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RBS shares collapse as bank warns of record loss

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Gordon Brown: 'Angry' at RBS
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Published Date: 19 January 2009
SHARES in Royal Bank of Scotland plummeted today after the beleaguered lender revealed it was on course for a record annual loss for a UK company.
RBS shocked the City as it estimated bad debts and the lower value of its acquisitions could leave it as much as £28 billion in the red for 2008. This is higher than the £15 billion set by mobile phone group Vodafone in 2006.

Shares in the firm, which is 58% owned by the Government, slumped by more than 40% at one stage today, leaving the stock at a 23-year low.
RBS said a review of past acquisitions, most notably its share of Dutch bank ABN Amro, would result in a non-cash hit of between £15 billion and £20 billion. It also expects core losses of between £7 billion and £8 billion as a result of credit and market conditions in the fourth quarter of the year.

Asked about the record losses, Prime Minister Gordon Brown voiced his anger about the bank's decision-making, in particular international investments "that were clearly wrong investments".

He added: "Today's write-off by the Royal Bank of Scotland is for irresponsible losses accumulated in American sub-prime markets that partly derive from the acquisition of the Dutch bank ABN Amro."

However, he refused to say whether action should be taken against former chief executive Sir Fred Goodwin or other senior figures over "irresponsible" behaviour.

RBS also revealed today that the Government would increase its stake in the bank – likely to be around 70% – after the Treasury agreed to replace £5 billion of preference shares with new ordinary shares.

The move, which takes RBS a step closer to full-blown nationalisation, removes the annual cost of preference share dividends of £600 million and is expected to bolster the group's cashflow.

It said it intended to increase lending across its UK businesses by £6 billion, extending the lending commitment it gave in October in respect of UK mortgage and corporate customers.

Chief executive Stephen Hester, who took over from Sir Fred last year, said the dislocation of credit markets and the economic conditions continued to hit the bank hard.

He added: "We are making progress in recognising excess risk and dealing with it. In this context, the support we are receiving from Government benefits all our stakeholders and enables us to provide more customer support in return."

The group owns the Citizens commercial bank in the US and has a large investment banking presence in America, while it also operates across Asia and provides a wealth management service, through its private bank Coutts.

It gained a chunk of ABN Amro's European and global assets when it led a consortium takeover of the Dutch bank last year.

Page 1 of 1

 
1

The Strategist,

19/01/2009 10:28:17
Goodwin should have his knighthood removed!
2

mike3,

19/01/2009 10:38:29
Arc of prosperity was it?
3

Dave Simpson,

Edinburgh 19/01/2009 13:18:23
Surely there has been a massive deception and fraud by Sir Fred Goodwin and his senior executives at RBS.
We were led to believe that RBS were achieving massive profits over the last few years, and Goodwin and company were paid millions in salaries and bonuses as a result, but we learn now that his ego and greed have driven this company to the brink of collapse.
There has obviously been some very creative accounting going on here for some time, and he should be forced to hand back his millions and be interviewed by the serious fraud office.
4

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 19/01/2009 14:36:22
11.5 p !!!!!!!
5

DesertRatNM,

NM USA 19/01/2009 14:43:14
I thought our banks had dubious book-keeping; but, besides the loss of real money the Wall Street Journal this morning reported the RBS might have to write down another $20 billion in "Goodwill" - has RBS been out on the street shaking everybody's hand and giving them a pat on the back and listing this as an assest?
6

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 19/01/2009 14:43:31
5. ERM , nah. It was real money. Just because it wasnt yours. Your average long term RBS employee has lost about 60k this year on their shares. Ballpark figure likes.
7

Dr Mike,

Edinburgh 19/01/2009 14:49:32
Surely someone should simply write to the Chief Constable of L&B Police and report that, in respect of the ongoing collapse at RBS, a financial crime has possibly been committed and that an investigation is warranted.

If this doesn't happen, then there is no accountability at the top. Those millions taken from a massively indebted organisation were an advance on prudent stewardship versus enormous risk taking. The risk has come home to roost, now round up the conspirators.

I challenge The Scotsman to call for such a police investigation. It's time for this newspaper to stand up for justice and bring the outgoing Chairman, the former CEO and all of their cronies to book.
8

Vivas,

Edinburgh 19/01/2009 14:54:18
Where can one make a donation to RBS ???
9

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 19/01/2009 15:08:18
Ive worked in there too, still if you sit on yoru ass in there for 30 years i guess you deserve the perks. Mental Torture allowance.

Of course money is real, otherwise , give me your hourly rate . what age are you ?
10

Geoff,

sa 19/01/2009 15:16:18
Time to withdraw my meagre savings?
11

Donnie Murdo,

Western Isdles 19/01/2009 15:22:03
12

Yup. You'd be better off getting a few Krugerrands....
12

A Friend of Fernando Poo,

19/01/2009 15:26:56
So Brown is shocked at their careless investments and then rewards them by handing them more of our money?

Talk about sending a mixed message.
13

Class On Grass,

On the ledge looking down at the splatter 19/01/2009 15:26:59

Should the government be allowed to hand over all the taxpayers hard-earned cash to RBS and other banks. The have shown themselves to be inept and are too large a risk. Ergo the government should also all be jailed. Economic traitors.
Strip all the suited vermin of their assets, lock them up, public stocks on the streets till the tower re-opens, so they can walk through (and with) the traitor's gait.
Hang em high out to dry, like they did to us.
No sympathy, no mercy.
14

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 19/01/2009 15:29:39
Glitch in the system. Open this quick, RBS showing at 545 a share a jump of 1475%

http://newsvote.bbc.co.uk/2/shared/fds/hi/business/market_data/shares/3/23201/default.stm
15

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 15:38:42
It went as low as 10p.

What a disaster.

