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Published Date: 19 November 2008
JURORS should be questioned on why so few men accused of rape are convicted of the crime, a senior legal figure said yesterday.
Ian Duguid, QC, chairman of the Faculty of Advocates' criminal bar association, said research was needed to find out, once and for all, why Scotland's conviction rate is so low.

The Scottish Parliament's justice committee was also warned that the
new Sexual Offences Bill was "not the answer" to the problem of so few rapes ending in conviction.

The bill sets up, for the first time, a statutory definition of rape and replaces the key concept of "consent" in cases with a new term: "free agreement". It also spells out to judges and juries that a woman cannot be held responsible for an attack on her if she was so drunk that she was incapable of agreeing to sex.

These measures have raised hopes that juries will be able to convict more rapists – increasing the conviction rate, which currently stands at 2.9 per cent of all rapes reported to police.

However, Mr Duguid yesterday argued that the new legislation would make little difference to the conviction rate.

"The low conviction rate can only be addressed by asking jurors 'Why?'," he said.

"That's currently a situation precluded by the Contempt of Court Act. But that is the way forward – it isn't in trying to change the law.

"What is it that the public need to understand about the word 'consent'? Why do we need to replace it with two words? What is it people don't understand about it? Somebody needs to answer that. The way forward is to conduct proper research."

He cited recent comments from Dame Helen Mirren, the Oscar-winning actress, who said sexual jealousy meant that female jurors were less likely to sympathise with rape victims.

"That's as speculative as anything else," he said.

Alan McCreadie, the secretary of the Law Society of Scotland's criminal law committee, agreed more research was needed. "We don't know why juries don't convict in rape cases. We can speculate, but we don't know," he said.

Mr Duguid and another QC, Ronnie Renucci, warned that the shake-up to rape laws would potentially be interpreted differently by different courts and lead to a flood of appeals.

"I fear that if this bill goes through in its current form, the appeal court is going to become even busier with some of our more litigious colleagues," said Mr Renucci.

Legal challenges would arise from confusion and conflict over when a woman is so drunk she is incapable of freely agreeing to sexual intercourse, MSPs heard.

Legal changes are only one method by which campaigners hope to see an increase in the rape conviction rate.

The Crown Office is implementing an overhaul of the way sexual offences are investigated and prosecuted.

Meanwhile, a campaign was launched last month by Rape Crisis Scotland, challenging attitudes towards rape among the public that blame women for being attacked.

Police and prosecutors to treat sex attacks in same way as murder

RAPE cases are to be investigated more like murder inquiries, under revised guidelines published yesterday.

Police and prosecutors will work more closely together and take a "forensic" approach to cases, the Lord Advocate, Elish Angiolini, said.

She published guidelines to chief constables in Scotland on the investigation and reporting of sexual offences.

"We are taking working practices between the police and the prosecution in this area to a new level," Ms Angiolini said.

"Rape is one of the most serious and distressing crimes we face as a society. When victims have the courage to report a rape, they must have absolute confidence that the investigation will be thorough, professional and sensitive from the outset.

"That is why, with this guidance to the police, we will now see an approach to rape investigation that is, from the outset, much closer in form to the approach taken in investigating a homicide.

"Victims can have increased confidence that police and prosecutors will be taking a forensic approach to gathering all available evidence, and analysing strengths and weaknesses in the case to bring a compelling prosecution before the court, wherever that is possible."

The guidelines were developed in consultation with the Association of Chief Police Officers in Scotland (Acpos).

Prosecutors have been making improvements to "every aspect" of the investigation and prosecution of rape and other sexual offences since publication of the Sexual Offences Review, according to the Lord Advocate.

"With this guidance, we are now in the final stage of implementation," she said.

Deputy Chief Constable Bill Skelly, for Acpos, welcomed the guidelines.

"This is a benchmark we should aspire to during each and every investigation," he said.





