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Financial mayhem has exposed the fantasy of independence aspiration



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Published Date: 13 October 2008
Without doubt, the silver lining to the banking crisis has been the great opportunity afforded the people of Scotland to see through the great SNP independence delusion.
All the so-called tiger economies held up by the SNP as examples to follow have slunk away like little pussy cats with their tails between their legs.

All the advice we've been given by the Nationalists' banker friends – Scotland can go it alone –
when it came to the crunch has been exposed as worthless.

And the only solution the SNP government of Scotland could come up with is, like the rest of the world, to follow Westminster's lead on the crisis.

Of course, we can all be tigers when times are good, but when times are bad that's when we rely on our true friends for support.

The stark truth of the matter is that in a global economy no country is truly independent. Scots should be grateful that they've been given such a timely lesson at such little cost. And they should put some distance between themselves and the crackpots who think differently.

ROBERT VEITCH
Paisley Drive
Edinburgh


Thank goodness for the Union. Without English money, the Royal Bank of Scotland and Halifax Bank of Scotland would have sunk, taking our savings with them. If Scotland were independent, its banks would have gone the way of Iceland's.

Icelandic banks, Sir Fred Goodwin at RBS and Alex Salmond are like three little frogs who have blown themselves up into toads full of flatulence. Iceland has just popped and Sir Fred has been rescued by all the Queen's horses and all the Queen's men.

Mr Salmond's fantasy of an independent Scotland relied on having two big Scottish banks, but that's history now. If our savings are safe, it's thanks to England, so perhaps Mr Salmond should say thank you to Westminster for us.

DAVID ROSEWARNE
East Broughton Place
Edinburgh


It is a very superficial analysis (Debate & Opinion, 10 October) that suggests Iceland's banks having over-extended themselves, like those in many large countries such as the UK and US, is a blow to Scottish independence.

As a nation, Scotland has much more in common with Norway – which, like many small countries in Europe, has no banking crisis – in respect of its similar mixed economy, size of population, social democracy and natural assets such as oil gas and fishing.

It is those countries, like the UK, which have had lax financial regulations over the past ten years which are suffering the most, and that is thanks to Prime Minister Gordon Brown and Chancellor Alistair Darling.

CALUM STEWART
Montague Street
Edinburgh


Unlike Scotland, small independent Norway, with control of her oil and gas revenues, is now one of the most financially stable countries in the world. I am surprised that in these days of uncertainty in global markets this fact has not been mentioned by the Scottish press or media.

DONALD J MACLEOD
Woodcroft Avenue
Bridge of Don, Aberdeenshire


Your report "British savers denied their own cash by Iceland Bank" (8 October) was inaccurate.

Money deposited in a bank belongs to the bank until such time as the depositor can claim it back again.

RONALD RANKIN
Coates House
Dalkeith, Midlothian




The full article contains 544 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

 
1

James F,

East Ayr 13/10/2008 00:43:00
I think Calum and Donald have got the analysis right.

It is extremely doubtful that a prudent Scottish Government would have allowed Scottish banks to become so highly exposed to the toxicity of sub-Prime as did Westminster with the UK banking sector.
2

Hugh V McLachlan,

Elderslie 13/10/2008 00:45:53
'Money deposited in a bank belongs to the bank until such time as the depositor can claim it back again.'RONALD RANKIN

No, this is a misunderstanding. We do not transfer the ownership of our money to a bank when we deposit our funds with it. Rather, we entrust it to them. They have a duty to return it to us. A furniture-remover no more becomes the owner of our three-piece-suite when it comes into his possession for the purposes of transportation.
3

Colin Wilson,

Aberdeen 13/10/2008 06:36:53
"Without English money, the Royal Bank of Scotland and Halifax Bank of Scotland would have sunk..."

So the UK's money is English money. Is any further comment needed?
4

Colin Wilson,

Aberdeen 13/10/2008 06:51:40
"All the so-called tiger economies held up by the SNP as examples to follow have slunk away like little ***** cats with their tails between their legs."

We note that he doesn't explain what he actually means by "slunk away". Away from what? Their status as free countries? Where has that happened?

PS The word behind the asterisks is taboo, apparently.
5

SouthernSkye,

13/10/2008 07:22:26
OK, so Iceland is up the creek....Which other countries are being held up as failed examples here?
Norway, Sweden, Denmark, Finland, Luxembourg?
I would just like a bit more information on which to base a response!
6

SC,

13/10/2008 08:25:06
The UK almost went bankrupt in my lifetime - the seventies - and isn't exactly doing well now.