Salmond's independence ship has now sunk in uncharted waters.
16

argonaut,

east lothian 19/01/2009 15:45:45

goodwin and his cohorts should have charges brought against them, the greedy banks have almost brought this island to its knees in ways foreign powers could never have achieved. the customer goes into 0.01 deficit and faces £90 in possible charges, the banks go into massive deficit and its the taxpayer that bails them out - its bonkers.
personally i think some of this is political but never-the-less all this highlights the fundamental flaws in capitalism and how nations are at the mercy of the money men. greed, sheer greed prompted this
17

For Scotlands Future,

Vote for the SNP 19/01/2009 15:54:22
And the Government has just bought a greater stake in this Bank.

#10
Simple - PAY YOUR TAXES!!!!!!!!

#14
Do gives us it!! Maggie Brown and the Westminster government bought RBS without knowing what the problems were??
Maggie Brown is looking to the election and trying to distance himself from his time as Chancellor when he applauded companies like RBS when they were making fat profits and paying taxes. At that time he didn't care where the money came from or how it was earned. Now he is acting "holier than thou".
18

Tormod,

Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 15:55:56
10 How So! Please explain?

Also how many Scots support independence?

Is it just one?
19

For Scotlands Future,

Vote for the SNP 19/01/2009 15:57:28
Bank Bailout Mark II
It looks like there are going to be as many of these as there have been Maggie Broon "relaunches".
20

Tormod,

Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 16:02:56
22 On the banks there were two options let them go to the wall or nationalisation, this guddle that we have of part refinancing is a complete shambles.

The banks have us by the short and curlies, because they contain our property as security on loans they have provided.

And without credit the economy ceases to function.
21

St Caledonia,

19/01/2009 16:06:37
They turned a profit of 9 billion pound in 2006 did they not?
22

For Scotlands Future,

Vote for the SNP 19/01/2009 16:07:46
Maggie Broon: "...this is not to give more money to banks, but to give money to businesses and people.."

Then why don't you cut taxes and revise totally the tax structure you set up.

The economy is in deep-s##t, and bail-out mark III will come before Easter.

The man is a financial buffoon, and the Westminster government is only reacting to what is happening, but pretending to everyone he's in control.
23

Tormod,

Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 16:09:09
My experience tells me to let companies that have made bad decisions to to the wall, however banks are in a unique position because of the collective wealth that we have in them in the shape of mortgages, savings, pensions etc.

The failing banks should have been nationalised and opened up and the bad debt cleared out this would be expensive, but compare that to utter stupidness that is currently on display.

This second round will go on, because nobody is being honest about the amount of physical bad debt in the system.

It's time to clean the hoose from top to bottom.

24

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 16:10:07
The Quote of the year, 2008.

"The Scottish banks are amongst the most stable financial institutions in the world"

Alex Salmond February 2008

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/7224987.stm

Ooops.

He was obviously a top economist.
25

For Scotlands Future,

Vote for the SNP 19/01/2009 16:10:53
#23
That is some news to me - the economy is functioning!!!
26

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 16:12:19
Professor John Kay, a member of the first minister’s council of economic advisers, said that the economic consequences of Scotland going it alone could be disastrous.

Pointing to the impact of the credit crunch on Ireland, Norway and Iceland, described by Salmond in the past as an “arc of prosperity” of which an independent Scotland could be part, he said: “It’s much easier for small countries to mess up in times of economic instability. Take Iceland . . . it is the best poster-child for small countries that can’t go it alone.”

Kay, a visiting professor at the London School of Economics, said an independent Scotland could not have bailed out the Royal Bank of Scotland and HBOS, as Gordon Brown had.

“Scotland as an independent monetary entity probably wouldn’t have been big enough to bail out either HBOS, RBS or both,” he said. “If Scotland declared itself an independent country tomorrow its finances would look pretty dire.”
27

Tormod,

Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 16:15:00
Rufus @ 27 No I probably think others would easily claim that title.

He is a top economist, he and I and yourself make judgements on information that is in the public domain.

Do you think he or I or yourself would make those statements if we knew about the decisions being taken in the boardroom?

Or do you think that the FM is privvy to commercially confident information from RBS?
28

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 16:15:37
Rufus

So I take it you're ecstatic about the way the UK government is handling things?
29

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 16:16:07
30 Tormod,Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 16:15:00
Rufus @ 27 No I probably think others would easily claim that title.

He is a top economist,
======================================================
Is he?

Where is the evidence?

Any links?
30

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 16:18:44
#31 Hugh

Well Hugh yes I am.

I think they have no choice.

If it was a car company or a shop going down the tubes, the economy would survive.

When it is our banking system, whether you and I like it or not, we have to bail it out or everything goes under.
31

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 16:20:29
30 Tormod,Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 16:15:00
Or do you think that the FM is privvy to commercially confident information from RBS?
====================================================

So why is he always shouting his mouth off?

What was his erroneous 'spivs and speculators' comments based on?
32

Tormod,

Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 16:20:50
28. Well I would say that the economy is not functioning as we have major inbuilt job losses taking place, which will increase this year.

Commerce is decreasing over all functions of the economy, the obvious exception is insolvency!
33

Tormod,

Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 16:26:05
Rufus @ 32 check his CV!

The Spivs and Speculators line was used to describe those folk in the city who play the system for often personal gain, against the long term benefit of other folk.

In other words personal greed, this pursuit of personal greed comes at a cost to everybody.
34

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 16:30:00
Tormod

He blamed the 'Spivs and Speculators' on the downfall of HBOS.

It was subsequently shown that HBOS was days from going bust and was not in the slightest down to the 'Spivs and Speculators'.

The HBOS share price fell further, faster, after the short selling ban came into play.
35

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 16:30:57
Tormod

Where will I find Salmond's CV?

No doubt if he wrote it, I am sure it will say 'Top Economist'.
36

Tormod,

Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 16:48:27
Rufus which one I am taking to the grown up version or the version that is talking mince?

HBOS and RBS failed because of many problems, poor risk awareness and Sir Fred on his World Domination Tour. Do you think that the dealing on the share price was purely down to that, if that is the case nobody would have made any money?

Because all the long money would be selling off the stock as quickly as possible no short selling required, they would be getting out as fast as the trades could happen.

