scotland still debates whether its better to be ripped off by a Labour governmnent in Westmonster, or a Tory government in Westmonster. Few have managed to conclude maybe its better not to be ripped off at all!

If we asked the people would you back a three legged horse which has no chance of winning?
The answer would invariably be Noooooooooooooooooooo!Of course not! IM not crazy you know.

If you ask them would you back a watered down Tory party that has no chance of winning and you will get a Tory government because you voted UK, these same people will say Yes Vote Labour!

The three legged horse has more chance of being elected!
Try telling that to the numpties who frequent here!
They already elected four Tory governmnents listening to the Labour Party's crud, which was designed to keep their Mps in a job,and the rest of you will just have to suffer the ravages of Thatcherism.They cannot understand that even if we elected 50 seats in Scotland as New Labour members,it could not defeat a Tory government projecting at close to a 400 seat majority.

THICK? That does not do them justice!
52

John H,

edinburgh 28/05/2008 09:44:25
Can anyone tell us what the net cost of a litre of fuel is for the hauliers, self employed ect. The receipts demanded at filling stations are for use in reclaiming allowances against tax. Is it just the vat they can claim back or is there an allowance say a percentage of total fuel cost?
It is the man or woman in the street who are suffering most during this most expensive time.
53

Liz,

Edinburgh 28/05/2008 09:50:47
#55
But how else can they show everyone how important they think they are?!
Shame, that most people I know seem to think of the word t*sser when someone drives past in one of these ridiculous vehicles (I am meaning those who have never been 'off-road' in their lives, not those who actually do need to use four wheel drive).
And before anyone starts, I am not jealous, I could easily to 'afford' to get one of these hideous things but I prefer not to look such a prat.
54

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 28/05/2008 09:53:26
49/50/51
In the financial year 2006/07 total UK oil and gas revenues were £9.1bn. In that same year the UK paid a net £9.4bn to other countries in overseas aid and EU contributions. If you study the figures, as opposed to the rhetoric, you will see that, for every one of the last 20 years, the UK has paid more to other countries in aid and contributions than it has received in total oil and gas revenues. In some years(eg 1991/92) the difference was huge.
The UK is also committed to increase its overseas aid buget to £9.1bn in 2010 with EU contributions likely to be £4.7bn - a total of £13.7bn. Nationalists seem to want 95% of UK oil and gas revenues but what proprtion of the overseas aid do they wish to contribute? So what if oil reaches $200 per barrel? This would crucify developing countries who already struggle to maintain their basic infrastructure. Never mind - we can hold on to the revenues and be rich in an independent Scotland.

Anyway North Sea oil production is declining at a rate of 10-15% per annum.
55

The Federalist (the poster formerly know as NAUON),

28/05/2008 09:54:04
#29 #34 Iraq's oil production is actually higher than before the war:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/7144774.stm
56

Jack fae Glasgow,

Glasgow 28/05/2008 09:57:32
The solution is a lot simpler than anyone wants to realise......governments get together and AGREE the price that they are all going to PAY for crude. $50 a barrel and that's it. Gunboat diplomacy works for me....especially when its for my benefit.
57

Deekie fae Midstocket,

Aberdeen 28/05/2008 10:00:05
Scotland: the only nation in the world to have discovered oil and to become poorer for it. Ah, the Union dividend...
58

Privateman,

Anywhere but here 28/05/2008 10:01:42
Well done #54 to raise the issue of how much the hauliers actually pay. They seem remarkably quiet on this, pretending they pay the same rate as we do. As most of them are VAT registered they will get the VAT back for a start, then the cost of fuel will be a deduction in arriving at their profits on which they pay income or corporation tax. Depending on the level of those profits, the amount of tax saved could be anywhere between 20% and 40% (more likely the latter for any decent self-employed hauliers) and between 20% and 30% for companies. So, the net effect is to take off the VAT (17.5 divided by 117.5) from the full price, then to get tax relief on the remainder. Although the actual price in real terms will depend on individual circumstances, the real cost to them is undoubtedly much less than to you or me.
59

