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Top Chinese minister fails to meet Salmond but SNP denies snub

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Published Date: 10 April 2009
By CAROLYNNE WHEELER
in Beijing
A SENIOR minister with the Chinese government failed to attend an event with Alex Salmond in Beijing yesterday, as a leading academic warned the Chinese government would be wary of being too enthusiastic with separatist administrations such as the Scottish Government.
The First Minister was due to take part in a public question-and-answer session with Wan Gang, the Chinese minister of science and technology to discuss tie-ups between Scotland and China on renewable energy.

But although Mr Wan was billed to appear, he did not show up and his place as one of the main speakers was taken by Li Junfeng, deputy director of a government agency on energy research.

The was no suggestion from the Chinese that Mr Wan had pulled out of the meeting because Mr Salmond represented a separatist administration, but one leading academic stressed yesterday that the Chinese authorities would be wary of being seen to be too friendly with a separatist government.

Willy Lam, a professor at Hong Kong's Chinese University, said: "Beijing's relations with the UK in general are very good, partly given the fact that when (president] Hu Jintao was in London for the G20 meeting, he was given VIP treatment.

"You can see in photographs he was shown standing next to the Queen and in some shown standing next to Gordon Brown. Even (US president Barack] Obama wasn't given this placement.

"I imagine Beijing would not play up the fact that this leader who is visiting is advocating separatist sentiments, because that might prove embarrassing."

A spokesman for Mr Salmond later said the First Minister had met the people he had both hoped and needed to.

The spokesman said: "We've had an excellent reception and we have exactly the events and exactly the meetings that reflect our mission, between Hong Kong, Shanghai and Beijing."

He added: "We're here to do business, frankly, and we've done excellent business and supported a range of Scottish industries across the board."

However, it has become clear over the course of two Scottish ministerial visits, this one from Mr Salmond and one last month from Scottish Secretary Jim Murphy, that the latter has been accorded a higher-profile reception because he represents the UK government.

Mr Murphy met Yang Jiechi, the powerful and influential foreign minister, during his visit while Mr Salmond is only now expected to meet Wang Yong, the minister responsible for administration of quality control, later today.

Academics and experienced observers believe this was a deliberate move by the Chinese government, making sure it did not give higher prominence to the leader of a separatist administration than to a representative of the UK.


Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 10 April 2009 1:14 AM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Scottish National Party
 
1

,

09/04/2009 21:56:36
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2

webwise,

Scotland 09/04/2009 22:19:06
A comment posted yesterday deserves to be reproduced:

"There is an important place for the Record/Mail in the Scottish media, but they will have to bring their editorial policies into the real world. That world is a complex place, and the readers are hungry for information that will allow them to understand it in language that means something to them. If you like, the Record/Mail should be presenting brief executive summaries and analyses of all the important news and trends for the common man and woman.

There is no reason why that cannot be factual and objective, while avoiding sensationalism, but it does demand intellectual qualities of a high order. It is a good deal more difficult to extract and analyse the core of an issue than just to slap every fact - or selected facts - down on paper under a lurid headline.

In Austria, a country of Scotland's size, the tabloid Kronen Zeitung sells more than three million copies every day, with corresponding advertising income. It does this by employing the best and most highly-qualified journalists in the trade, whose synopses are valued by busy magnates and the intellectually challenged alike.

Above all, the Record/Mail will have to get to grips with the fact that the era of Labour Scotland is now at an end for good. It is now time to stop being a political mouthpiece, to declare editorial independence, and raise the intellectual level of the papers in terms that people can understand."

The Astrian newpaper in question sells just over 1 million, but is read by 3 million, however the general thrust of the comment is sound.
3

,

10/04/2009 00:15:31
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4

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 00:26:12

"I imagine Beijing would not play up the fact that this leader who is visiting is advocating separatist sentiments, because that might prove embarrassing." said the Hong Kong Chinese University professor of whom no one had ever heard.

"However, running down protesting students with army tanks in Tiananmen Square THEN meeting politicians from overseas IS acceptable."

An SNP spokesperson said, "Hong Kong phooey!"

5

,

10/04/2009 00:42:31
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6

Mashimaro,

China 10/04/2009 00:58:30
#6 Los Angeles: Read the Tienanman papers and find out the truth. No one was "run down by tanks". Don't buy into your country's lying propaganda about an event that happened years ago.

To the rest of you: China's economy is growing. How's yours doing?
7

Dark Lochnagar,

http://darklochnagar.blogspot.com 10/04/2009 01:04:45
#10 OK then you tell us what is happening in China. We want to be informed by someone who doesn't have an angle.
8

SW1,

10/04/2009 01:12:49
Comment@10 What a GREAT idea.......Our country needs the skills and tech and we are across there helping communism succeed.........

I have just the tune :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4SrCMpP9H0g&feature=rec-HM-r2&fmt=18

9

Uistman,

Scotland 10/04/2009 01:41:32
15 Canes ,indeed I was driving up from England today and on BBC Radio 5 they covered his story.
Even had a good interview with Alex Neil.
a genuine interest and admiration by our English neighbours to this excellent announcement on council housing.
Indeed it was also stated that in Lab/Lib 8 years or misrule they managed on average 6 homes a year!!!

Radio Scotland , BBC Scotland , The Scotsman ???
We are only allowed bad news stories about SNP.
it really is quite pathetic , and dangerous ,today it is anti SNP bias , tomorrow it could be..........
10

,

10/04/2009 01:59:31
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11

Edward,

10/04/2009 02:11:37
Wasnt this also stated in an article by Labours spokesperson Hamish MacDonnell the day before?
Just more guff from the very failing Scotsman
The Scotsman is being very purileand not actually reporting what is happening during the First Ministers visit to China
12

Edward,

10/04/2009 02:13:37
Thankfully there are other sources available
Such as the China Org website
http://www.china.org.cn/business/news/2009-04/08/content_17568854.htm
This is a large article on part of the visit
13

tartangladbach,

edinburgh 10/04/2009 02:17:06
would it not be interesting to see a breakdown of which political parties scotsman employee's are paid up members of ??
14

Edward,

10/04/2009 02:23:50
Im curious as to how Jim Murphy described to the Chinese as to what he actually does? or what the Chinese thought he did?
The only apt description is perhaps Governor General appointed by the London Government
15

Edward,

10/04/2009 02:25:35
A bit more possitive over in the Herald
with 'Alex Salmond promotes Scotland's whisky industry in China'
http://www.theherald.co.uk/news/news/display.var.2500460.0.alex_salmond_promotes_scotlands_whisky_industry_in_china.php
16

Yok Finney,

Ross-shire 10/04/2009 02:56:03
Dalai McConnel speaking from his villa in Spain told how the scottish state had kept him in permanent exile not recognising his divine appointment to rule scotland's microserfs.
17

Lausanne Jellies,

10/04/2009 03:13:46
#24 alcohol abuse ring a number of bells with you
18

Lausanne Jellies,

10/04/2009 03:17:34
#18 nice anti-Scottish angle you have there. Makes you proud to be a Scot if you are one
19

Lausanne Jellies,

10/04/2009 03:26:25
#23 Alex Salmond - First Minister of Scotland
Jim Murphy - Secetary of state for Scotland
One clearly seems to say what it is and the other leave you wondering what for
20

Helene,

Ontario, Canada 10/04/2009 03:31:46
SNP/Salmond should have anticipated this type of snub. It was surely a redundant trip anyway. My experience in China (I am a frequent visitor) is that the Chinese understand exactly the nature/set up of UK and its four components, as it is taught explicitly in the standard English textbooks that millions of Chinese use in schools. Scottish culture/music/heritage is greatly respected in its own right as part of the British mosaic. I'm quite sure the Chinese will be very happy to trade with any/all parts of UK, but they see it quite clearly as one country.
21

Yok Finney,

Ross-shire 10/04/2009 03:41:09
We don't have a scottish whisky industry anymore. It's all a subsiduary of multinational alcopops. Mashing your own barley and stilling it is stricly illlegal. But good luck to you.
22

Scotindy,

Los Angeles 10/04/2009 04:31:28
It is pretty obvious to us SCOTS that OUR FIRST MINISTER is not the PM of the DISUNITED KINGDOM. For political resonse they avoided the question. SCOTTISH INDEPENDENCE AS SOON AS POSSIBLE. Have a nice day!!!!!!!
23

,

10/04/2009 05:52:26
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24

donald,

glasgow 10/04/2009 06:08:45
Top Scots Readers Snub the Northbritishperson. Sales Separated from Bridge St Brits.
25