These banks failed because of decisions made at board level, if you want to trade quotes over the financial malestrom I am more than happy to do so.
37

Tormod,

Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 16:54:40
Rufus :-

http://www.scottish.parliament.uk/MSP/membersPages/alex_salmond/index.htm

If you would like to send me the info on the economic experience of either Gordon Brown, Alistair Darling.

The balls twins have only academic and political experience nothing in the real world of business P&L without the tax payer picking up the tab.
38

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 17:09:24
If the RBS shares fall another 2p they'll be the same price as a Johnston Press share.
39

Tormod,

Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 17:11:41
Rufus I and others including the FM can be charged as being guilty of having faith in these institutions, in that the way they did run there business before they began to act like investment banks and not retail banks.

I mean if you have £400bn in deposits, how in the hell could you make such a large mess of things? But they did didn't they.
40

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 17:21:59
39 TWO FINGERS TO THE THICK BRIT NATZ, SAOR ALBA.,19/01/2009 16:41:14
Rufus would be "practically punching the air," if he had a spine to hold him erect like the rest of humanity. Instead he is metaphorically punching the air such is his self hatred and anti-Scottish bile. Of all the sad Britnatz trolls invented on this forum your moniker is without doubt the most consistent in it's sadness and hatred. Do you sit on a chair of nails as you flail away at your keyboard day and night, it is a wonder you can see to type with the amount of spittle you produce.

What circumstances can produce something as septic and rancid as you are?
===================================================

What a sad, sad post.
41

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 17:25:30
42 Tormod,Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 16:48:27
Rufus which one I am taking to the grown up version or the version that is talking mince?

HBOS and RBS failed because of many problems, poor risk awareness and Sir Fred on his World Domination Tour. Do you think that the dealing on the share price was purely down to that, if that is the case nobody would have made any money?

Because all the long money would be selling off the stock as quickly as possible no short selling required, they would be getting out as fast as the trades could happen.

These banks failed because of decisions made at board level, if you want to trade quotes over the financial malestrom I am more than happy to do so.

===================================================
All you NatZ say I talk mince (funny that), so I guess you are talking to the mince one!

Anyway I digress.

I agree with this particular post. This is not at odds with what I have said or am saying.

So I am confused why you have posted this.

42

ddmc,

19/01/2009 17:29:16
who did the due diligence on the ABN Ambro deal ? needs shot along with the senior execs & board, a board is there to protect the shareholders from incompetance by the execs, all blinded by greed !
43

Tormod,

Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 17:29:56
Rufus I used the word mince to describe that your posts can go from sensible to out right stupidness or mince all I asked which Rufus has turned up?

There is nothing to be confused about, if you think that the quote from AS was the best of the year you are way off the mark.
44

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 17:30:34
47 Tormod,Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 16:54:40
Rufus :-

http://www.scottish.parliament.uk/MSP/membersPages/alex_salmond/index.htm
======================================================
I checked this out.

I cannot find the part that says he is a 'Top Economist'.

The Spook plays for Spartans. That does not make him a top footballer (sorry Spook).
45

Tormod,

Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 17:31:52
55 Securitisation was not only used to package bad debts, but was obviously used to deliver greed to a few and misery to many.
46

Banana Heid,

Ayrshire 19/01/2009 17:32:47
My wages are paid into RBS would now be a good time to change that or will my money be safe?
47

Tormod,

Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 17:33:17
Rufus so being a previous chief economist at RBS does not provide that criteria?

Again why don't you list the economic experience of the UK government?
48

Observer,,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 17:35:37
Rufus you're schizophrenic the other day you told me that the bank bail-out was a success when I said they should have been nationalised.

They will end up being nationalised, the govt should have done it at day one when they saw how bad it was.
49

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 17:39:08
52 Tormod,Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 17:11:41
I mean if you have £400bn in deposits, how in the hell could you make such a large mess of things? But they did didn't they.
=====================================================
In the RBS case ABN Amro did them in. Things would have been no where as bad if they had not made that silly move.
50

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 17:41:22
61 Observer,,Glasgow 19/01/2009 17:35:37
Rufus you're schizophrenic the other day you told me that the bank bail-out was a success when I said they should have been nationalised.
=====================================================
A bit of poetic licence there.

I said that the bailouts were successful in that 200,000+ jobs were saved, and that the alternative would have been economic meltdown.
51

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 17:43:57
60 Tormod,Auld Reekie 19/01/2009 17:33:17
Rufus so being a previous chief economist at RBS does not provide that criteria?
======================================================
Well erm I must be going blind.

Where on that link does it say chief economist?
52

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 17:45:47
59 Banana Heid,Ayrshire 19/01/2009 17:32:47
My wages are paid into RBS would now be a good time to change that or will my money be safe?
=====================================================

Your money wont be safe.

But if you want to pay it into my bank account I will look after it for you.

Account Name: Rufus T Firefly
Sort Code: 83-09-87
Account: 009765642

Thanks
53

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 19/01/2009 17:53:59
Well , this is the biggest chance to make money in our sorry lives. 11.6 p a share for RBS.

10k worth 100k in 3 years time ?

Unless of course they get fully nationalised.

54

,

19/01/2009 17:54:44
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
55

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 19/01/2009 17:57:34
There is something far wrong here. the govt and the taxpayer have been conned by RBS. The bail-out in November involved a £15bn share issue at 65p per share. This was guaranteed by the govt and the govt ended up having to take the whole issue as investors would not touch it. Now we can see why. Investors were quite right and the govt (in effect the taxpayer) is the mug who has picked up the tab.

RBS shares are now trading at 11p as against the 65p share isssue. In two months the govt's (ie our) shareholding has lost £12bn.