The full article contains 790 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

 
1

Teofilio Cubillas,

19/11/2008 01:19:20
""That is why, with this guidance to the police, we will now see an approach to rape investigation that is, from the outset, much closer in form to the approach taken in investigating a homicide."

I don'tthink that there is much wrong with the police approach but comparing the investigation of murder to that of rape strikes me as flawed. In cases of murder, you're working from the angle that a crime has definitely been committed - there's a body with a stab wound in it for instance. You don't have to prove this to the jury, it's self-evident.

Despite their best efforts, however, the police cannot always prove - beyond a reasonable doubt - that the crime of rape has actually been committed. Rapists, as well as innocent men, both use the defence of consent, and where there is little or no other corroboration - bruising etc - juries give the benefit of the doubt (as they are obliged to do)to the accused.
2

an interested party,

19/11/2008 07:02:36
so presumed consent doesn't fly in this instance

i think you will find that juries didnt think there was enough evidence to convict, otherwise i assume they would have.

yes rape is a serious crime, hard to prove, no matter how much wishful thinking you apply.

perhaps if it was tried in the civil courts where 'balance of probability' was the metric and not 'beyond reasonable doubt' there would be a higher conviction rate

3

Colin Wilson,

Aberdeen 19/11/2008 07:25:21
The law ought to recognise that this kind of crime comes in different degrees of severity. Where there was consent to some degree of sexual activity between two people, but one of them takes this beyond the extent to which the other consents, then a charge of "sexual coercion" should be brought. The full charge of "rape" should be brought when there was no consent to anything.

The avoidance of the term "rape" might make juries less reluctant to convict someone who is guilty, and might even lead to more guilty parties pleading guilty, knowing that they would not then be labelled "rapist".
4

Dave,

Western Isles 19/11/2008 07:41:22
It's such a messy subject (no pun intended) and I really feel for the women who genuinely have been raped and never got a convictions.

There are too many if's and but's and grey areas in this country for a safe conviction (sadly) but I don't think questioning the juries as to why they didn't convict is the right course.

I don't think there is ever going to be an easy solution to this until there is a massive societal shift in attitude in both men and women.

At present we live in times of very much free love, not taking responsibility for ones self and and binge drink and drug taking. It's a mixture that's always going to spell disaster and somebody will always get hurt.

Also, the rape law has been abused in the past too by silly women and girls being spiteful. No wonder the juries don't want to convict as there will always be an element of doubt.
5

Alberto.,

19/11/2008 09:53:23
Cannot help feeling that ‘Political direction’ may have something to do with it!

1)In case any of their ‘colleagues’ are caught and charged - ‘Face saving’ in Political circles is an absolute must - above all, as we see frequently!

2)Due to Political failure there ain’t any prison space!

Glaringly obvious nowadays!!!




6

james 1st,

hamilton nz 19/11/2008 09:56:42
often rape cases rely on just two people, the man involved and the woman involved with no independent witness.
who can really tell what happened. the man says the woman consented the woman says that she didnt
here in new zealand we have over the last 4 to 5 years hadseveral high profile cases where men have been sent to jail and subsequently been released when the woman has finally admitted that she had lied. no punihment for the woman concerned
thatis why it is so hard to get convictions
7

Alternative (High-Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 19/11/2008 10:44:39
Why don't juries convict men of rape?

Hmmm... Now lets see....

Could it possibly be something to do with the fact that on careful examination of the evidence put before them it is clear that they could not state that the accused is guilty beyond reasonable doubt? Isn't that the way that justice is SUPPOSED to work?

The jury system of trying cases is the fairest in the world. There is no way that members of a jury should feel that they have to account for their actions otherwise this fairness dissappears. What goes on in a jury room is a matter ONLY for the jurors. End of story.
8

Teofilio Cubillas,

19/11/2008 11:04:45
#2

"perhaps if it was tried in the civil courts where 'balance of probability' was the metric and not 'beyond reasonable doubt' there would be a higher conviction rate"

Why not compose the jury exclusively from those who are members of Rape Crisis? I'm sure you'll see conviction rates soar. I don't mean to take a cheap shot, but to secure a crimianl conviction in this country requires the case to be proven beyond a reasonable doubt. There is no doubt that conviction rates for rape are too low and that rapists are regularly walking away from court scot-free (along with a number of innocent men as well). That is a matter for politicians and finer legal minds than mine to sort out. But trashing our basic rights and making it 'easier' to secure a criminal conviction, which may, in fact very likely will, result in lengthy imprisonment and personal ruination, is not the way to crack this particular nut.