Colkitto,

River Clyde 10/04/2009 06:16:04
Another day, another anti-SNP headline.

british democracy at work eh ?
26

Grahamski,

Falkirk 10/04/2009 06:37:53
2
Webwise,
Why would an inaccurate rant deserve to be reproduced?
This poster claims that Austria and Scotland are the same size. No, they are not. He claims 3 million sales of the Kronen which is a ridiculous claim. He then claims that the newspaper in question makes advertising revenue on 3 million sales, no it doesn't. Why this person would hold up an anti-semitic and racist newspaper as a shining beacon of truth that Scottish newspapers should aspire to is beyond me.
He is quite clearly a buffoon and the last thing his witless opinions deserve is to be reproduced.
27

,

10/04/2009 06:47:33
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28

Grahamski,

Falkirk 10/04/2009 06:51:57
37
John,
You seem to have managed to put a capital letter before Scotland but missed England's. Are you perhaps a bit of a nutter?
29

valhalla-the-reckoning,

10/04/2009 06:59:52
38 - Grahamski - Only a nutter would read so much into a simple typo. Lay of the weed , it's too early.
30

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 07:11:09
36 Grahamski,

The same source you quote for information on “Kronen Zeitung” describes “The Scotsman” as being “Centre Right Unionist, critical of the Scottish National Party”.

That description rather succinctly sums up the Labour Party, dontcha think?
31

Colkitto,

River Clyde 10/04/2009 07:25:10
The political landscape has changed in Scotland. This is not reflected in any main-stream newspaper.
We have a largely unpopular government at Westminster, in the past, no matter how unpopular Labour governments were, they still had strong support here in Scotland.
This is no longer the case, blindly supporting the Labour party is no longer an option here in Scotland.
The newspapers have not got to grips with that afct yet.
How many lost sales of newspapers will it take to realise this ?
The Daily Record is very much a Labour supporting newspaper and look at them now....
32

,

10/04/2009 07:27:57
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33

Auld Twa,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 07:40:40
"The was no suggestion from the Chinese that Mr Wan had pulled out of the meeting because Mr Salmond represented a separatist administration"
So where is the story ?
Other than in the imagination of the Hootsmon reporter and W Lam. The latter is an adjunct professor of History, University of Hong Kong.
34

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 07:47:28
Oh dear, what a shame. (Smee/AM-Suared)

I agree. You suggesting Unionists have "alloys." What a howler.

35

,

10/04/2009 07:59:13
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36

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 08:00:42
The latter is an adjunct professor of History, University of Hong Kong. (Auyld Twa)

Has any hack checked out the authenticity of this "Hong Kong professor." Considering university degrees can be bought there for a plate of chop suey I'd have thought that the first port of call - check the facts.

I mean, it's some coincidence that he should pop out of the woodwork right on cue.
37

TWC,

ex Labour 10/04/2009 08:01:40
2 webwise,
The Record would need to buy McWhirter, the people want the truth and some detailed investigations not just Labour spin. The Scotsman is the same and the numbers confirm it and this story is typical. I am not a member of any party but I have become anti Labour, as I watch Scotland being neglected.
I would like newspapers to look into Scotlands Financial status, the NHS and commerce, in fact they could look at Scotland as a business versus the rest of Europe. How about an update on the ALBA revelation
Don't mention Murphy or his advocate Alan Cochrane in the Telegraph
38

connaughtboy,

stonehaven 10/04/2009 08:04:20
44 smee = wan ker
39

Moonraker007,

10/04/2009 08:05:43
45 - In the design of the union jack there are also go faster stripes according to the unionists. These enable any emblazoned party to be superior to anyone else. Just look at Smee as an example.
40

connaughtboy,

stonehaven 10/04/2009 08:08:06
A message to all fellow SNP supporters. Donate to the new headquarters in Edinburgh. The SNP are trying to raise £75k. I have already given £1,000.
41

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 08:08:25
44 sm753

Can you imagine the shouting and yelling at the aides after that happened?

No

Communiqué from The Imperial British Ambassador to the President of the Peoples’ Republic of China.

“ I say old chap, HM Queen Gordon will be terribly amused if you could find your way to downgrade the visit of that separatist upstart Alex Salmond from Scotchland.

He is really just a minor government official acting as little more than a whisky salesman and to entertain him would only give succour, and credibility to our equivalent to your Tibetan insurrectionists.

See you on Thursday as usual for tiffin and chocolates.

Chin chin,

Nigel, (Lord, Sir, Bart, CBE, MBE, LLP, Plc, Victoria Cross and Bar.)
42

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 08:23:05

Classic gaffe from wizened old buffer Prince Phillip on 2002n visit to China:

"If you (students) stay here much longer you'll all be slitty-eyed."

You can trust the British Establishment to deride Johnny Foreigner.

43

eric,

lothian 10/04/2009 08:30:08
london is being bodyswerved big time in biz community.
44

The west awake,

Argyll 10/04/2009 08:43:04
Helene = "I'm quite sure the Chinese will be very happy to trade with any/all parts of UK, but they see it quite clearly as one country."

- Then they're the only ones. Any intelligent analysis of the "UK" would produce many questions to that statement.
45

Auld Twa,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 08:58:14
#55
Tried a bit od searching -
Adj Prof W Lam is the author of quite a large number of papers and books.
However his connection with Hong Kong University appears to be rather tenuous.
Akita International University, Japan has 402 undergraduates.
Adjunct = unpaid, temporary
Asian Professor = Any academic teacher
46

arc of insolvency,

10/04/2009 09:04:29
Another example of SNP supporters of refusing to listen to facts that nobody outwith Scotland gives any notice to them.
47

Uistman,

Scotland 10/04/2009 09:15:38
61 arc well if enough people in scotland take notice and vote, that will do nicely thanks.
remember the SNP nly ever need to win one eection you lot need to win every election .
The law of averages states.........
48

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 09:16:58
61 arc of insolvency

Why would you appear to be delighted that in your opinion “nobody outwith Scotland gives any notice to Scotland?”

Take care, your cringe is showing.
49

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 09:18:29
Another example of SNP supporters of refusing to listen to facts that nobody outwith Scotland gives any notice to them. (Arc of Insolvents)

They should listen to you. That'll get them ignored!


50

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 09:21:45
his connection with Hong Kong University appears to be rather tenuous: Akita International University, Japan has 402 undergraduates. Adjunct = unpaid, temporary
Asian Professor = Any academic teacher
(Auld Twa)

Well done!

Pity our newspaper's intrepid reporter didn't do his homework.

The professor is almost certainly a paid stooge. At that level no one offers their opinion unsolicited unless asked or paid. And all he seems to say is conjecture.



51

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 09:23:55
It says something about your intellectual level that you interpret the word "alloys" as meaning "wheels". (Sado)

You thought it meant friends and colleagues, you balloon.

A schoolboy howler.

And you have the audacity to suggest a correct meaning wrong?

What arrogance.

LoL

52

Linda,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 09:24:31
No wonder the North Britain's circulation is in freefall. Don't they realise they are alienating a huge section of their core Scottish readership by running down the SNP and Scottish government / parliament at every opportunity.
53

Hugh Roscombe,

10/04/2009 09:25:52
You'll find full details of the meeting here.

http://www.chinapress.com.my/
54

Hugh Roscombe,

10/04/2009 09:33:23
Seriously - this from china.org.cn

"Alex Salmond is the First Minister of the Scottish Government in Edinburgh, Scotland's equivalent of the Prime Minister." - brilliant.
55

Hugh Roscombe,

10/04/2009 09:34:52
Maybe the "snub" was because AS prefers Indian curries to Chinese curries.
56

Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 09:36:15
I congratullate you on your 69 Hugh.
57

For Scotlands Future,

Vote For The SNP 10/04/2009 09:37:28
I knew my post was too good for some people. Maybe it was the comment about the Scotsman not phoning up Wufus and the rest to ensure they got their comments in first.

What I posted was that the world seemingly wants to brown nose China because they want Chins to buy their government issued debt. If China doesn't, governments will have to buy it's own debt with new money it prints.

The Spin Doctors at Westminster call this Quantitative Easing. To me, if your constipated and take some laxatives - that's when you hope for quantitative easing.

China has already blackmailed South Africa and France into having nothing to do with the Daili Lama. the UK and the rest of Europe will be next to be blackmailed. In a few years Europe will be a no-go area for him.