It would have been much better to let RBS go bust. Then we could have picked it up for nothing as was the case with Northern Rock. As it is £12bn of taxpaters assets have disappeared.
56

Observer,,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 18:09:16
68 That's why they should have been nationalised. They lied to the Govt about the extent of their exposure, or at the very least didn't confess. Perhaps they don't even know. Gordon has been way too trusting, well that's me being charitable there. He should have let them go bust and nationalised failed banks. This is urinating into the wind with our money.
57

,

19/01/2009 18:25:14
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
58

,

19/01/2009 18:29:15
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
59

Suomi,

Salo,Finland 19/01/2009 18:37:48
I tried to post a comment on this site about 45 minutes ago.While my observations may not have pleased everyone,it did not contain personal abuse or unexamined rhetoric.Very strange.However,I will try again.

In my opinion,recent events have added to the arguments for independence.For example:

1) The UK is part of an arc of insolvency.It is attempting to borrow its way out of the banking crisis which Gordon Brown conributed to,and my grandaughter will be paying for hisjudgement in her increased taxes,when many of us wont be around.

2)The stability of the banking system in Finland illustrates the opportunity that independance can offer.I accept that this is dependent on wise politicians,but if wise politicians are too secceed,they need the decision making power.

3) The fact thatr the arc of insolvency includes some of the largest nations,such as the USA and the UK,illustrates that economic prsperity has nothing whatsover to do with the size of a nation
60

Stan Butler,

19/01/2009 18:42:30

Could I suggest that the gnats attempt to retain what little credibility they have left by doing what their glorious leader has done?

Shut up. Keep a low profile. Say nothing. Hope it will all go away.
61

Churchill W.,

19/01/2009 18:45:44

Union dividend?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/7836740.stm
62

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 18:50:01
#70 and #71 Alasdair

Dear oh Dear.

What sad posts.
63

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 19/01/2009 18:54:40
69 Observer
"He should have let them go bust and nationalised failed banks"

That is, in effect, what I was saying. As it is RBS have conned the UK taxpayer out of £12bn. They must have had some idea in November of the scale of their losses. Things cannot have deteriorated so much in just two months. Expect numerous calls for an enquiry.
64

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 18:56:52
Well that's plan B now and sent bank shares into freefall. How about plan C?
65

Ugly George,

Edinburgh 19/01/2009 18:58:28
77 Hugh Roscombe
I'm afraid that we may well run out of alphabetical symbols at this rate.
66

Churchill W.,

19/01/2009 19:03:26
Sir Fred Goodwin would never make a good comedian, his sense of timing is seriously bad.
The RBS rights issue last year was timed to cream as much dosh from RBS shareholders as possible before the implosion of the group. Whilst that is sad, I do not recall RBS shareholders complaining that they had made too much dosh in the preceding years.
If Goodwin and his cabal issued a false prospectus for the rights issue they should be charged and put before a court. They should be held in custody as potential flight risks. To ensure fairness, the case of course would have to be heard, without a jury, before three judges in a special court in the Netherlands!
67

vinnie52,

19/01/2009 19:03:35
#68 & #69

The answer is simple.

Next stop is Plans I, M & F.

Way to go Fred!
68

Central Station,

19/01/2009 19:12:16
27 this is a good post which deserves to be debated further.

The truth is that what has happened to the Scottish banks is a national humiliation - there is no point in us burying our heads in the sand to deny it!

The politicians who tried to blame the spivs and speculators for our banks demise should be big enough to apologise to the country.

Some humble pie should be shared by the Scottish financial establishment and no more said for a very long time of Scottish financial prudence and the canny Scottish banker.

Fact is our best years are well behind us and going forward things are going to be very difficult as we try to find our place in the new world order.

Time for Salmond and his ilk to stop looking continually for things (however trivial) that can divide us and find a way forward to allow all of Britain to work it's way out of the sorry mess we find ourselves in.
69

Churchill W.,

19/01/2009 19:20:57
tommytommy # 40

Sir Fred Goodwin should be made to give a damn, one way, or another.
Don't expect Salmond to refer him to the Fraud Squad though. I bet Angus McNeil MP, SNP Informer In Chief, won't either, on Salmond's instructions of course.
70

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 19:25:24
Good Evening sm753.

Looks like a mental breakdown taking place at #72.

His post reminded me of 'One Flew Over the Cuckoos Nest'.

71

Jimmy Le Pie,

19/01/2009 19:25:40
smee,

You still posting drivel on here???

Thought after your humiliation last week you would have kept your mouth shut.

But I suppose fools like you never learn.

You are too stupid
72

Jimmy Le Pie,

19/01/2009 19:30:14
I think we should all ignore the halfwits smee71 and the other idiot Rufus.

We can't debate with them, because when they inevitably lose the argument, they resort to vile and abusive posting, faking posters whose boots they couldn't lace and generally ruin the thread.

Odious, poisoned creeps.
73

Observer,,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 19:34:41
64 Why are we talking about Alex Salmond ? Or the SNP ? It's got hee haw to do with them. It was Brown who was responsible for this. There is no doubt about that he had his fingers on the risk-based regulatory helm all the way.

Labour used to boast that their risk-based system of regulation was the best in the world. Aye right, it was one of the worst. The buck stops with them and no other.
74

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 19:36:24
I think this is all becoming a bit personal. What's the point?
75

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 19:37:17
No more boom - just bust.
76

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 19:39:10
#79 Jimmy, you sound angry. Whats wrong? I guess Kenny McAskill has you running scared. Understandable you are upset I suppose.
77

,

19/01/2009 19:40:04
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
78

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 19:40:08
I'm getting 5.4% interest.
79

Churchill W.,

19/01/2009 19:44:59
Observer # 80

Salmond, the Worlds greatest economist did not see this all coming, is that what you expect us to believe.
In the meantime he was selling us his, prosperous Scotland independence prospectus that he knew could NEVER be delivered.
Salmond is as much a snake-oil salesman as that "AH" Fred Goodwin.

"The Scottish banks are amongst the most stable financial institutions in the world"

Alex Salmond February 2008.

Salmond colluded with Goodwin in fleecing Scottish investors. Is Salmond a patriot, or, an opportunist?


80

,

19/01/2009 19:46:01
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
81

Central Station,

19/01/2009 19:46:35
64 The reason Salmond is included is because it is clear that he saw oil and the financial services sector based in Edinburgh as his passport to the promised land.