9

bluehead,

edinburgh 19/11/2008 11:13:26
oh ,doe's this mean that if you don't bring in the verdict they want,even though there isn't sufficient evidence to prove the case ,that the jurors have to be hauled over the coals??if so the people would be witnessing further deterioration of the way this country is being run
prosecutors should make sure they have more than enough evidence before they bring a case in the first place,what a mess this country has been led in to.!!!














10

Alternative (High-Octane) Fuel Head,

Edinburgh 19/11/2008 11:17:15
#8:

"...trashing our basic rights and making it 'easier' to secure a criminal conviction... ...is not the way to crack this particular nut."

Quite correct.

I don't agree that the number of rape convictions are "too low" though.
11

an interested party,

19/11/2008 12:23:16
#8

you agree with me then, i am merely suggesting that if you want a conviction then go civil, it wont be a criminal conviction or will you get to call the accused a rapist, but you will get a conviction, in all probability

the very suggestion that the law needs changed so that juries will convict without sufficient evidence is absurd, perhaps the gather of evidence techniques needs revised or its presentation but to suggest lowering the bar so that the shocking low conviction rate is raised isnt the way forward

if there is the evidence there will be the convictions

and in support of #10 the convictions are not to low, they cant be , they are where the evidence puts them
12

an interested party,

19/11/2008 12:24:05
gathering *
13

Victoria,

19/11/2008 13:02:23
well done boys an excellent demonstration in why the conviction rate is so low.

It is quite simply a societal attitude (comprising many men and women) which seems to presume that women a) are a bunch of vindictive liars and/or b)a bunch of temptresses who men are powerless to avoid. see points made above for examples.


#11 -Rape is one of the worst things that can ever happen to someone so to deal with it as a civil matter would be an insult to the supposed victim even if it resulted in more positive results, it would also serve to reaffirm societies attitude that actually rape isnt that bad and is all the fault of the woman involved anyway for being [drunk/stoned/flirty/tartily dressed/in a bad area/alone at night/drugged due to not watching her drink closely enough in the bar]and besides which it probably didn't happen anyway. Of course its hard to get a conviction beyond reasonable doubt when there are no witnesses, but I'd still rather it be dealt with that way than as you might treat someone for breach of contract!

PS -if you are deemed responsible for a civil matter you are not convicted of anything as this is only applicable to criminal matters

14

Observer. 1,

Glasgow 19/11/2008 13:35:39
Victoria, in what way is societal attitude to blame for lack of evidence ? You are just making that up. Women are not thought of as temptresses or liars by most men and women these days. But in many cases of ''date rape'' no conviction would be sound, as there are no witnesses to the incident, it is his word against hers, and often drink or drugs are involved. You simply cannot make the assumption that if a woman cries rape she is telling the truth and the accused is automatically guilty. Most convictions for rape occur in instances where the perpatrator is not known to the victim. In cases where the two people know each other it is very hard to prove.

Don't blame men for that. They have sisters and wives and daughters too you know.
15

Sumlogic,

Scotland 19/11/2008 13:41:33
"Rape is one of the most serious and distressing crimes we face as a society. When victims have the courage to report a rape, they must have absolute confidence that the investigation will be thorough, professional and sensitive from the outset."

So are they hinting that up to now the police etc have not bothered to investigate properly, or to the best of their ability?

Is there a serious risk here that in order to push up the conviction rate, innocent people will get caught up in this politically correct process.