I also asked how many people know that some of the highly productive farms in Zimbabwe (yes there are quite a few), taken over by ZanuPF leaders, grow their crops under Chinese supervision, and the harvested crop is shipped immediately to China. The money is paid directly, in foreign currency (dollars, euros, etc) to private bank accounts.

It is the goal of China to take over Southern Africa countries and use them as a bread-basket for its own citizens. They already have Zimbabwe thanks to Mugabe and Mbeki.
58

Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 09:37:58
Oops, effen l.
59

Dear_Gordon,

10/04/2009 09:39:33
Read All Abaaaaht It!
Read All Abaaahht It!

Hootsmon Headline tomorrow......

"Nya Nya Nya Nyaaa Na - My Dad's bigger than your Dad!"

Scotland on Sunday........

"Oooh - that nice Gordon Brown has much nicer shirts than Salmond"

Circulation figures dropping?
Never!


60

For Scotlands Future,

Vote For The SNP 10/04/2009 09:41:18
#72
Wasn't that rather personal??
61

,

10/04/2009 09:45:04
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62

Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 09:45:55
78
A bit tongue in cheeks, I grant you.
63

Hugh Roscombe,

10/04/2009 09:49:59
Re my 69 ... what's French for soixante neuf?
64

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 09:51:15
76 Dear_Gordon

http://www.allmediascotland.com/spike/3693/27022009/PandJ_and_Courier_Sales_Still_Surpass_Herald_and_Scotsmans

The latest (January) sales figures for The Herald and the Scotsman are 60,755 and 49,478, respectively.
Across Scotland, the average net circulations read as follows:
Aberdeen - Evening Express 52,029
Aberdeen - Press & Journal 78,121
Aberdeen Citizen 76,530
Airdrie & Coatbridge Advertiser 15,493
Alloa & Hillfoots Advertiser 8759
Annandale Herald 3078
Annandale Observer 6556
Ardrossan & Saltcoats Herald 13,991
Arran Banner 3313
Ayr Advertiser 5291
Ayrshire Post 25,233
Ayrshire World 10,227
Banffshire Journal 4947
Bearsden/Milngavie & West End Extra 24,824
Berwick Advertiser 7551
Berwickshire News & East Lothian Herald 5729
Blairgowrie Advertiser 2858
Border Telegraph 4291
Brechin Advertiser 2952
Caithness Courier 6809
Campbeltown Courier & Argyllshire Advertiser 7165
Carrick Gazette 2640
Central Fife Times & Advertiser 6713
Clyde Weekly News 5392
Clydebank Post 12,126
Cumbernauld and Kilsyth Advertiser 18,305
Cumbernauld News & Kilsyth Chronicle 10,684
Cumnock Chronicle 7378
Deeside Piper 7636
Dumbarton & Vale of Leven Reporter 3989
Dumfries & Galloway Standard (Fri) 15,712
Dumfries & Galloway Standard (Wed) 9668
Dumfries & Galloway Today 5298
Dumfries Courier 24,723
Dundee Courier & Advertiser 69,414
Dundee Evening Telegraph 23,048
Dunfermline Press & West of Fife Advertiser 19,600
East Fife Mail 10,766
East Kilbride News 11,538
65

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 09:53:07
The Dundee Courier and the Aberdeen Citizen have higher ciculation figure than the Scotsmam
66

Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 10:01:10
83
Is the Dundee Courier free as well?
67

Mr. Lachie Todd,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 10:05:11
So! The Chinese have now raised the First Minister of Scotland to the same level as the Dalai Lama!
68

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 10:07:08
Is the Dundee Courier free as well?


No


69

arc of insolvency,

10/04/2009 10:31:05
#65 "They should listen to you. That'll get them ignored!" because yopu ignored me with your reply?

The sad fact is that some SNP supporters are narrow minded and in some cases just bigoted. I refuse to accept us Scots will ever go in majority with these types. Some of the comments I see from SOME SNP supportes in worrying in the extreme. They are kidding themselves if they think this deems them to be 'patriotic'.

If Salmond can't even get the attention of some low level Chinese official how is that going to ever help Scotland in future? Of course the SNP supporters will never accept this, but I think the vast majority of Scots do and that is why they will never win.

Now proceed with the usual abuse...........
70

Ewan M,

10/04/2009 10:36:06
It seems to be that Alex Salmond gets snubbed quite a lot when away from home. No chinese minister, no meeting with Barak Obhama, Lloyds bosses wern't much interested in him either.

Surely this suggest his standing abroad isn't really a standing at all. He's in the same league as Robert Mugabe and Fidel Castro !!!!!!!!!! :)
71

alanh,

ek 10/04/2009 10:37:12
why am I NOT surprised. This nu liebore press release has found a negative angle to portray our govt's visit to China and NOW we are allowed to comment......

remind us again who met Mr Murphy on his wee holiday in china last week?
72

Gussie Fink-Nottle,

10/04/2009 10:38:28
# 70 Hola Hugh,Conan, in fact in the absence of the Spooky one. Hoos and indeed Poos!

Even when he's disguised as a Norwegian tourist, Salmond has an eye for a bargain..

http://www.china.org.cn/china/news/2009-01/02/content_17044578.htm
73

,

10/04/2009 10:41:00
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74

TWC,

ex Labour 10/04/2009 10:41:09
The Chinese are no fools they compare Salmond with the First Minister because they keep all options open. They don't only run a single plan you know.

#I bet Gordo booted his mobile phone all over the office when he saw that one.

Brown is finished so who knows what will happen this year.
75

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 10:43:58
No chinese minister, no meeting with Barak Obhama, (Ewan M)

He didn't ask for a meeting with Obama, but Obama santioned a meeting between Clinton and Salmond. Had Obama expressed caution over Scottish aspirations Clinton would not have met him.

What's your next puerile snark?
76

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 10:44:58
because yopu ignored me with your reply? (Arc of Twitterdom)

Yes. I refuse to take anything you say seriously.

77

,

10/04/2009 10:45:16
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78

Andy Ritchie's left boot,

10/04/2009 10:45:39
This ridiculous report is beyond parody. Could they not manage to get the emotive and slanted word "separatism" in the text any more times?

As for the claim that Murphy was given a more upbeat reception, I suspect that is total invention.

Finally, if they don't want to meet the future political leader of a soon to be independent nation, that's a grave error on their part.

The Scotsman is a disgrace, not so much fourth estate as fifth column.
79

alanh,

ek 10/04/2009 10:50:39
I'm really surprised that Mr Murphy "met" Yang Jiechi, the powerful and influential foreign minister, cos there4 has been NO reporting of this Triumph , until now that i could find about mr Murphy's holiday jaunt. Where did he meet him and under what circumstances?
80

arc of insolvency,

10/04/2009 10:51:21
#97 'a grave error' I'm sure the Chinese are bricking it!

#94 'Scottish aspiration'? You may want to change that to 'SNP aspirations' which are in the minority in Scotland.

So far you have said you ignore and you refuse to take anything seriously - you really are a typical SNP supporter!
81

Shorthouse,

10/04/2009 10:51:53
I am heartily sick of the endless garbage spouted by some of the nationalist bloggers on here. If you don't like the way this paper covers events, why don't you go and wallow in your paranoia somewhere else?

Personally, I'd rather a free press held our Government up to scrutiny, which it seems to me is exactly what they're doing here.

Instead of questioning why Salmond wasn't able to meet with influence-makers in during his visit to the world's second biggest economy, we get the usual endless character assasination and tired criticism from all the usual suspects.

The reports don't even have to be remotely critical nowadays - any coverage which fails to mirror the SNP party line exactly is rubbished without any recourse to fact. It's playground stuff.

If you really can't stand the coverage of events here, why don't you do the rest of us a big favour and get lost.
82

arc of insolvency,

10/04/2009 10:53:12
Some people are critical of Scotsman journalism yet hang about on thier message boards all day, why?
83

arc of insolvency,

10/04/2009 10:56:06
Shorthouse - it is really nice to hear some sensible comment here...some of the nationalist posters, I say some I not tarnishing everyone with the same brush, are big kids with a huge chip on their shoulder.
84

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 10:59:26
100 Why do you read it then ?

Any objective person can clearly see the bias. So you can't be objective.

Regards to the story, it's a big yawn. Maybe he had a stomach upset, who knows, who cares, if Salmond were to have been snubbed I think they would have done it rather more effectively than this.

85

,

10/04/2009 11:14:36
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86

Gussie Fink-Nottle,

10/04/2009 11:24:54
#100 Mr Shortarse, one of the main purposes of this trip, at the invitation of the Chinese Government through Consul General Madame Tsang, was to guarantee 'Geographic Indication of Origin Status' for Scotch whisky, to counter the economic losses through counterfeiting in China.