It is probably fair to say that he did not want to admit that something was sadly wrong and to him it was everyone's fault but the Scottish financial community.

The demise of the Scottish banks and the fall in the oil price make independence a fantasy. Do you even believe he will call a referendum? No chance, the financial turmoil will be his excuse to call it off.

Time to admit we are one small island that needs to stop arguing amongst ourselves and find a solution to solve our common problems.
82

Central Station,

19/01/2009 19:49:20
88 - sorry it was 80 I was referring to not 64

80 The reason Salmond is included is because it is clear that he saw oil and the financial services sector based in Edinburgh as his passport to the promised land.

It is probably fair to say that he did not want to admit that something was sadly wrong and to him it was everyone's fault but the Scottish financial community.

The demise of the Scottish banks and the fall in the oil price make independence a fantasy. Do you even believe he will call a referendum? No chance, the financial turmoil will be his excuse to call it off.

Time to admit we are one small island that needs to stop arguing amongst ourselves and find a solution to solve our common problems.
83

,

19/01/2009 19:51:10
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
84

Observer,,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 19:56:03
I don't think ANY mainstream politician apart from Vince Cable can claim to have predicted this. But nonetheless it was Labour's insane policy of, as they said

''the risk-based approach of the future that Britain is now pioneering is fouinded on a different view of the world - trust in the responsible company, the educated consumer, and the informed employee''

That got us into this unholy mess. Every other sector of the economy is regulated. We in the public sector can't bloody breathe for regulators, they are crawling out of the walls, but Labour cut these people loose to do what they have done.
85

Churchill W.,

19/01/2009 19:59:58
When Salmond made this statement,
"The Scottish banks are amongst the most stable financial institutions in the world"
were Scottish investors not entitled to rely on the opinion of Scotland's First Minister, who it is affirmed by his supporters, is an outstanding economist?
Does Salmond stand by his opinion of that date, or, does he admit that he was grandstanding?
At the very least, Salmond should be held liable for some of the losses experienced by investors who took Salmond's word that there was efficacy in investing in The RBS. Being the weasel that Salmond is, he will attempt to weasel out of his responsibility; but, that is what we expect of the weasel FM; Salmond.
86

K McDonald,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 20:00:34
Alex Salmond, Top Economist:-

Published Date: 18 April 2008
Salmond gives RBS backing

"And Mr Salmond, a former RBS economist, said: "The Royal Bank of Scotland is one of the most powerful and high-performing financial institutions in the world."

http://www.scotsman.com/politics/Salmond-gives-RBS-backing.3998153.jp?CommentPage=1&CommentPageLength=1000
_____________
August 8, 2008
"RBS is fine, says Salmond after first loss"

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/scotland/article4488909.ece
___________
18th Sept 2008
Salmond fury at 'bunch of spivs' behind bank crisis

"Mr Salmond said: "I have not a word of criticism for the two banks.."

http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/scotlandseconomy/Salmond-fury-at-39bunch-of.4503240.jp
____________
08th October 2008
RBS chiefs are facing fresh calls for their heads after banks bail-out

"Scottish First Minister Alex Salmond today said the speculation surrounding the future of Sir Fred was 'not helpful' ......"

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1072750/RBS-chiefs-facing-fresh-calls-heads-banks-bail-out.html

87

Observer,,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 20:06:10
I think some people - unionists - are focusing way too much on the RBS as a chance to talk Scotland down. They have been very badly managed, as have many of the other banks. There is still a lot more to come before HMG finally nationalise the bust banks. But whether Salmond did or did not have a crystal ball is irrelevant. Labour have done this to us by cutting the bankers loose to do whatever they wanted. Labour boasted about that. They said their system - based on risk and an assessment of whether to regulate at all - was the best in the world.

Address that.
88

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 20:10:40
#93 Excellent collection of links!
89

Churchill W.,

19/01/2009 20:10:47
Alasdair mac Alasdair Mór Mac an Righ # 90

Why do you not check out my ISP address. You will find I have never been "Rufus."

Salmond made a statement, that with hindsight, could not stand up. Should he not have been more careful with his statement when he knew that there was an RBS rights issue on the horizon? How many people relied on Salmond's glowing reference for the Scottish banking industry and invested accordingly?

I hope that some investors take Salmond to court for his statement, at least it will be tested by a court. Salmond's problem is his voluminous gob and his statement has, possibly, lead many Scottish people to financial penury, instead of prosperity.
90

,

19/01/2009 20:17:35
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
91

Central Station,

19/01/2009 20:19:09
94 The problem is the banks were talked up by some as if they could do no wrong and their demise is very embarrassing for Salmond.

No one wants to put Scotland down far from it, I for one am a proud Scot but also a unionist. Without the nationalists looking for any excuse to justify their separatist cause these polarisation of views would not occur.

Salmond is a divisive politician, but pointing out his shortcomings should not be confused with an anti Scottish agenda. He is not Scotland, he does not have the mandate to speak for it and hopefully never will.
92

Observer,,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 20:21:44
88 Nonsense. There's no difference between the Scottish financial community and the English financial community. Or the Welsh. They were all at it. This is a UK banking crisis it is not unique to Scotland. Whether we are independent or not we're still going to have to pay for this one way or t'other. So it's no impediment to independence at all, quite the contrary.
93

Churchill W.,

19/01/2009 20:27:16
Observer # 94

Salmond probably thinks you are a sweetheart.

Salmond will be sweating into his "Jockey Shorts" the consequences of his endorsement of The RBS shortly before their, questionable, 2008 rights issue. RBS shareholders were induced into investing £12Billion in what was a very successful issue.
How many invested on the basis of Salmond's assertion that; "The Scottish banks are amongst the most stable financial institutions in the world?"

Did Salmond know that his statement was incorrect, or, did he just make his statement without regard for the veracity of what he said? What steps did Salmond take to ensure that what he asserted was correct?