In what way does being a middle-sized nation guarantee your financial wellbeing if you don't have good government? It doesn't.

Ireland and Iceland will come out of this independent and richer than Scotland. The arc of prosperity remains despite Unionist delight at the current misfortune of others.
7

Mr. Lachie Todd,

Edinburgh 13/10/2008 08:28:10
Independence is certainly no fantasy. It is a realistic and natural progression for any people to choose how their nation is governed.

In 5 years time, it will be interesting to see which
countries presently affected by this crisis recover their former economic stability?

Today, the CEO of RBS has been forced to resign.
This was the banker who led a board of directors which championed risky expansion by taking over NatWest in England and other banks throughout the world, and claimed during the Devolution Debate that by being part of the Unted Kingdom made his company much stronger?
Sadly, his risk assessment was incorrect!

The directors of the Bank of Scotland also jumped at the chance of merging with the Halifax Building Society
to create HBOS. As it has transpired the Halifax has dragged down one of the oldest banks in the world!

The claims and aspirations of these bankers now lie in ashes!
8

Guga II,

Rockall 13/10/2008 08:33:19
What a totally biased and Unionist headline. I'll bet a pound to a penny that either David MadDog or Eddie Barnes thought that one up.

The blatantly biased, pro-New Labour, pro-Unionist attitude of the Hootsmon these days is well beyond the pale. No wonder their circulation has been taking a nosedive.

9

Miss H,

13/10/2008 10:08:16
the first two letters are hilarious.
10

G,

dundy 13/10/2008 10:15:03
Ah the SNPites are out playing their usual games...as they can't argue against the points made they attempt to attack the messenger (#9) or pick out some tiny piece to attack (#3) Neither approach is creditable.
The credit crunch and the global financial turmoil does not respect nationalities or "independence"

11

Miss H,

13/10/2008 10:36:45
10 So you are saying that global crises do not respect nationalities or independence?

So it doesn't matter if you are Scottish or British, or independent or not independent.

Therefore we should not take any decisions on independence based on global crises?

And your point therefore is?
12

Hugh V McLachlan,

Elderslie 13/10/2008 10:44:46
#3 Colin Wilson

'So the UK's money is English money. Is any further comment needed?'

Yes it is. I would be worth specifying, less cryptically what precisely you think is wrong with the wording of the argument. Furthermore, it is worth indicating that a bad argument in support of, say, the Union is not in itself a good argument for separatism. For instance, it would be a bad argument in support of the view that the earth is more or less spherical to say that the earth is the eye of God. However, that would not in itself be a good reason for believing that the earth is flat.
13

Amanda Huginkiss,

13/10/2008 12:21:27
11# So you are Miss H today, Keren. So its not time, then?
14

Alastair the First,

13/10/2008 13:19:44
The first two letters here are utter tripe. Either the writers are of the "Scotland uniquely in the world is incapable of being independent" feartie school of thought or they are from the (probably Labour) "punching the air in joy at the failure of nominally Scottish companies" group. Either way, their forelock-tugging cringeing is embarrassing.
15

Iago,

Aberystwyth 13/10/2008 15:23:47
It's a stupid argument. Do you really think that the UK is coping at the moment? Which countries are most affected because of the credit crunch in the UK? The poorer ones, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland. Where will we see the biggest job losses? In these three countries. Iceland's banks were small compared to RBS and BOS, they would cope better than Iceland's. Also Salmond didn't just say Iceland and Ireland did he??? Norway was another and there are alot of countries around the world of similar size or smaller than Scotland that are coping. Lastly David and #12, you think this is a good argument to give, that it is English money that Scotland is using; before stating such rubbish claims, do your sums on the oil revenue that Scotland would and should be getting, then lets see who's subsidising who. Don't loose faith Scotland.
16

Colin Wilson,

13/10/2008 17:31:05
Re G (#10) : "Ah the SNPites are out playing their usual games...(#3)

Another of G's inventions. My comments are not made on behalf of the SNP.

Re Hugh V McLachlan (#12) : I agree, further comment is needed. My earlier posting was worded without enough thought. Others here have commented very well on the point concerned.
17

Richardinho,

13/10/2008 21:50:29
Am I imagining things, or did this banking crisis happen under the union?

 

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