This has been secured in talks between First Minister Salmond and Wang Yong, the Chinese Minister of Quality, Supervision, Inspection and Quarantine. This safeguards Scottish jobs in a vital, overly taxed industry. Would you not agree that this is a serious issue?
87

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 11:27:30
'Scottish aspiration'? You may want to change that to 'SNP aspirations' which are in the minority in Scotland. (Arc of twitterdom)

The word is "might."

You are waffling under the false impression a political party arises from nowhere and elects itself, rather than taking seventy-five years to rise from a section of the nation's hopes and desires, then gets elected.

I don't take you seriously because you are here to jeer, incite hatred and tension, bereft of commonsense, and anti-democratic.




88

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 11:29:38
If you don't like the way this paper covers events, why don't you go and wallow in your paranoia somewhere else? (Short of a house)

Oddly, I was thinking you should do the same because this website IS part of the newspaper, and as such encourages differences of opinion.



89

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 11:36:13
The concept of Unionists being “traitorous” is hardly a new one.

This extract from the Oxford Dictionary of National Biography suggests such feelings were widely held as far back as 1706.


“When Seafield signed the Act of Union as lord chancellor of Scotland, he famously described it as ‘ane end of an old song’ (Robertson, 271). The earl of Roxburghe had struck a similar chord on behalf of the squadrone in predicting the union's success: ‘The motives will be, Trade with most, Hanover with some, ease and security with others’ (Riley, 216). Debate continues among historians over whether such views were statesmanlike or represented servility to English interests at a time of national crisis.

This confident vision of the future contrasted with that presented at the end of the final Scots parliament by John Hamilton, second Lord Belhaven and Stenton, who on 2 November 1706 gave a famous speech portraying ‘Mother Caledonia’ betrayed at the last by her children.


Unionists such as Seafield and Marchmont claimed that Belhaven's words had no effect. Even so, Defoe published them in full in his History of the Union, partly in recognition of Belhaven's death in 1708 and partly in acknowledgement of the impact of his rhetoric on public opinion in Scotland outside the parliament.”
90

webwise,

Scotland 10/04/2009 11:48:30
I will remind readers that Jim Murphy falsely claimed that The Dunfermline building society's demise was partly caused by their acquisition of USA sub prime mortages.

Murphy is on record as saying this, indeed he has been broadcast saying it.

IT IS FALSE !! THE DUNFERMLINE HAD MADE NO SUCH ACQUISITIONS.

This is a test to see if this paper will censor factual comments.
91

,

10/04/2009 11:52:50
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
92

Proud Scotsman,

10/04/2009 11:57:32
Alex Salmond is a bad joke. He is an embarassment to Scotnd and to China. He is pretending he is prime minister of an independent Scotland. Stop pretending and come home you clown.
93

,

10/04/2009 12:01:18
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
94

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 12:02:16
110 I think it is undoubtedly true that Scotland was betrayed by the ruling classes of the day who signed the Treaty of Union for financial reasons, to secure their own selfish interests at the expense of the ordinary Scot, who didn't want the Union as was expressed by the large scale demonstrations held in every major centre of population at the time.

However, I am not personally in agreement with labelling unionists now as traitors or quislings. If we are to persuade people that independence is the best option for our country I don't think you can do that by insulting them.

However, that does not apply to the trolls who daily infest these boards for the singular purpose of insulting the very concept of Scottish independence.

Speaking of which where is Rufus, is he deid ?
95

Proud Scotsman,

10/04/2009 12:03:21
How embarassing. I wish Alex Salmond would stop embarassing Scotland. He is a nobody and everyone knows it bar him. Stop embarassing Scotland!
96

,

10/04/2009 12:03:40
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
97

Shorthouse,

10/04/2009 12:04:44
I wasn't going to bother replying to this because life's too short to argue with people who are incapable of rational debate. But it's a holiday so...

# 104: I didn't say I was objective. Anyone who actively follows politics is bound to have formed a point of view which shapes and informs beliefs. But simply coming on and saying 'the article is biaised' without explaining why is purile.

# 105: If you'd bothered to inform yourself before commenting, you'd know that Scotsman Publicatoins is owned by Johnston Press, which is based in Edinburgh i.e. Scottish owned.

# 107: Thank you for making my point about the playground. Of course it's a serious issue but it's scheduled to be addressed today, as stated above. This report is about meeting's Salmond was meant to have yesterday.

# 109: I'm not paranoid. Just fed up with the cyber bullies on here who try to shout down any scrutiny of the Government's actions. You don't want to have a discussion unless you can dictate the terms of the conversation. Anyone who doesn't comply is called names, although it has to be said, 'short of a house' is a rubbish effort.

Like I said, pathetic.
98

Proud Scotsman,

10/04/2009 12:05:35
114 Gussie

Why are you being so offensive?

I just want to express my dismay at Alex Salmond embarassing my country again.

Stop embarassing Scotland you idiot SNP minister!!
99

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 12:06:24
113 Proud Scotsman,

“Alex Salmond is a bad joke. He is an embarassment to Scotnd and to China. He is pretending he is prime minister of an independent Scotland. Stop pretending and come home you clown.”

Did you mean an “embarrassment to Scotland”?

I just wondered.

I guess you may not be all that “proud” of your spelling.

100

Proud Scotsman,

10/04/2009 12:08:04
120 Bully

"Did you mean an “embarrassment to Scotland”?"

Yes! This is what I meant. Alex Salmond and the SNP are an embarassment to Scotland.
101

,

10/04/2009 12:11:33
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
102

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 12:15:45
122 Proud Scotsman

Your vote will be sadly missed.

By the way, which part of Scotland are you resident within again?
103

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 12:15:57
Red pen's quick and very discriminating today. Don't point out that certain posters are f'cktards or you'll vanish.
104

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 12:18:43
118 The word is peurile if you are going to insult me please spell correctly while doing so.
105

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 12:19:28
Alex Salmond and the SNP are an embarassment to Scotland.
(Not So Proud Scotsman)

Then your standards begin somewhere with pigs in mud. And the pigs like it there.

I presume you are neither proud nor a Scotsman, and you certainly talk for no one but your self.

An akward ploy to disrupt the discussion - Rufus the Dufus in his best suit?



106

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 12:23:57
If you'd bothered to inform yourself before commenting, you'd know that Scotsman Publications is owned by Johnston Press, which is based in Edinburgh i.e. Scottish owned. (ShortArse)

Erm, sorry. The proprietors are NOT Scottish. Is the RBS Scottish owned? Is Lloyds with an HQ in Edinburgh Scottish? Is the game of cricket or rugby played in Scotland Scottish?

Did you bother to inform yourself before posting?



107

Shorthouse,

10/04/2009 12:23:58
#124 & 125: Well at least you know what you are...
108

Westfield Bairns,

Falkirk 10/04/2009 12:25:38
Yawn, more Scotsman Unionist propoganda. However luckily you have a fair number of Nationalists posting on here as no one appears to read your propoganda paper.
It's at least comforting to know there are so many posters with scotlands interest at heart


121 Proud Scotsman

I'd check the trades description on your moniker Proud Scotsman my ar*e, more like Unionist self loather one of the few i may add, get a spine
109

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 12:26:57
Jim Murphy falsely claimed that The Dunfermline Building Society's demise was partly caused by their acquisition of USA sub prime mortages. Murphy is on record as saying this, has been broadcast saying it. (Webwise)

He did. That is true.

But what is truth to the Labour Party?

Merely a child's spinning top.

110

Shorthouse,

10/04/2009 12:27:20
# 127: So by your logic the Royal Bank of Scotland is not Scottish. With logic like that you could probably convince yourself that anything you want to believe is true. Which, judging by some of your contributions here, is exactly what you do.

By the way, Short*rse is much better than the woefully weak short of a house. Shame you needed one of your pals to come with it first.
111

Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

10/04/2009 12:34:59
Alex Salmond has let Scotland down again. He let us down with his visit to America too.

Alex Salmond thinks he is an international statesman and welcome amongst the global elite. The sad truth of the matter is that he is not and is not.

I wish he would stop setting Scotland up to have another door slammed in our face. Sometimes it is better to keep your mouth shut and be thought wise than open it and remove all doubt.

Alex Salmond would do well to learn that. All this tax-payer funded grand standing is wasting money and ruining Scotland's reputation. Alex Salmond looks like a tourist abroad.
112

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 12:41:47
131 The Royal Bank of Scotland isn't Scottish. It's owned by the UK tax payer. Prior to that it was global.
113

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 12:41:49
By the way, Short*rse (Shortarse)

You still have nothing to add to the debate.

