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Plan for 42-day detention 'will be walloped'



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Lord Strathclyde on the government's plans to introduce 42-day detention for terror suspects
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Published Date: 13 October 2008
GOVERNMENT plans to allow terrorist suspects to be held without trial for 42 days will be "walloped" by the House of Lords tonight, a leading Tory civil rights campaigner has predicted.
David Davis, the former shadow home secretary, who quit as a MP to force a by-election by claiming Labour was threatening historic liberties, said he expected the proposals to effectively be killed off by a Lords rebellion.

The plans, contained in the Counter Terrorism Bill, only scraped through the Commons by nine votes in June, when 36 Labour MPs voted against the government. A Lords defeat would force Gordon Brown, the Prime Minister, to decide whether to use the Parliament Act to overturn the second chamber – but there is the belief that many MPs who backed the 42-day plans before the summer have now changed their minds.

Mr Davis, speaking on the BBC's Andrew Marr show yesterday, said he expected the proposal to increase pre-charge detention from 28 to 42 days to be "thrown out by a huge majority". He added: "It think it will be dead. We've got a debate this Monday on it. We'll hear opposition from all parties. I think it will be walloped."

Unlike the Commons, Labour does not hold a majority in the Lords, where only 213 of the 732 peers take the party's whip. But even Labour figures such as Lord Goldsmith, the former attorney general, and Lord Falconer, the former Lord Chancellor, have expressed their concerns about the proposals.

The Prime Minister believes extending the limit is necessary to give police extra time to investigate suspects. He says plots are becoming increasingly complex, both technologically and in terms of the pan-national search for clues, and wants to update the law at a time of relative calm rather than having to bring emergency legislation before Parliament during a security crisis.

However, he won the earlier Commons vote only with the support of nine Democratic Unionist MPs. Since then, public support for 42 days had waned, said Mr Davis, who was subsequently re-elected. He predicted that MPs would not be prepared to force through such controversial legislation using the Parliament Act.

The Lords are expected to back an amendment proposed by Lord Dear, an independent cross-bench peer and former chief constable of West Midlands police, limiting detention without charge to 28 days.

The Home Office denied reports that it was ready to abandon the Bill and refused to speculate on the "hypothetical" situation of being forced to rely on the Parliament Act.

It said in a statement yesterday: "We will continue to press for the changes needed to protect the public from terrorism as it makes its way through the House of Lords this week."

Authors stage literary protest over terror bill

SOME of the biggest names in Scottish literature have joined a protest against plans to hold terrorism suspects for up to 42 days.

Scots writers including Ian Rankin, AL Kennedy, Andrew O'Hagan, Ali Smith, Jackie Kay and Hardeep Singh Kohli have contributed short stories to a campaign by the pressure group Liberty.

Rankin, creator of the Rebus detective books, said in his story there was "no rationale" behind the decision to extend the time limit.

He creates a scene in which two policemen discuss why the maximum of 42 days was proposed, with their answers ranging from the figure given as the meaning of life in the Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy to the number of peanuts the two officers have eaten in the pub.

O'Hagan, who recalled the effect on him of meeting a man called Michael who had been in and out of prison, wrote: "We live in a state that can show itself too ready to gorge on vulnerability."

Kennedy, who recently won the Costa prize for her novel Day, wrote: "In 42 days we will have made you different. You may be charged. You may be released. You will always be different … We will steal you from yourself."

Other writers participating in the campaign include Philip Pullman, Julian Barnes and Monica Ali.

The full article contains 688 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 13 October 2008 10:53 AM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Terrorism in the UK
 
1

Angleland Isover,

13/10/2008 05:09:55
Are our laws decided by inspector Rebus.
2

Kipling,

13/10/2008 06:14:07
The 42-day detention limit is only part of the story.

This government through its Labour party acolytes and hangers-on is also involved in sustained breaches of privacy, interception of communications, and information collection and theft from creative artists and writers (or even wannabees). As anyone involved in creative and intellectual research work knows, privacy, confidentiality and non-stressful circumstances are essential for the production of best work. But if you have a paranoid government who targets individuals who MIGHT produce something threatening to the establishment or threaten the status of its own 'artistic' apparatchiks, they are presently creating a situation where invasive controlling techniques and creative asset stripping (ie, asset stripping of creative productions) are part of the whole fabric of how they want society to operate.

The whole ID-card nonsense and the centralised accumulation of personal data is a part of allowing this paranoid assessment of who to target next and how to control/survey their movements.

I know this, because I have had to experience it first hand. Believe you me, what happens to me first eventually happens to other members of the population. My statement in the early 1990s with reference to the behaviour of a Labour party dominated area of the UK -- that some of the restructuring of official society was resembling the secret police tactics in Soviet Russia -- were not far out. I was 'punished' for these views through defamation, abduction and the constant monitoring and theft of creative productions. As the article reports Kennedy saying: "In 42 days we will have made you different. You may be charged. You may be released. You will always be different … We will steal you from yourself."