Liz,

Edinburgh 28/05/2008 10:02:03
#57
Well that is interesting, I have seen figures that suggest that 7.6 billion goes to the Treasury from tobacco duties - so the revenue from oil is not actually that big a deal?!
Add to that the 8.6 billion from alcohol and that makes the oil even less significant....
60

Banana Heid,

Ayrshire 28/05/2008 10:04:37
If I were allowed to work from home I would save at least £50 a week in fuel probably more. Please put pressure on my boss to allow this. I dont need to travel 60 miles a day through rush hour congestion just to sit in front of a computer all day. I can do it from home nae bother...
61

Willie,

28/05/2008 10:05:50
I am fascinated by the furore.
There is the hauliers who forget to tell the media about their VAT rebate or input tax which they reclaim at 17.5% not insignificant.
Then there's the fisherman - Don't know how much tax they pay but suggest lower rate and they get rebates - Always complaining about everything except black fish!!
Then the Media rarely get their facts right - always blame the Government - where do we get the tax from to pay for hospitals, schools, armed forces, nurses, doctors, police etc etc etc if they reduce petrol by 25p a litre.
Then of course there is the oil companies - don't make a profit from selling on the forecourt.
But profits increase every year, year on year.
Once again we have the greedy moaning about their profit margins, and the needy paying one way or another to help the greedy.
62

Alternative (High Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 28/05/2008 10:08:01
Oil is not running out.

The prices of fuel are being held artificially high by governments---particularly our sorry excuse for a government.

Although the price of crude is a factor in road fuel costs, it is but a small factor. In this country, the main reason for high prices is the governmant's criminal level of tax.
63

Liz,

Edinburgh 28/05/2008 10:09:46
#64
You will change your tune when the haulliers either go out of business or increase their costs approriately - the price of everything is to a large extent influenced by the cost of its distribution, therefore we are going to see price rises on the back of this, ie increasing inflation, and if inflation rises interest rates will need to rise then we (and Mr Brown) will really be in a mess.
64

voltaire's janny,

28/05/2008 10:11:01
Wow. I see the paranoid crowd are out in full today.

Some factoids for ya:

Present surge in prices will continue until demand falls. Straightforward economics.

Why is demand so high? India and China are growing fast and adding to the high demands of the West and the US in particular.

There are a finite number of rigs in the world. When they are all deployed, you cannot develop known reserves any faster. This puts up the price. It is not how much oil is out there that is the problem it is inertia in exploitation.

The situation will price-in many alternatives, some of which are also in demand as basic foodstuffs.

Markets work as the sum of millions of individual selfish choices and are modified by the regulatory framework.

Waste is the problem, since we cannot all aspire to US levels of consumption. If every Chinese took a daily paper there would be no trees left. Time to pay more at the pump.

These imperatives will not change and governments' only choices are enlightened co-operation or conflict. Correction has begun and the global down-turn, maybe recession is upon us. In the US it is a conscious political decision to cross-subsidize fuel by not taxing it anything like enough.

When will you car-share, take the bus, walk? 2,3 or 5 pounds a litre? It will be 2 pounds very soon....

Use less, recycle and have a beer; the world will turn.

65

Banana Heid,

Ayrshire 28/05/2008 10:12:34
65# It appears to me from all the posts that we are all aware how much our own government and major industrialists are shafting us but we are all too cowardly or lazy to do anything about it. The government are banking on our apathy to keep them safe from the angry mob. I think the time to storm the Bastille is nearly upon us.
66

Here Today HBOS Tomorrow,

28/05/2008 10:15:58
There is one option to reduce prices to a Chavez and natioanlise all oil & gas in the North Sea, then sell this cheaply to the people of the UK. The oil companies plus speculators are making billions at your expense.

As for taxes posters 1 etc should note the UK has one of the lowest rates of personal taxes in Europe, I know as I live in Europe and it is much higher. You voted for lower taxes so the result is no investment in long term energy policy (throughout the 80´s and 90´s) and a reliance on the free markets to provide everything. The short sighted view of the UK voter is now coming home to roost, as now there is no energy or food security (we are a net imported of food!).