Yes ‘RAPE’ would seem to be a pretty serious and horrendous crime, however sending someone to jail who was innocent of that crime seems also just as horrendous and in effect constitutes a rape of their character and life by the crown!

Will those that falsely or otherwise accuse be treated in the most severe terms, with prison sentences, or will that be washed over in case it puts folk off coming forward in the first place?

Is it possible that there exists, generally, an anti sex belief in our society, probably spawned from religious nonsense that would like all to become celibate or monogamous at least?

Maybe if such anti-sex, guilt nonsense was eradicated from our society and people felt more open and comfortable with such a patently obvious natural instinct there would be less so called sex crimes in the first place.
16

Yonthing!,

19/11/2008 13:45:49
An important aspect of any "system" is feedback - you can only improve something if you understand how the output was achieved.

The law on Contempt of Court should be changed to allow the system to produce the feedback on "Why" from the jury. There are already court "staff" who are privy to case information, and I see no reason this couldn't be extended to an approved method of discussing with the jury why they reached a certain verdict.

It shouldn't be about arguing semantics - it should be about stopping this hideous crime from occurring in the first place.
17

Number 6,

Germany 19/11/2008 13:55:58
#14 Victoria, would you not agree that female's social behaviour, getting blind drunk, wearing as little as possible, squatting and urinating in the street to show their "Class", fighting etc, loses them any respect they used to attract.

This plays an important factor as their behaviour tends to render many women helpless and therefore easier to target for rapists.

The availability of date rape drugs is also a big issue
although it did not seem to bother the woman recently accused of supply /manufacture.

Without real, physical evidence, it would be very hard for a jury to find the male guilty in many of these circumstances.

Truth drugs (And they do exist) are the only genuine way to get at what really happened. Until that happens Scottish jurors will continue to be very reluctant to convict a man of rape, especially if the female involved is nothing but a Hacket Nedess.
18

Ian on 2-wheels,

Edinburgh 19/11/2008 13:59:11
I have been in a jury on a case of sexual assault. I was horrified at the attitude other, mainly female, jurors took towards the victim. It was they who were inclined to disbelive her testimony.
I would support the idea of research into the reason for the low rate of conviction, but as others have said the jury is asked to use the test of "beyond all reasonable doubt". Where only the two people are present there will usually be doubt, unless forensic evidence hass been presented.
19

JG,

Fife 19/11/2008 14:40:39
#18 Number 6
The only thing you said in your entire comment that was correct was that some women's reckless behaviour leaves them easier targets for predatory men. That does not mean that being raped is the fault of the victim but your attitude does show exactly what Victoria means.
20

JG,

Fife 19/11/2008 14:42:51
#20 George
That's because assault isn't covered in an act of parliament in Scotland - it's a common law offence.
21

JG,

Fife 19/11/2008 14:47:00
#24 George
"Do Chief Police Officers investigate rape case? Would it not be better have serving officers who deal with such cases and get their input?"

Good point George!
22

It's life but not as we know it,

The Oort Clouds 19/11/2008 15:32:45
Ask judges why women always get tiny sentences for horrific crimes compared to men.
23

Bele's bane,

Scotland 19/11/2008 15:51:03
Part of the problem is that it is a crime normally without witnesses. Just an alleged victim and an accused party.

In the final analysis, whose evidence do you believe??

Gender issues might be less important than you think, it comes down to proving the case beyond a reasonable doubt.

Move away from that principal just to convict then the presumption of innocent until proven guilty is violated and you end up with a flawed system!

Not an easy one at all!
24

It's life but not as we know it,

The Oort Clouds 19/11/2008 16:26:27
#30 As I see it your view is that Baby P was more likely to have smashed his own skull in and broken his own back than his attackers. Hmmm, I guess that could have happened.