Whatever, Salmond is a very sick joke and there are many financial victims of the RBS rights issue that I hope will never forgive him. I doubt they will!
94

K McDonald,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 20:28:20
#94
Salmond was one of the most vocal supporters of minimal regulation of said insolvent banks. He supported the utterly incompetent management and blamed the phantom short-sellers for their sudden demise. He never said word about Gordon Brown’s love affair with the City brigade; the former RBS economist simply preferred the spivs of Charlotte Square.

Salmond was perfectly content to be in the company of the bankers’ so long as they were contributing substantially to the projected GNP of an independent Scotland.

To this day he has not uttered a word of criticism of the former management of RBS and HBOS.
95

arc of insolvency,

19/01/2009 20:28:40
Let it be known that talking RBS down is not talking Scotland down it is just talking sense. It gives us an opportunity to further reiterate the lunacy that is the SNP.

Talking Scotland down is when SNP supporters come on here spouting hate about anyway who dares to disagree with them.

All the oil it Salmonds back garden couldn't sort out this mess and the SNP has no answer to it. They can't even do there usual and blame Westminster!!!!Roll on 2010.
96

arc of insolvency,

19/01/2009 20:30:28
Ah this is heaven. All intelligent people on here talking sense instead of the usual SNP supporters hanging about here all day. Let them have it folks they have no answers!!
97

Observer,,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 20:33:43
102 103 Quite frankly I don't give two hoots what Salmond said. He was on the outside looking in. It was who was on the inside looking out that matters. And it was Brown. The man's bonkers he is certifiable.
98

Steve Evans,

Malta 19/01/2009 20:34:29
What a Mess!
99

Observer,,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 20:35:53
105 Well you seem somewhat bereft of answers too dear, if you don't mind me saying that.
100

arc of insolvency,

19/01/2009 20:41:19
There you go Observer, Ireland talking about the problems of the Euro, Salmond is an ecconomic genuis!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/globalbusiness/4285331/Help-Ireland-or-it-will-exit-euro-economist-warns.html
101

Observer,,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 20:43:17
109 Excuse me ? To quote Fifi La Bon Bon that is a bit of what-aboutery. We are talking about the UK banking system here. Not Ireland. Not Salmond. But the UK banking system. Who got us into this mess, would you say ?
102

Churchill W.,

19/01/2009 20:48:01
Observer # 106

Salmond is a insider where the Scottish banking industry is concerned. To suggest that he is not is a lie. What did he know in advance of the failure of The RBS? Why did he endorse The RBS weeks before its failure?
Salmond is up to his neck in this.
103

Observer,,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 20:52:06
112 He certainly has links to the Scottish banking sector. If you think he knew in advance of the failure of the RBS and conned people into buying shares I suggest you call the Police and report him. Personally I think he tried to help boost confidence in the banking system as they all did. He is a mainstream politician - you actually can't get a sheet of paper between the Libs, Labour, SNP, or Tories in their support for the banking system. Me I feel somewhat differently. But it was Labour who cut them loose, that is a fact.
104

Forward not Back,

19/01/2009 21:04:33
Well, at least we know why the tram line is being built. It's to link the Civil Service building in Leith with the new Civil Service building at Gogarburn.
105

Steve Evans,

Malta 19/01/2009 21:14:39
Where does this leave the Union?
106

Observer,,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 21:24:16
Final thought, RBS were a player in the PFI game. With all this carry on does that not mean that, in effect, a lot of these projects have been brought back into public ownership ? It's a funny old world right enough.

107

Tris,

19/01/2009 21:29:01
~34. There were spivs... Watch Evan Davis's programmes on Wednesday evenings.... Inside the City. They were/are spivs. They didn't know what they were doing, but they knew it was bringing in unbelievable amounts of money, so no one had the nerve to say NO.

Everyone knew it was wrong; everyone knew it was predicated on ever increasing house prices; everyone knew that at some stage the price of houses would start to fall, as they became out of the reach of more and more of the public. (When only the Dukes of Rothsay and Sutherland could afford to buy a house, and didn't need to buy one, the bottom would be right out of the market.)

Oh yes, there were a pile of spivs, and a shedload of people who hadn't a clue what was going on, but were being paid to be in charge. And city regulators (FSA) who were far too busy collecting fat bonuses and "having good lunches" to ever look in the direction of banks. And that was all overseen by the Bank of ENGLAND (not Britain you'll notice), and in particular, in the hands of the Deputy Governor, who, if I am not mistaken, was the same man who had been in charge of the Home Office uintil John Reid declared it unfit for purpose.

An idiot, in short, who seems to have failed at whatever he has done.
108

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 21:38:59
Rufus

"#93 Excellent collection of links!"

... but probably posted by your good self.
109

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 21:40:47
Arc of Insolvency, Churchill etc

You give wa­nks a bad name.
110

,

19/01/2009 21:45:44
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Reason:
111

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 21:47:32
Churchill

You sir are a t­it. You know Ef-all but pretend you are in the know. Take a hike.
112

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 21:50:03
Peeps all gone. No point. Mañana.
113

The Leith Cowboy BAM BAM,

Bruxelles 19/01/2009 21:51:32
How much did you lose Hugh ? Never bought an RBS share in my life.

Buy tomorrow at 7p.
114

K McDonald,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 21:55:46
#118

He are some more words of wisdom from the "fully qualified economist".

Tuesday, 30th September, 2008
Salmond calls on Gordon Brown to guarantee savings fully, as in Ireland

"Mr Salmond told BBC Scotland that guaranteeing deposits would be a ‘very strong declaration of confidence’ in such uncertain times. The First Minister feels that measures ’similar but not identical’ to the action taken in Ireland would have ‘the three benefits of instilling confidence, protecting depositors and preventing runs on individual banks’.>>>

http://forargyll.com/2008/09/salmond-calls-on-gordon-brown-to-guarantee-savings-fully-as-in-ireland/

_____________________
Great idea, wasnt it Nats? Well the market ('spivs and speculators') has called the Irish government's bluff.