And another piece of claptrap from the band of "Treat Readers as Idiots" club:

"Alex Salmond thinks he is an international statesman and welcome amongst the global elite. The sad truth of the matter is that he is not and is not."

The sad truth is you cannot post a decent blog to save your self.

114

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 12:43:12
132 No door was slammed in his face, he got what he set out to do which was to promote Scotland and to secure measures to protect the Scottish whisky industry.
115

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 12:44:41
128 I see someone on here who is peurile, it certainly isn't me.
116

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 12:49:33

Eeh, how man mutha man.

As a proud Scottish man, leike, I want to say how very, very embarrassed Ah am by them polishtishuns behay-yor, ya naa what Ah mean, leike?

I feels so let down by tha' Salmond manny, Ahm gannin tae tha' boozer fir pint, leike.



117

Astrotrain,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 12:49:37
If the SNP were to suggest that an independent Scotland would give diplomatic regonition to the Republic of China (Taiwan), then I'm sure the People's Republic of China would be more than accomodating to them in the future. Indeed the People's Republic is known to bribe small nations to ensure they do not recognise Taiwan.

118

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 13:03:06
132 Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

“Alex Salmond has let Scotland down again. He let us down with his visit to America too.

Alex Salmond thinks he is an international statesman and welcome amongst the global elite. The sad truth of the matter is that he is not and is not.

I wish he would stop setting Scotland up to have another door slammed in our face. Sometimes it is better to keep your mouth shut and be thought wise than open it and remove all doubt.

Alex Salmond would do well to learn that. All this tax-payer funded grand standing is wasting money and ruining Scotland's reputation. Alex Salmond looks like a tourist abroad.”

What an interesting, well thought out and heavily researched contribution.

“Proud Scotsman” has seemingly left the stage, profoundly discredited and humiliated by an acute lack of erudition and lo-and-behold, another Lard George acolyte enters, stage right, spouting the same drivel, this time using a spell-checker.

Pray tell us, what in your lexicon does “selling Scotland up “ actually mean?

Does it mean that Alex Salmond has visited America and China and offered those nations all the taxation proceeds of all our assets in return for some of the worst health, child poverty and housing conditions in the developed world?

Oh no, it cannot mean that, those assets have already been sold.


(Or have they?)

119

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 13:09:14

Marnen.

As a Scatsmoin livin' in Somerzet, Oid loik to add moi tuppence woirth to zentiments of moi old mucker, Geordie Scotchman.

If Oi was to take a straw poll - Ahn Oi gots plenty o' the stuff 'ere on tha' farm - you'd foind Maister Salmond's performance wis middlin' to useless. Ee's a bi' of a mumper, person-ally speakin'.

Tarra fir now.

120

,

10/04/2009 13:11:25
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
121

Shorthouse,

10/04/2009 13:14:42
#136. Whatever gets you through the night, pal.
122

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 13:31:45
Whatever gets you through the night, pal. (Shortarse)

Still nothing to contribute to the topic.
123

Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

10/04/2009 13:40:19
Alex Salmond isn't welcomed by anyone.

He is a minority government and should respect the wishes of the Scottish people. The man is arrogant and self-centered. He has no business stirring up trouble in China.
124

Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

10/04/2009 13:40:58
Thank god the Chinese snubbed him, maybe he will take the hint and stop embarassing Scotland.
125

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 13:41:18
142 John Lennon, Walls and Bridges. That has relevance how ?
126

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 13:42:29
144/145 He didn't/they didn't.
127

Bejjy,

Europe 10/04/2009 13:45:23
#108 Los Angeles,

I don't take you seriously because you are here to jeer, incite hatred and tension, bereft of commonsense, and anti-democratic.

A first class piece of self analysis Les Loser; how is Leith nowdays by the way.

On topic, the Chinese are wise old owls who know who to trust and who not to trust. They got this right in snubbing Salmond when they know that they should only be dealing with a Government minister of the UK and not a leader of a regional council within the UK.
128

Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

10/04/2009 13:46:00
I'm surprised the SNP are denying they were snubbed given that it is a palpable and verifiable fact that they were, in actual fact, snubbed.

The SNP were snubbed by China. The SNP denies being snubbed by China at a time when it's clear to one and all that the SNP were, in actual fact, snubbed by China.

The SNP were snubbed in China. The SNP deny they were snubbed by China, howver they were, in actual fact snubbed by China.

The SNP were snubbed by China. The SNP claim black is white and blue is green and up is down and the world is flat. But they were in actual fact snubbed by China.
129

W U Merchant,

Aberdeen 10/04/2009 13:48:11
Wan Gang is a very clever man. As he said on the news "I want to speak to the organ grinder, not the monkey".
130

Hugh Roscombe,

10/04/2009 13:49:00
1000 Staples for 99p

Are you on acid?
131

JC1,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 13:49:12
He's there on a freebie to sell whisky and make himself look good, that's all.
132

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 13:50:11
Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

Why don't you try an apple if you are worried about your weight ? Or go for a walk, assuming you can get through the front door that is.
133

Mercian,

UK 10/04/2009 13:50:55
I don't see any reason why Salmond needs to keep going on trips to the other side of world. Surely, he should have more important work to get on with at home in Scotland?
134

Hugh Roscombe,

10/04/2009 13:50:56
Sorry - it was 2000 staples for 99p wasn't it?
135

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 13:53:13
Jeezo the quality of unionists on this thread is terrible. Are you all drunk ?
136

Hugh Roscombe,

10/04/2009 13:55:34
There's only Wan Gang to be afraid of - Broon's gang.
137

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 13:57:44
I think the fact that the Scotsman have based this story around a guy called Will,y might give you a clue the accusation of snubbing was made by a dick.
138

Bejjy,

Europe 10/04/2009 14:02:57
#156 Observer,,

Not being a Unionist, whatever that is, after reading some of your comments today gives the me the impression that you have been at the Sherry all morning. Can you afford to drink Sherry on the meagre state pension given to you by the British Government. It may be a lot cheaper to drink Chinese rice wine or alternatevely get Hugh Roscombe to send you a barrel of cheap Spanish plonk. Cheers; have a, hic, nice day.
139

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 14:06:20
159 I do apologise, I am at my best when given an incentive to debate, sadly I haven't been given that on this thread. Catch me another time and try to think of something interesting to say first. Enjoy your rice wine.
140

Bejjy,

Europe 10/04/2009 14:12:03
#160 Observer,,

So you think that your comments at #156 & #158 , amongst others, are interesting; you must have been on the Sherry all day or you are deluded.
141

Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

10/04/2009 14:12:14
160 Observer

I agree with you. China snubbed the SNP and that is a fact. There is no scope for debate on this article, it merely reports a fact. That Alex Salmond and the SNP were snubbed by China and made to feel unwelcome and irrelevant.
142

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 14:20:36
China snubbed the SNP and that is a fact (40 Cals Anorexic)

No, it isn't.

You are among the few bloggers doing all you can to invent ignominy, whereas that is all you're getting for your effort.

LoL
143

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 14:21:39
Jeezo, the quality of unionists on this thread is terrible. Are you all drunk? (Observer)

Not drunk. Weans at the teat.

144

The Tin Man,

10/04/2009 14:28:30
Murphy and Salmond could have made a joint visit. Or am I being to sensible?
145

Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

10/04/2009 14:29:02
Los Angeles,

You're quite the fan of banal gainsaying as a substitute for content, discourse and wit.

It is a fact that Alex Salmond and the SNP were snubbed by China deliberately from the factual events and non-appearances detailed in the article.

Your response.

"No, it isn't."

This is so stupid it is funny, am I right in thinking you're a comedian come SNP troll?

Is this a 5 or a 10 minute argument?
146

Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

10/04/2009 14:29:38
Los Angeles,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=teMlv3ripSM
147

Hugh Roscombe,

Chow mein 10/04/2009 14:29:51
Alternative Hootsman headline:-

Scotland picks fight with China.
What a paper eh?
What a scoop!
148

Hugh Roscombe,

10/04/2009 14:30:58
It's actually a laugh. It IS a non story. Who cares?
149

Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

10/04/2009 14:34:27
169 Hugh

I care that Scotland has been embarrassed by the SNP. You don't care that Alex Salmond and the SNP are muddying Scotland's good name with the country that will likely be the 21st century's biggest global player?

Good grief, man! You appitimise the Scottish cringe. Scotland should aim for much better.
150

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 14:34:37
161 They were a lot wittier than yours dear, which wasn't hard.