Had the UK invested in significant renewable resources, plus retained some state control of oil and gas some of this chaos could have been avoided. Instead the nimby crowd complain at the merest sight of a windmill, and people continue to drive everywhere when in some cases public transport is perfectly ok. Also when there is a threat of tax rises to pay for anything people complain - the result low taxes and crap service. As they say you get what you pay for...

I am no socialist but somethings such as food, health and energy should not be left to the speculators or super rich...
67

Green,

Dundee 28/05/2008 10:16:31
Yes we have had plenty of time to prepare for this.

Most of the oil we use is wasted.

Families have got smaller according to the census for the last 40 years.... but the actual sixe and engine size of the cars we run on average has got bigger. Who saw these Chelsea tractors around 12 years ago? Where are all these 6 or 8 people families?

There's plenty of fat to cut on energy saving, and not doing it puts us in the hands of those countries who have most of the oil..

I Why don't the there's lots of oil and we are all being cheated people use there energy to write a few letters to the Saudi royals, that nice Mr. Putin and his new patsy in office, Hugo Chavez, the ruling Communist Party in China and ask them nicely if thery will let you have lots of cheap oil from them.
68

The Federalist (the poster formerly know as NAUON),

28/05/2008 10:18:54
One of the major reasons for the hike in oil prices is the collusion between OPEC members to restrict oil production. It is a repeat of their tactics in the 1970s to manipulate oil prices to their benefit.

This, combined with the actions of high risk speculators, the credit crunch and a weak dollar, has pushed prices to the level they are at now.

In the long run though these price levels are not sustainable. Worldwide economic growth and, consequently, the demand for crude oil, has slowed greatly due to the credit crunch and the vulnerable US property market. Moreover the Federal Reserve has stopped lowering interest rates as a solution to the credit crunch - this should lead to a stronger dollar and ultimately lower oil prices. In addition, if energy prices continue at a high level then consumers and businesses will increasingly look to energy conservation to lower their own demand and therefore lower overall demand.

Ultimately though, the price should fall back as non-OPEC countries (around 60% of total oil production) try to take advantage of the rise in oil prices. many will look to uncap wells, engage in secondary and tertiary techniques to recover more oil from existing wells, drill additional wells, and otherwise expand production.
69

John S,

28/05/2008 10:21:39
Norway, has used its "accidental inheritance" to set up a Petroleum Fund.
The fund was valued at $387.3 billion in March 2008, Norway's central bank reported.15/04/2008
This latest figure equates to $82,000 for every person living in Norway.
The fund, created in 1990, invests Norway's oil and gas wealth in foreign stocks and bonds to save for future generations when the oil runs out and to shield the Norwegian economy and currency from the threat of overheating through huge oil income.

70

Willie,

28/05/2008 10:23:27
#64
They'll go out of business - Right!!
Like all those pubs that would go out of business when the smoking ban came into force.
If you believe their hype when they go out of business, foreign companies will take over, so how's the prices going to increase?
71

Rulesbutnotrulers,

Federation, not separation 28/05/2008 10:24:34
#65
Of course oil is running out! It is a finite resource; it is capital being used up; it is the family jewels we are literally burning up.

We shall only survive if we live off income; off renewables.

There are, though, plenty of alternatives to power our lives. These high prices are already producing beneficial results such as slumps in flying, gas guzzlers and growth in cycling, insulation and trams. But no gain without pain, I'm afraid.
72

Daft Old Git,

28/05/2008 10:27:45
#24 #33
Sorry I was meaning diesel prices not petrol. Still believe we have the highest in Europe
73

La5t_minit,

edinburgh 28/05/2008 10:28:22
So, the oil companies own the oil fields, they drill for the oil, pump it to their own refineries, process it, fill their own tankers and deliver it to their own pumps. Where the hell do they pay $135 a barrel for it?. Answer, they dont. its a market value not a price they buy it for...

Why is the cost of fuel so expensive... simple.... GREED. Why else can Shell, BP, Esso etc make Billions in profit with the goverment doing nothing to stop it.