Blair and Brown have simply started bringing what was hidden to light by trying to put these hidden structures and tactics into the statute book.
3

Guga II,

Rockall 13/10/2008 07:14:53
The 42 day detention is what you would expect from the Stalinist, totalitarian, control freak numpties of the New Labour Sleaze and Corruption Party.
4

scottishcoffindodgerno1,

Tram City 13/10/2008 07:21:16
1# Well Rebus always gets his man,and sometime a woman if he gets lucky
5

Kipling,

13/10/2008 07:40:02
The sad thing is that many of the civil liberty groups are populated by Labour/New Labour toads. It's only when the real designs of their former associates go into legislation (or even war, in Blair's case) that they start to speak out. Too little, too late in most cases. The Labour government will only react to Liberty's protests if it feels that votes (and hence money for greedy guzzling M.P.s) is at stake.

New Labour knew the demonstrations against the UK's participation in the 2003 war on Iraq meant nothing in terms of votes, and the party was right (partly because the demonstrators didn't criticise Queen Bee Tony personally?): New Labour got voted in again. This time the odds are less in their favour. Perhaps this is because those most at risk of detention aren't the native populations but those (or the children of those) who have immigrated to the UK and therefore might be those still persuaded to vote for a New Labour government insofar as Tory-ism is perceivably connected with anti-immigration.
6

Kipling,

13/10/2008 07:51:27
Not just the greedy guzzling MP racket, but also all those local authority, government quango or NHS, etc, jobs for those nice, liberal-sounding, people might have to go if New Labour loses out. There's a lot at stake for the 'educated' classes if they manage to protest effectively against this poxy government.
7

Marian,

13/10/2008 09:20:40
Under Tony Blair and Gordon Brown the UK has become a surveillance society with more CCTV cameras than anywhere else in the world. Demonstrating outside Parliament became illegal without prior permission from the police. Blair and Brown have pushed hard to impose ID cards on us all with biometric information and all details about us (including medical) easily accessed by New Labour government departments as well as fraudsters. The right to trial by jury is being eroded, habeas corpus has been suspended.

Yet despite all these measures, the UK is no safer according to the same New Labour government who introduced this Draconian legislation. We are constantly being told of numerous terror threats against us.

We've also seen an 80 year-old heckler manhandled out of a New Labour Party conference and we've seen a woman arrested for reading out the names of people killed in Iraq. The Terrorism Act is used as a catch-all to prevent any sort of dissent. There was even an attempt to pass a law allowing further laws to be made without Parliamentary scrutiny called the Legislative and Regulatory Reform Bill.

New Labour have proposed that every citizen of the UK should be regarded as suspects by being tagged at birth with the profiling of their DNA, that they should be required to have an ID card with all their biometric data such as photograph/ facial measurements/fingerprints and all this should be tied to a database that records every aspect of a citizen's life.

The New Labour government's database will hold records such as parents, schooling, health, car ownership, house ownership, tax matters, bank accounts, passport, travel records, convictions and cautions, social security, shares held, and phone calls made and received, all will be extractable when needed.

Indeed, with a DNA database, and legislation for presumed consent, we will have the ultimate stacking and racking system that lets the New Labour authorities know who has a body part where and who it ma
8

Marian,

13/10/2008 09:21:10
.......continued

Indeed, with a DNA database, and legislation for presumed consent, we will have the ultimate stacking and racking system that lets the New Labour authorities know who has a body part where and who it matches up with.

Security will be like that of a totalitarian state, and just like the car numberplate recognition camera's that can read and record your car number as you move about, so they will also track people with face reading software cameras.
9

fresian,

edinburgh 13/10/2008 09:49:33
Marian, they are already at it. An aricle in this week's motorcycle news featured a motorcyclist, albeit riding like a tw4t, who was caught on camera at over 100mph. He was caught, not by his numberplate, but by a combination of recognition by facial measuring technique.
10

connaughtboy,

stonehaven 13/10/2008 13:30:51
#2 Kipling

If your intention was to scare me, you just succeeded !

Very good post.
11

Vote UKIP,

13/10/2008 19:38:12
A fantastic defeat for the NuLabour Nazi Party.
12

Kipling,

13/10/2008 21:11:29
#10. Hey connaughtboy! so long as I didn't terrorise you with things that have actually happened. I'd have locked myself up for longer than 42 days in mortification if that were the case.

What NewLabour intends to happen now, as described by so well by Maid Marian, has existed in pockets of the UK for some time. Things happening to people which are not deemed newsworthy or given scant regard by our oligarchic press.

#11. For how long? Let's hope those who have some fundamental sense of civil civil liberties will be brave enough to continue the battle in Westminster against this hypocritical self-serving government. The only thing the latter worries about is NOT the safety of the British public, it is the safety of their own flaccid poxy skin from the consequences of their policies. But since they're keen on having flight paths to another ugly polluting runway over the building wherein they spit and hack at each other, dare I say... perhaps a true Act of Heaven... might one day... alleviate us from... further misery.
13

Drum Major,

Brisbane, Australia 13/10/2008 22:04:15
Marian: As your card may be cracked & broken, destroyed or stolen, the next move is to isert a microchip in everyone. You will not be able to buy or sell any goods or access any govt program without a chip. It is written.
14

Conan the Librarian™,

13/10/2008 23:45:15
4
He always gets his pint for sure.
15

Udith Fonseka,

Canada 14/10/2008 07:11:41
If this and other laws were to be actually used against potential terrorists and their backers(like that guy with the hook)then maybe it might be all right,but I suspect the exact opposite might happen and people targeted,fined,deported and jailed may include anyone from speeders,tax evadors,sex offenders,TV Lic nonpayers,the BNP,visiting expats, etc etc.

 

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