165 A sensible comment. As far as I understand it Tin Man, Salmond's visit was pre-planned and Murphy jumped onto another trade mission without apparently being aware of this visit. Completely unbelievable, completely childish, and it should have been sorted out by both parties.
151

Hugh Roscombe,

10/04/2009 14:36:40
170

What on earth is appitimise? I am more embarrassed by your dreadful spelling. You shame Scotland. Begone.
152

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 14:37:35
170 You appear to be a complete diddy. If you are going to accuse the SNP of embarrassing Scotland try and find a subject matter they could embarrass Scotland with. This isn't it.
153

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 14:38:21
You're quite the fan of banal gainsaying (40 Cal Anorexic)

Ah, you and I have had a few spats, only you used alternative monikers.

You're here to incite by posting crude propaganda.

I tell you that each time, and each time you respond with aggressive comments and no substantive content. I then reply you are easily distracted from your objective.

You respond by continuing to post the most inane drivel, a standard you can just about muster.

154

The Tin Man,

10/04/2009 14:38:38
#171

I guess they don't speak to each other. Morons.
155

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 14:39:58

I care that Scotland has been embarrassed by the SNP. (40 Cal Anorexic)

Oh please spare us your pious claptrap.

LoL


156

Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

10/04/2009 14:40:03
Hugh/Observer

More SNP trolls. "No, it isn't" is not a substitute for content.

The SNP quite clearly embarrassed Scotland by looking like diddy tourists begging for attention and being refused it.

They look weak and desperate, not a good look for any diplomat.
157

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 14:40:26
166 Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

“It is a fact that Alex Salmond and the SNP were snubbed by China deliberately from the factual events and non-appearances detailed in the article.”

Hi Mr Foulkes

Even if your statement was remotely accurate, why do think that would be something worth proclaiming?

You epitomise the unionist cringe.

What a sad individual, albeit with many monikers.
158

Hugh Roscombe,

10/04/2009 14:43:01
40grans

Now see what you made me do. I've got lockjaw with yawning too much at your drivel. Raise yer game.
159

Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

10/04/2009 14:43:58
178 Bully wee Alba

Another SNP troll. "No, it isn't" is not an argument.

It is a palpable and verifiable fact that the SNP and Alex Salmond were subbed by China. It is a fact beyond question.

It is my view, and Scotland's view, that Alex Salmond and the SNP look weak, desperate and inneffectual having been hung out to dry by China. Alex Salmond needs to stop pretending he is a King of Scotland. He is cringeworthy.
160

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 14:44:35
I guess they don't speak to each other. (Tin Foil)

Can Murphy speak? The few times I have seen him open his mouth his diction is terrible, his choice of words banal.
161

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 14:45:52
175 There appears to be a rivalry and a complete lack of communication between Dover and Bute House. Now my alliegance to independence is well known, but that doesn't necessarily extend to the SNP, of whom I have been critical in the past and will be again. But all the information I have points to the fault being with the Whitehall mandarins who basically do not want to admit that the SNP are in power.
162

,

10/04/2009 14:45:57
Comment Removed By Administrator
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163

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 14:47:10
palpable and verifiable fact (40 Cal Anorexic)

It is a very plaintiff palpable verifiable fact 40 calories is Billy Bunter, snort and all.

164

Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

10/04/2009 14:47:18
Los Angeles (SNP troll),

We can agree on that. Murphy's speech is slow and irritating. He is poorly presented and a boring orator, the tedium of trying to listen to his laborious monotone for anything in excess of 10 seconds is unbearable.

But what do you think about the article? Salmond has let Scotland down badly. Do you agree?
165

Marga,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 14:49:24
Each 40g - it seems Mr Salmond was not assigned the level of protocol originally agreed between the two governments. Of course, this could conceivably have something to do with Mr Murphy's hastily-arranged prior visit, whose purpose and outcomes for Scotland (if any) have apparently not been disclosed beyond Mr Murphy's own blog - of course, I stand to be corrected. (Mr Salmond's achievements are however reported here). I'd expect better and more accountable use to be made of the Scotland Office budget.
166

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 14:50:24
all the information I have points to the fault being with the Whitehall mandarins who basically do not want to admit that the SNP are in power. (Observer)

It's a lot worse - they are actively undermining all efforts of the Scottish government either to achieve consensus, or to get passed by majority vote the most inoffensive policies that benefit Scotland. They vilify them at every turn.

As I said before, they confuse tyranny with LOSING!



167

The Tin Man,

10/04/2009 14:51:26
Oh well, at least we can have our little comments thread without concern that the State internet monitors will pop 'round in the night, and send us off to a Manchurian labour camp.
168

Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

10/04/2009 14:51:30
Marga,

The reverse of course is true. Salmond tried to upstage the UK and China, rightfully and maturely, ignored the SNP as a non-entity and B-team player.

A correct call. How embarrassing for the SNP.
169

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 14:51:31
''But what do you think about the article? Salmond has let Scotland down badly. Do you agree?''

Who could agree with gibberish ? You are talking mince. If you are going to be a troll make some effort please.
170

,

10/04/2009 14:53:21
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171

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 14:54:44
''Salmond tried to upstage the UK'' complete rubbish, Salmond's trip was pre-planned and Murphy suddenly jumped on board an on-going series of non-governmental trade visits which had never attracted political presence before.

Do try harder.
172

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 14:55:06
180 Each 40g serving

“It is a palpable and verifiable fact that the SNP and Alex Salmond were subbed by China. It is a fact beyond question”

By whom were they “subbed” George?

Did China subsidise Alex Salmond’s visit?

If so, then what are you complaining about?

173

The Tin Man,

10/04/2009 14:55:52
#187 Los

Yes, that's why the only other pro-independence party was the only party to vote against the last budget. All voting is along strict 'unionist' vs 'nationalist' lines at all times.
174

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 15:00:17
194 187's post related to Whitehall Tin Man. The Greens don't run Whitehall. The British establishment does, no matter what the label on the party, the mandarins serve the establishment. The establishment don't like the SNP. That is not paranoia, it can clearly be evidenced with facts.
175

Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

10/04/2009 15:01:48
Observer (SNP Troll),

Just saying "No, it isn't." is stupid.

The SNP and Alex Salmond were quite celarly and demonstrably snubbed by China. The SNP and Alex Salmond look weak and desperate losers on the international stage.

The SNP have lost this time. They look like desperate beggers.
176

The Tin Man,

10/04/2009 15:03:17
#192 Observer

Don't you just love political B.S. I wonder if the subject of the Tibetan protests ever raised it's ugly head whilst they were promoting golf holidays, universities, and a renewable energy engineering consultancy?
177

Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

10/04/2009 15:04:12
195 Observer (SNP Troll)

"it can clearly be evidenced with facts."

Except you provide none. What facts? The constitution? The fact more Scots want to be part of the UK? Democracy?

What facts? The fact that the SNP are a minority?

Of course the people don't like the SNP. They are an anti-democratic protest group who want to make things as bad as possible for Scotland.
178

The Tin Man,

10/04/2009 15:07:29
#196

I believe the Chinese operate a strict hierachy, so I doubt they could treat Salmond and Murphy as equals. Anyway, I doubt the Chinese foreign minister would touch Salmond with a barge-pole, what with China's own separatists.
179

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 15:07:51
196 The SNP were not ''celarly'' and demonstrably snubbed by China, that is just made-up nonsense. They got the agreement on the labelling of whisky, and the trade visit has been successful in promoting Scotland. So a bloke didn't turn up for a Q+A session, big deal. China is a super-power, it is a sopisticated political operator, if it wanted to snub Salmond it would have done it in an unequivocal way. It didn't, so people like you are reduced to making things up.
180

bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 15:09:35
196 Each 40g

“The SNP and Alex Salmond were quite celarly and demonstrably snubbed by China. The SNP and Alex Salmond look weak and desperate losers on the international stage.

The SNP have lost this time. They look like desperate beggers”


See that private school you attended George, I guess that spelling English was not on high upon the agenda.

But no doubt that you are still “Proud to be Scottish”

By the way, which part of Scotland are you from?
181

Hugh Roscombe,

10/04/2009 15:10:54
40g

tinyurl.com/co46bw
182

Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

10/04/2009 15:11:33
199 Tin Man

True. Salmond is a trouble maker, it's quite refreshing to see that the Chinese have a great respect for the UK.

Snubbing Salmond was the correct thing for them to do. He was only using them after his failed USA trip to try and convey the image of prestigious and important international statesman. It's cringeworthy.