The goverment also tax these profits so they are raking it in... They obviously need it to pay for all those new kitchens, carpets and decorators for the overpaid, underworked and close to peverty politicians... Lying, theiving, coniving self centered a55holes the lot of em.
74

Thistledhu,

28/05/2008 10:55:05
Paul Carline if you think the war in afghanistan is illegal than you obviousley have been out of this planet the last 8 years
75

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 28/05/2008 11:03:55
77 The Black Douglas
You are probably correct. We have seen similar situations in the past. In the nineties everybody felt that technology companies were a sure fire investment as increasing worldwide internet use would lead to an ever increasing demand for their products. What happened? A bubble then technology shares crashed. Then investors thought - property. The South of England and other areas are overcrowded and need more homes/commercial property - increasing demand and limited supply - a sure fire winner. What happened? Overborrowing - credit crunch - slump in prices. Now investors are saying oil - increasing demand - limited supply - a sure fire winner - put your money in there. What is going to happen? It is only a matter of time.
76

Dooogie,

Highland 28/05/2008 11:05:14
Its time we started running our vehicles on alcohol.
We have the technology, we have the ability to produce it cheaper than the cost of petrol or diesel.
It can be made from many source materials - even seaweed.
Sounds like a dram good idea to me - until the Westminster misgovernment get their money grubbing hands on it and tax it to the hilt!!!
77

,

28/05/2008 11:05:21
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
78

David Chapman,

Aberdeen 28/05/2008 11:10:59
"In Indonesia this week, angry students hurled Molotov cocktails at police after the government increased the cost of fuel by nearly 30 per cent."

Am I the only person to find this ironic? Maybe next week they can protest rising food prices by pelting the policemen with fruit.
79

,

28/05/2008 11:11:36
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
80

Alex, Young Laird d' Drumchapel,

Madrid 28/05/2008 11:15:42
4 Alan Reid,Aberdeen,
"Greenpeace and the like have been saying it would run out years ago, why did'nt you listen.

Cue: the usual crap from rednecks."

You are wrong. The problem is that demand is growing rapidly. Added to that OPEC is refusing to increase supply because the last time it did oil prices fell dramatically. The consequence is massively inflated prices. This has nothing to do with what either the headline or you are saying.

The horrible part about all of this is that as we ponder the political consequences of this energy inflation people will suffer unimaginably in poor countries. Children are going to die in the millions if this continues..
81

Duncan in Edinburgh,

28/05/2008 11:17:49
#81 Oh I do love your brand of nonsense! "After just checking some data..." oh really? You have access to the server logs do you? I suspect not.
82

MatTheCat,

Edinburgh 28/05/2008 11:28:20
@53.

Scot's have the electoral choice of being

A) Ripped of by Labour Westminster Gov
B) Ripped of by Tory Westminister Goc

or

C) Ripped of by EU Bruxelles Gov.

A vote for the SNP is not a vote fos indpendence as such, but rather a vote for relocating our subservience away from London to Brussels.
83

geekpie,

forfar 28/05/2008 11:34:22
It's good news that petrol is getting more expensive. There are too many cars on the road so children can't walk to school safely any more.
84

Isonomia,

Lenzie 28/05/2008 11:37:16
ddmc: Oil shale.

Oil shale is as much a life raft as is wood ... that has been lent on for 1000,000 years and turned into coal.

Yes, oilshale is fossil fuel and yes it is possible to produce oil from it, but it takes more energy to get the oil out of oil shale than is in the oil that comes out.

And yes it might be possible to produce some oil viably from some oil shale, but it is equally likely they'll be using fossilised wood to make life rafts - technically it might be possible, but practically you'd be daft to try!
85

MatTheCat,

Edinburgh 28/05/2008 11:43:07
@81

Hey Mr ScottWebb, your fine work is very much appreciated. It was through a link to your webpage posted on this site about 18 months ago that I first encountered the whole big wide world of 'alternative' reporting of current events.

Most notably, the Money is Debt video inspired me to check out piles of other supporting journalistic media and even read a Noam Chomsky book.