Monday, 19 January 2009,
Irish bank shares plunge in value

>>>>Shares in Ireland's three remaining publicly-listed banks have plunged following the nationalisation of Anglo Irish Bank.

In afternoon trade, Allied Irish shares were down 62%, Bank of Ireland fell 49% and mortgage and insurance specialist Irish Life & Permanent dropped 41%.<<<<<



115

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 22:01:52
Good evening Leith Cowboy.

I've never bought any shares in my life. I'd rather spend my money enjoying myself. Any spare money I had was spent wisely with a long term view of future profits.
Savings rates in the UK? Mince. Here I am getting 5.4%. It's not a fortune, but it's 100% safe. I'm buying properties in the UK just now. Not expensive ones, but ones that will pick up first after this fiasco has ended.

Dear Christ Almighty - if I can make a profit how the hell can "professionals" make a complete (_!_) of it?
Buy in a recession and sell later. It's not rocket science.


btw - don't buy rockets.
116

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 22:06:05
124 K McDonald,Glasgow

You have posted some good stuff tonight!

You have shown up Salmond for the Political Grandstanding Buffoon that he is.
117

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 22:06:39
ps ... 1 bed & 2 bed flats will be the first to pick up. It's not a new theory. Smaller properties for the first time buyer and for people "sizing down" are ALWAYS the first to pick up. Sheesh. What's the problem?
118

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 22:07:40
"K McDonald is an ar­se - pure and simple.
119

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 22:08:41
118 Hugh Roscombe,19/01/2009 21:38:59
Rufus
"#93 Excellent collection of links!"
... but probably posted by your good self.
==================================================

Errrmmmmm NO!

Whereabouts in Spain are you Hugh?

Anywhere near Nerja?
120

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 22:08:45
Rufus

Stop posting as K McDonald - it's dreadfully dull.
121

DougMack,

America 19/01/2009 22:10:00
I am an American of Scots ancestry who holds preferred shares in RBS. This bank is now as miserable as my Bank of America that I just sold as it is in deep trouble as well--all for the same reassons--an ambitious CEO who didn't know when to say no to takeovers and mergers. An interesting quote form our President Thomas Jefferson, from the early 1800s, was in the paper the other day: "The banking establishment can cause more damage than standing armies." We are now painfully aware of how true that observation is.
122

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 22:10:56
Rufus

"Whereabouts in Spain are you Hugh? Anywhere near Nerja?"
Hmm - I wonder how you knew that. I'm in Frigiliana - 6 minutes by car and half an hour by mule. J'accuse.
123

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 22:11:56
Rufus

Do you post on Andalucia.com?
124

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 22:13:15
Hugh

I found your address on a map
125

K McDonald,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 22:15:16
128 Hugh Roscombe,19/01/2009 22:07:40

"I'm buying properties in the UK just now. Not expensive ones, but ones that will pick up first after this fiasco has ended"

"K McDonald is an ar­se - pure and simple.

__________

And you have the economic accumen of Alex Salmond if you are today calling the bottom and buying property.
126

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 22:15:54
Rufus (possible neighbour - maybe called Alan)

Fancy a pint? There are 45 bars in this village of 2,200 vecinos! With the current crisis they are all reducing prices. Pished for €2.00 (McCaskill wouldn't like it).
127

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 22:16:34
Hugh, check this in google maps.

Your street is there.

http://maps.google.es/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=es&geocode=&q=via+adda&sll=46.136237,9.554222&sspn=0.007226,0.013733&ie=UTF8&ll=46.137991,9.553621&spn=0.007226,0.013733&z=16&iwloc=addr
128

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 22:18:44
Mr McDonald

I am currently buying property at 20% below market value.
If you think I'm throwing money down the drain I'm sorry. It's worked for me since 1992. I don't intend to stop now. Thanks for your concern though.

(snigger)
129

Churchill W.,

19/01/2009 22:19:53
Observer # 113

I think you are right, but, I will wait until a few months before the next Scottish assembly elections to make a report to the police, wait till the evidence matures a bit and the thieves fall out and start trying to make deals to avoid prosecution.

Hugh Roscombe # 119

Where did I mention "the arc of insolvency?"
Scotland is insolvent, you are correct to bring that point to the argument. But, there are a lot more people insolvent in Scotland now because of Salmond's endorsement of the insolvent Scottish banking system than before. I hope you are one.
With Salmond as FM in Holyrood do you seriously think that a few rude epithets cut any ice? Salmond is a moron; the morons, moron, of which you are an example.
130

DougMack,

South Carolina, USA 19/01/2009 22:20:44
Anyone care to speculate on the fate of the dividend of the preferred stock? With this huge debt load uncovered, I can see this going away. I received dividends in late December before this latest batch of bad news.
131

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 22:22:34
132 Hugh Roscombe,19/01/2009 22:10:56

I hope to be in Nerja over Easter. Not booked yet.

What is the weather like down there in April?
132

K McDonald,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 22:23:33
Hugh
I am currently buying property at 20% below market value.>>

20% below what market value? Do you mean the hyper-inflated property bubble peak "value"? You are sure that 20% below said peak-bubble value will not become 40% by this time next year?

If I had cash in a Euro bank account paying 5.4% (around 2% above Euro base rate) I would keep it there.

133

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 22:24:39
Rufus

The map you posted was a map of a town in Italy! I am in Spain. Unlike other posters I have never hidden the fact of where I stay. If you go to the town hall in Frigiliana and ask for me they'll give you my address. All you need is my name. If you don't know my name (I mentioned it on the Herald 2 months ago), just ask for "Chainsaw Dave."
134

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 22:26:03
"Salmond is a moron; the morons, moron, of which you are an example."

Only morons would miss out the apostrophe. Morons' moron or even moron's moron would be more correct.
135

Churchill W.,

19/01/2009 22:26:07
Hugh Roscombe # 127

I know someone that is trying to divest himself of a few one and two bedroomed flats. What he needs is a sucker, like you, with small aspirations and no foresight.
136

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 22:28:07
143 Hugh Roscombe,19/01/2009 22:24:39
Rufus
The map you posted was a map of a town in Italy!
====================================================

I know that but there was a street name on that map named after you.
137

The Strategist,

19/01/2009 22:31:57
RBS is part of that arc of economic and managerial incompetence that includes No 10 Downing St, the Treasury and the City of London.