Muppet. You should be ashamed.
25

JG,

Fife 19/11/2008 16:38:44
#31 It's life........
That wasn't really a good comparison to draw, was it? A 17 month old would be incapable of causing such injuries to himself. Generally speaking, both parties in a rape case are still alive (if not, it would be a murder!) and can speak up for themselves. It IS more a question of who is believed and people's preconceptions.
26

It's life but not as we know it,

The Oort Clouds 19/11/2008 17:04:38
#32 so what is your verdict?
27

Anthony,

Glasgow 19/11/2008 17:53:27
1) An astute and fair observation. The two crimes are different because of the evidential nature of each. My fear is that this could be a round about way of saying the alleged victim is telling the truth, and then proceeding with the case from there. Unfortunately, in many rape cases, that would be tantamount to finding the accused guilty before he steps foot into the court. Something which seems fine by the lord advocate.

Ms Angliolini is incoherent on this issue. What does closer work between the police and the crown mean in this context? It sounds like breaking down the system of checks and counter-checks that are supposed to operate, in order to get more convictions one way or the other.

Nor should we go down the road of jury members feeling they are being pressurised into convicting, by being interogated if they fail to reach the 'right' verdict -that always being the conviction of the man.

If you want fairer rape trials, then we should consider replacing the adversarial system with an inquisitorial one for these specific offences. Let's not forget what Lord McCluskey writing for this newspaper not that long ago said - in his experience as a judge presiding over such trials, a good number of the men who were acquited of rape charges, were rightly acquited.

There are some vile men out there who commit rapes. There are also however, some vile women who tell lies. Let's not be led down the dangerous path of gender based law - it's not a very nice place to go.
28

JG,

Fife 19/11/2008 18:29:02
#33 It's life.....
My verdict about what?
29

JG,

Fife 19/11/2008 18:33:44
#34 Anthony
"a good number of the men who were acquited of rape charges, were rightly acquited."

Fair enough Anthony, but conversely that also means that a goood number of the men who were acquitted shouldn't have been! I also worry that, by saying that the accused man was found not guilty, the assumption is that the woman is telling lies.
I don't think we should have gender based law either but no-one can argue that the conviction rate is pitifully low!
30

fife runner,

19/11/2008 18:53:10
could be down to the fact some women cry wolf after the event and are shown to be liars. perhaps women should look at themselves first. The fact that women who do this are treated leniently makes the whole law on this matter very one sided in favour of the women. Women who lie should be given the same jail sentences as the men who are convicted then we might see an even playing field. Make the law easier to convict the women also
31

the.ally ,

max. 19/11/2008 18:54:50
Elish Angiolini is nothing more than a liar, a cheat, an englis crown lackie that does what she's told from the englsih establishment. They tell her to subordinate all Scots by disgracing them through moral turpitude; an old englsih crown trick. She famously called Scotland the rape capitol of the world; slander and libel because it;s not true.

Elish Angiolini should be kicked out of Scotland Now.

The english Crown has only put her here to imprison everyone, to force englsi zero-tolerance on Scots socity, to criminalise every Scot.

Elish Angiolini is an englsih crown spy and scottish traitor.
32

the.ally ,

max. 19/11/2008 18:55:19
Elish Angiolini is nothing more than a liar, a cheat, an englis crown lackie that does what she's told from the englsih establishment. They tell her to subordinate all Scots by disgracing them through moral turpitude; an old englsih crown trick. She famously called Scotland the rape capitol of the world; slander and libel because it;s not true.

Elish Angiolini should be kicked out of Scotland Now.

The english Crown has only put her here to imprison everyone, to force englsi zero-tolerance on Scots socity, to criminalise every Scot.

Elish Angiolini is an englsih crown spy and scottish traitor.
33

the.ally ,

MAX. 19/11/2008 19:15:51
Elish Angiolini is the englsih crown representative for law offices in Scotland. What that means is that all law offices, (police, sheriffs, court staff, lawyers, prosecutors, lords, privy counsel officers etc), held in Scotland are subject to the englsih crown. Now, considering that Scotland and the people of Scotland want independence, and the english crown doesn't want to lose it's holiday home, (Scotland), and, westminster would lose all our oil money, and 60% of UK GDP revenues, neither the english crown, nor the englsi crown government in westminster want Scotland to get independence. This is why elish angiolini wants to criminalise, abuse, oppress, subjugate, and disgrace Scotland and its peoples into submission by force, slight of hand, lies, cheating, and dis-honesty not to go for independence.