Salmond is a balding, morbidly obese dwarf who is married to a granny. He projects the very worst Scottish values abroad. Not like, sporty eloquent Obama or well dressed Sarkozy.
183

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 15:12:12
197 Well I am not convinced of the whole Tibetan thing, I think there's more than one side to that story, so I would like to think that we didn't stick our noses into what was not our business. Just because I think Scotland should separate from the UK doesn't mean I think all separatist movements are automatically right.
184

Hugh Roscombe,

10/04/2009 15:14:36
40g

Time for this.

tinyurl.com/p5k62
185

The Tin Man,

10/04/2009 15:14:47
#195 Observer

No, Los' post referred to people who vote in parliament. I don't think civil servant's get to do that.

I do agree that Westminster / Whitehall and the Scot exec seem to have basic communication problems, though. They don't like each other, so their not talking. A bit childish. Oh well, at least they can talk to the Chinese.
186

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 15:16:30
''Salmond is a balding, morbidly obese dwarf who is married to a granny.''

And Gordon Brown is an ageing Queen who is married to a lez in a lavender cover-up.

Is that what you call political debate ? Catch a grip you looney and address the issues.
187

The Tin Man,

10/04/2009 15:21:00
#207

He is not really a dwarf.
188

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 15:24:09
208 Don't you think it's just incredibly boring focusing on politicians personal details ? It's not as if they are that interesting. Sure, we can all make up insults, I just did, but what's the point ? It's dull.
189

The Tin Man,

10/04/2009 15:25:47
#207

I'm sure they both have small penises and long tongues, though.
190

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10/04/2009 15:26:05
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10/04/2009 15:27:41
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10/04/2009 15:29:29
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Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 15:30:28
Each 40g serving contains 214 calories,

Hello Brain. Well you did say you had a BMI of 26. So I'm not surprised you are counting calories. I am a shapely 22.
194

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10/04/2009 15:31:52
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bully wee alba,

Edinburgh 10/04/2009 15:32:11
203 Each 40g

“Salmond is a balding, morbidly obese dwarf who is married to a granny”

If you equate being around 5ft 9/10ins as being a dwarf then you are one seriously deluded moron.

Well, that came across anyway.

Next Lard George acolyte!
196

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 15:32:50
“It is a palpable and verifiable fact (40 calories)

Noooooooo!

Is this a fake blogger which I see before me, hatred toward my face? Come let me clutch thee!

Aargh! I have not thee yet I see thee still. Thy face is pock marked thy mind ill with poisonous barbs tipped from hedgerow's foxglove bells. Though art a dagger of the mind, a false creation, proceeding from the heat-oppressed brain? I see thee yet in form as palpable as that which now I draw.

The light grows dim ... my bones grow cold. I saw the idiot as an easy slight, a slam-dunk, but he returneth ever ready to spout claptrap till the c*ck crows, and believe me, he is a c*ck that croweth very loud.

I could have accomplished much today in many ways that man can do, respected by most gentle parfait folk who smile and nod and give respect for such achievements, not blandishments and vile abuse heaped upon my blogs of old.

Instead, I wasteth many careful postcards of wisdom and wit on Scotland's haters of little brain and smaller orifices, that do persist in their agonies of anger and frustation, a foul breathe filled with pigswill that would a dragon make ill.

Oh, tomorrow, and tomorrow, and tomorrow, creeps in this petty pace from day to day ...

197

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10/04/2009 15:41:40
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198

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 15:41:54
*Obsession with benefits (which he is on)
*Obsession with being fat (which he is)
*Use of the word phucker
*Being a complete posting diddy
*Use of ad hominem attack in the absence of argument

= Brain (and various other monikers)

A sad lonely right wing obsessive. Sad really.
199

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10/04/2009 15:45:02
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The Tin Man,

10/04/2009 15:47:16
Oh dear... the pyjamas will be out, next... Time to close this tab.
201

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 15:47:17
220 Your obsession with sexual activity indicates that you aren't getting any. Your ability to make things up on the spot perhaps indicates why.
202

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10/04/2009 15:52:28
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Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 15:53:48

I do heareth the heavy footfalls of the Moderator. With halberd and full fierce scowl he seeketh out the fool and fake and smelly t"rd, to smite the false who blight this site with putrid airs and cankled word.

204

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 15:55:06
223 Tut tut do pay attention I have only been on here for months. You are an obsessional loser.
205

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 15:57:13
He's gone. Who deleted him ? Probably himself in a fit of petulance realising that he lost. Ho hum.
206

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 16:06:26
Who deleted him? (Observer)

The Great Moderator in our sphere,
Who saveth souls from fiend and fear.
He saw a pustule growth in Scottish soil,
And "palpably" completely, lanced the boil!
207

Los Angeles,

10/04/2009 16:09:07

And now fair friends I take my leave,
Laughing loudly up my sleeve!

208

TWC,

ex Labour 10/04/2009 16:29:26
We Eck will do well he is positive and reeks of confidence while Labour people are dour, angry and spiteful. Like their loser Leader finished. They have conceded all the high ground to the Nats. The fight for finance the the truth about Oil, Trident, Nuclear waste and every possible pro Scottish policy.

All I ever hear them suggest for Scotland are apprenticeships and training. Small beer, that's the way big Gordo likes it keep them down and that is why a lot of real Labour supporters are deserting them.
209

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10/04/2009 16:33:59
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Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 16:38:07
230 Is that you got another name then Brain ? If you are talking in Chinese terms I much prefer the ''Great Helsman'' but anyway do carry on with your nonsense.
211

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10/04/2009 16:43:40
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10/04/2009 16:49:37
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TWC,

10/04/2009 16:50:28
232 Gene Pool
Well I see there's a delegation coming to visit Scotland and a few Financial deals coming off.

More than bsc bagdad failed Murphy managed

214

TWC,

10/04/2009 16:51:57
I forgot to mention the Chinese don't like dishonesty so Sleazy labour won't do well over there.
215

Sierra Foothills Scot,

Diamond Springs 10/04/2009 16:52:36
Well, maybe Alex Salmond didn't meet the Foreign Minister of China, but he did have a meeting that was probably much more enjoyable. See http://china.org.cn/2009-04/10/content_17586488.htm
216

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10/04/2009 17:01:41
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Hugh Roscombe,

10/04/2009 17:14:11
237

You are simply rubbish - whatever moniker you use. A wee nyaff.
218

Hugh Roscombe,

10/04/2009 17:15:20
... a no-nothing, ill-informed pipsqueak of a choob.
219

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10/04/2009 17:15:42
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Hugh Roscombe,

10/04/2009 17:16:07
.. who gets his jollies off by trolling a newspaper site.
221

Hugh Roscombe,

10/04/2009 17:16:35
240

Thanks mate!
222

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10/04/2009 17:23:51
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Martyk,

10/04/2009 17:27:25
He met Gerry Addams though !
224

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10/04/2009 17:32:19
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10/04/2009 17:32:35
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10/04/2009 17:36:05
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Uistman,

Scotland 10/04/2009 17:48:42
Punching the air with the news of BOS failing.
More joy as RBoS fails, it cannot get better Dunfermline collapses (with a little help from Downing Street)
and all you unionists are happy.
If AS was snubbed ,you should be personally upset ,for in snubbing Alex
Salmond you are being snubbed.
Every time A Unionists demeans our government in Edinburgh ,it demeans all of Scotland and everyone in it.
Each time something bad happens to Scotland you smile ,what kind of people are you?
The ones that in certain circumstances would probably say we were only following orders ................ from John Smith House
229

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 10/04/2009 19:05:39
Note the Chinese Foreign Minister didn't turn up to meet Salmond. Note the Scottish Foreign (Murphy) Minister didn't turn up either - that appointee of Westminster had his own assigned agenda.

We shall wait and see.

BTW if that is the Gene Pool then unionists should fear for the future.
230

Jock Tamson,

Scotland, Caledonia, Alba 10/04/2009 19:09:10
By the way, talking about trade missions to enhance business, what goes 55, 54, 53, 52, 51, 50, 49 thousand?

Gene Pool? hhfh
231

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10/04/2009 19:23:24
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Gene Peel,

10/04/2009 19:31:09
Uistman #249

Yes I did do all of those things.

I am a loyal Scottish subject of Her Maj.

Of course I would - Because I AM and always will.

What's wrong wirth that?

233

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 19:37:00
..''I am a loyal Scottish subject of Her Maj..''

In point of fact you are not. The Queen opened the Scottish Parliament and recognises its legitimacy no matter who the Scottish people vote for.