No amount of anti SNP rhetoric can possibly disguise the fact that this economic collapse and the strong possibility of a full blown depression and even civil unrest is entirely the responsibility of the City and the Govt.

Worse, today a European Commission report suggests that Britain’s manufacturing base was now too small to take advantage of the weak pound.

That's not down to Alex Salmond or the SNP either.
138

Central Station,

19/01/2009 22:32:27
120 Hugh Roscombe

I did not contribute to this thread to be abused.

This could be an excellent forum for debate but is spoiled by those who only want to abuse each other.

I won't be back.
139

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 22:33:10
Rufus (coming to Nerja) asking about the weather

It all depends mate. It can be 70º+ or it can be pi­ssing down at 65º. We're all over the place just now. Something to do with climate change. Try this site.

http://www.nerjaweather.com/

It gives you stats for the last few years.

On a more serious note, ask nearer the time and I'll respond. Hell I'll even buy you a pint! You'll get me at Methalions@hotmail.com
140

Tris,

19/01/2009 22:33:50

Churchill... There won't be any Scottish Assembly elections, on the basis that there isn't a Scottish assembly. Probably Blair would have liked it to be, but it isn't. It's a parliament.

I'd do it now though, semantics apart. Go on, bring the evidence you have to the police. Otherwise, are you not witholding evidence of a crime and thereby a party to said crime after the fact?
141

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 22:34:26
Churchill

"But, there are a lot more people insolvent in Scotland now because of Salmond's endorsement of the insolvent Scottish banking system than before. I hope you are one."

Sorry to disappoint. I'm a tad rich. Read 'em and weep.
142

,

19/01/2009 22:37:13
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Reason:
143

Newton_Invented_Gravity,

19/01/2009 22:37:53
What concerns me is that all the people who ran up these huge losses will have already made their fortunes and will be able to retire rich whilst everyone else deals with the consequences.
In other words, it was actually in their interests to try and destroy the financial system.
144

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 22:38:23
Central Station

"I won't be back."

You'll be sorely missed.
145

Churchill W.,

19/01/2009 22:40:00
Hugh Roscombe # 144

I note you do not deny Salmond's complicity in the fleecing of RBS shareholders.
I spoke to the town hall in Frigiliana as you advised. You are know there as Senor Soberano: the town drunk!
For those that don't know, Soberano is a cheap Spanish brandy.
The mayor said that you think you are buying property there cheaply, but, that the locals always inflate the prices to self-satisfied foreigners pretending that they have money, who go there to patronise those locals. The locals are laughing at you who buying a pig in a poke; properties that the locals don't want.
Any apostrophes missing? '''''''
146

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 22:42:25
Okay Hugh thanks.
147

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 22:42:59
This is now silly. For the past 30 years I made the mistake of buying cheaply and selling at the peak. For this I am accused of being a sucker. Whatever ...

Mañana.

ps - Rufus - Seriously - if you are in Nerja give me a call. I'll post my mobile number later. Off to buy another flat on Thursday. If I've made an error I'll post my apologies to Churchill.

Sod it. The number is 00 34 669 639 606
148

Rufus-T-Firefly,

19/01/2009 22:43:58
Hugh the current weather on that website is for December 28th!
149

,

19/01/2009 22:46:04
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Reason:
150

,

19/01/2009 22:47:25
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151

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 22:49:56
Churchill

Sigh ..... I'm buying in the UK! I've enough properties here. With the strong euro, the money I transferred at 1.50 to the pound (2006) has made me a small fortune.

Let's assume I transferred (just for interest) 500,000 GBP at €1.50. That got me €750,000. I now transfer it back at €1.10 to the pound. I now have 675,000 GBP. That's an extra 175,000 GBP. I'm not an economist but I seem to get things right.

Next.
152

Tris,

19/01/2009 22:51:36
160

Bit childish that, wasn't it
153

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 22:55:15
Churchill

What's the obsession with dicks? Do you feel inferior?
To be honest - the neighbours here say, "Dinero sin salud no vale nada." (Money without health isn't worth anything). Luckily I have my health AND money.

(Not that it's any of your business, but in the dick stakes I'd gladly give up my wealth for a reduction in wi­lly size. It's just far too long).
154

Hugh Roscombe,

19/01/2009 23:01:29
Too personal. G'night.
155

K McDonald,

Glasgow 19/01/2009 23:06:23
161 Hugh Roscombe,
That's an extra 175,000 GBP>>>

Transfer it back then, big-shot. Forfeit the 5.4% Euro account interest + accumulating Sterling depreciation against Euro (btw, please provide info on the Spanish bank that is offering 3% above ECB base rate).

Your 175 grand will be worth less this time next year. Probably wiped out. Unless of coarse Broon manages not only to force banks to lend, but also force suckers to borrow enough to artificially keep the property bubble from deflating further.

Cash is king. The dilema is which cash to hold.
156

Yok Finney,

Ross-shire 19/01/2009 23:32:08
"Today's write-off by the Royal Bank of Scotland is for irresponsible losses accumulated in American sub-prime markets that partly derive from the acquisition of the Dutch bank ABN Amro."

The Dutch have their (better reported) point of view too. About this acquisition business.

However how do you become an oligarth? Do you have to be a bone fide russian criminal?

It would be simpler if I was loaned £billion or so. For my shipping business. It would actually build ships in Scotland and let's take it one at a time.

There's alot of design-work first, but as an oligarth, we could lay a keel.
157

,

19/01/2009 23:34:33
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
158

mr angry,

ayrshire 19/01/2009 23:34:41
163# Its hard to believe but you are more boring than Ruffarse
159

lulach mac gille coemgain,

19/01/2009 23:59:37
This is all actually, extremely funny ! And re-enforces the fact - you can’t eat money and live !

 

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