Why didn't elish angiolini charge and convict self-confessed criminal wendy alexander?
Why didn't elish angiolini prosecute the female school teacher from dundee that openly admitted to police that she raped her school pupil?

Elish angiolini doesn't care if she trashes Scotland's reputation, just as long as she gets what westminster and the englsih crown want; subordination by ANY means.

P.S, it was the englsih crown that demanded elish angiolini was kept in situ' when Alex Salmond was elected Scotland's first minister; the reason why is all of the above!

ANGIOLINI OUT OF SCOTLAND NOW; TRAITOR.
34

uno.who,

Livingston 19/11/2008 20:09:24
38-40 Where exactly is "englsih" ?

I suppose the lack of convictions in rape cases could be something to do with lack of evidence ? It's amazing that solicitors have certain "pet" crimes that they think the current law shouldn't apply to, but just try suggesting that dilution for anything they're defending !

We all know that guilty men go free, but the alternative is that innocent ones will be jailed. Can we really justify such a move away from a basic tenet of Scots Law ?
35

,

19/11/2008 20:19:08
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
36

james 1st,

hamilton nz 19/11/2008 22:40:06
to be fair then if a man is drunk will he be allowed to walk free from rape cases as he may not be in control of himself as he normally would.

the problem stems from the fact that there is often only two people present and no other person knows what has transpired between them. the man may well admit to having sex with the woman but claim there was consent of under the new term free agreement. the woman says that there wanst but by what measure can a jury be absolutly sure beyond reasonable doubt that the woman is not lying. they cant because they dont know whether she is lying or telling the truth. and to all you femenists out there some women do lie ,even under oath

we had one young university student locally who spent over a year in prison convicted of rape before his parents finally manged to get a rehearing, the girl admitted that she lied, and the young man was released

the girl punishment her name was supressed and she was moved to another university where nobody knew what she had done

that is why the conviction rate is so low

37

the.ally ,

max. 20/11/2008 00:31:16
uno-who? #41, and FLUB-a-DUB #42; my typing is fast and i don't normally re=read my posts before sending them; that's why I look as if I've stood all over the keypad then pressed 'comment'.

But, as far as the article goes, it's the worst suggstion I've ever heard from and englsih crown sheriff. I mean, it's not up to the english crown to question the jury; seems to me the englsih crown are trying an old trick of theirs, extend the boundaries of control by pushing the question to new meanings.

They've did it all through history; just look at the fisheries and water rights land-grab they've 'administered because of Scottish oil, the nulcear bases, and fisheries. I really think we need more 'Scottish' sheriffs back in town.

If you both remember correctly, about 6 months ago elish angiolini stated that the englsih crown prosecutions office in Scotland would be 'reducing the amount of rape cases it normaLLY prosecutes by one third'. NOW WHY WOULD SHE DO THAT?

I'll tell you; the english crown prosecution in Scotland have been prosecuting EVERY allegation of rape, sexual assault, and anything they could TRY label 'sexual'. Why? Simple, the more she prosecutes cases that have little or no evidence to suppport a prosecution, the better the #'s would look for her claim that 'Scotland is the rape capitol of the world'.

Think about it, if she takes a case to court she knows is never going to be convicted, she still gets a statistic of 'non-prosecution', which invaraibly pushes up the stat's for non-convictions. She's been doing this little englsih crown dirty trickery for ages now but nobody has noticed. That's how she gets ridiculously low stats's for her rape prosecutions in Scotland; BECAUSE SHE'S BEEN FORCING CASES THROUGH PROSECUTION THAT WOULD NEVER HAVE GONE THROUGH NORMALLY.

Come on people; wake up and start thinking Scottish.
allymax.

 

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