You don't, you are silly wee boy who has thrown the dummy out because the SNP are the Govt and that's no fair boo hoo.

234

Gene Peel,

10/04/2009 20:09:23
Jock Tamson #250

Not at all - We at the loyal and patriotic Gene Pððl are constantly evolving.

Unlike the Di-nat-saurs who will soon be as extinct as the Scottish financial sector would have been - If we hadn't bailed you out.
235

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10/04/2009 20:19:06
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Uistman,

Scotland 10/04/2009 20:33:23
256 If as a BNP man you are going to try and pretend to be Scottish you should check up on the spelling first.
as a Uist man and a son of Leod, you are unmasked as a fraud.
Could we suggest you go get another id and start again .
237

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10/04/2009 20:35:09
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Uistman,

Scotland 10/04/2009 20:40:02
258 thanks ,but no thanks I am sure one of your fellow teenage Nazis in BNP can help you
239

Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 20:44:36
258
What a piece of work is a Troll, how ignoble in reason, how
finite in faculties, in cant and moving how express and
despicable, in action how like a beast, in apprehension how like
a devil! The ugliness of the world, the paragon of animals—and yet,
to me, what is this quintessence of dust? Troll delights not me—
nor Bu@@ery neither, though by your posts you seem to say so.

240

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10/04/2009 20:48:55
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10/04/2009 20:51:44
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10/04/2009 20:53:22
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Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 20:54:53
261
If spermatium be the food of trolls, play on,
I'll give ye excess of it; that surfeiting,
The troll may sicken, and so die.
244

Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 20:57:37
264
Good Evening sm753.
A sane Unionist supporter.
In comparison, that is.
245

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 20:57:38
Wow Brain is the bum-obsessed troll. P£nises and benefits, a dead give away. Now we know.
246

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10/04/2009 20:58:29
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Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 21:01:35
264
PS I also like Goethe, but F knows what 263 will make of that..
248

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 21:02:32
269 He will probably enquire after Goethe's bottom.
249

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10/04/2009 21:03:04
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Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 21:04:23
268
You should be reported to the SCPCA.People like you should not be allowed to own donkeys.
251

Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 21:04:59
271 I think I prefer you as a Tory calling everyone phuckers. You're quite creepy in this manifestation.
252

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10/04/2009 21:08:04
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Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 21:15:07
274
Don't you make enough money through your passionate manhole?

Ah, too old eh...
254

Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 21:25:18
A hit, a palpable hit. Ooh er missus.
255

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10/04/2009 21:37:52
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Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 21:41:51
277

I thought Smarties came in a tube...like your customers.
259

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10/04/2009 22:14:55
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10/04/2009 22:20:10
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Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 22:23:04
281
You come from a small village, Gene?
262

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10/04/2009 22:23:50
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Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 22:25:10
283
See what I mean sm753?
264

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10/04/2009 22:25:50
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Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 22:27:33
281 I don't know what the Chinese observers think, but this observer thinks that you are talking about yourself. How many monikers have you got ?
266

Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 22:29:44
287
It had a question mark at the end, did it not?
267

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10/04/2009 22:36:25
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Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 22:41:44
290 If you were a Labour MP you could claim expenses for that you know.
269

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10/04/2009 22:43:28
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Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 22:48:45
292 Au contraire my observational skills are good. ''Fakir''. Hmmm. You need to vary your use of language if you wish to pass yourself off as multiple posters. You're not very good at it. Incidentally I only ever post as Observer, the name I brought with me from the Herald, but I am sincerely flattered by the company you put me in, so thanks very much and goodnight.
271

Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 22:53:40
292
I'm sorry you could not understand the few nonsensical words, Gene.
I'll repeat them.
Did. You. Come. From. A. Small. Village.Question Mark.

There now.Is that still nonsensical?
272

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10/04/2009 22:54:43
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Observer,,

Glasgow 10/04/2009 22:57:40
295 Good night Gene2.

ps Try Bennetts nightclub in Stockwell Street, they cater for your tastes and sell a good pint to, or so Gordon Brown advises me.
274

Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 23:07:42
296
Er...whats in the pints that cater to his tastes...?
275

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Alasdair mac Alasdair Mór Mac an Righ,,

10/04/2009 23:57:09
#300 Gene Pool,

Observer is a women your numpty.

Scotty MacCleoud, (Every Post)

I hope you are either really drunk or really high. Because if these are the thoughts that come out of your normal brain function you are an utter nutter.

We have all got an @rse, most of us stopped being excited about talking about our @rses by the age of 10.

Are you the guy that writes stuff of public toilet walls.

The funniest thing about your posts is this. You are an adult posting rude words, obviously alone as nobody would embarrass themselves typing that daftness in front of anyone.

So there you are alone, sitting typing,

(This is the funny bit)

You are such a loser that you think it is funny, shocking and clever. You don't realise what a dick you are making of yourself. LMFAO @ U
280

Conan the Librarian™,

10/04/2009 23:58:47
301
Just *what* are you pretending to be...?
281

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11/04/2009 00:04:12
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Alasdair mac Alasdair Mór Mac an Righ,,

11/04/2009 00:07:35
#304 Scotty,

How very normal you seem. Are you having fun?
283

Alasdair mac Alasdair Mór Mac an Righ,,

11/04/2009 00:08:50
304Scotty MacCleoud, 11/04/2009 00:04:12
Oh alasdair will you touhc my pee pee?

============

Do you think you are just repeating things you heard in Downing Street?
284

Conan the Librarian™,

11/04/2009 00:23:44
Our revels now are ended. These our actors,
As I foretold you, were all spirits, and
Are melted into air, into thin air:
And like the baseless fabric of this vision,
The cloud-capp'd Guardian, the gorgeous Scotsman,
The solemn Herald, the great Sun itself,
Yea, all which it inherit, shall dissolve,
And, like this insubstantial pageant faded,
Leave not a rack behind. We are such stuff
As dreams are made on; and our little life
Is rounded with a sleep.

285

Alasdair mac Alasdair Mór Mac an Righ,,

11/04/2009 00:37:01
304Scotty MacCleoud

An interesting choice of name and use of spelling. I wonder what type of person would construct such a name.

Here's laughing at you. Glad not to be you.

No seriously, Really Really Glad not to be you Scotty MacCleoud. I wonder if you are really happy with your life.


286

Los Angeles,

11/04/2009 01:24:33

Phony Unionists know they are in the minority so they do their best to wreck a thread. They go hard at it when they see they have lost any semblence of credibility as a blogger. Scunk McLump, or whatever he calls himself, began as an idiot and ended as a lunatic, gets deleted soon.

Have faith in the Moderator's red pen.


287

Munguin,

11/04/2009 08:49:35
For how many days is this going to continue as a main story on here? I wonder if the Scotsman has ever tried journalism. Come on Scotsman you wont win your readers back by boring them to death.
288

Brian Hill,

11/04/2009 13:13:05
#310 Munguin Win readers back Munguin? They are haemorrhaging readers faster that any paper in Scotland.

It either hasn't dawned on them or they don't care that this anti SNP Government - pro union approach is putting far more people off than it's pleasing. Thus the switch from Scotsman to Anyman.

We get more balanced news about Scottish politics from the Times or Telegraph than the Scotsman. Even the Herald is comparatively more balanced.

The Scotsman/SOS won't wake up till they are sold and journalistic posts are...eh...reorganised. A Scotsman insider told me that Hamish Macdonell and David Maddox are hot favourites to take over the new Gardening and Horticultural section as they are both experts in the use of spreading manure.
289

Los Angeles,

12/04/2009 00:04:41

McBride of Gordonstein asks us to believe he did it as a personal prank, no one else was involved. It is pure coincidence he was in 10 Downing Street's Propaganda Laboratory looking for a Bunsen burner, when a chance bolt of lightning activated all the old equipment.

He apologises for allowing a shock of intense natural light on the subject.

Gordonstein's office tells us McBride's behaviour was juvenenile - exactly the term commonly used by passionate SNP bloggers for quislings and and other pond life who infect this website, that and "infantile." Yet another coincidence.

Where is Gordonstein's moral compass now? The Labour Party, whose legless Union Jacks tell us on threads they never ever smear or slime, plot or lie, and their colleagues in the Scottish Labour Party are victims of SNP harrassment.

Hoo-haar!

Has anybody noticed early shift Rufus the Dufus mysteriously failed to check in on the very day McBride was caught blood red handed with putrid body parts dug up from graves, winching them to the open skylight on a trolley?

Yet another coincidence.



 

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