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Britain 'bribes Afghans to fight Taleban'

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Published Date: 26 November 2008
BRITAIN plans to pay cash "bribes" to tribal elders in Afghanistan's war-torn Helmand province, as part of a scheme to persuade them to take on the Taleban.
UK officials in the capital, Kabul, are bankrolling an Afghan initiative to pay community leaders monthly wages to get them talking to the government.

The Afghan Social Outreach Programme (ASOP) is seen as the first step towards finding influential tribal elders, on a district level, to command irregular forces against the Taleban insurgents.

The elders will be handpicked by Helmand's governor, Gulab Mangal, and are expected to earn about £800 a year for attending up to two meetings, or shuras, a month.

But critics fear the payments, which are some 30 per cent more than civil servants earn, are the president Hamid Karzai's way of bribing tribal elders to deliver votes ahead of elections next year.

American officials are financing a similar scheme in the east of the country, where their troops are based.

Meanwhile, US General David Petraeus is carrying out a strategy review that is expected to advocate closer engagement with Afghanistan's myriad tribal communities, after Barack Obama, the president-elect, takes office next year.

News of Britain's involvement in ASOP came as David Miliband, the Foreign Secretary, met Mr Karzai on a surprise visit to Kabul yesterday. Speaking to journalists after the meeting, Mr Miliband was asked about rumours that 2,000 more UK soldiers could be sent to Afghanistan at the request of the US. "It is certainly invented, as far as I'm concerned. I haven't seen any papers come to me saying we need 2,000 more troops," he said.

Western backers say the cash payments are only a way of harnessing informal government structures, so people in remote and war-ravaged provinces can air their grievances to the governor. But Afghan officials insist it is the beginning of a much more ambitious plan to connect with men of fighting age who give their loyalty to village, family and tribal elders before any allegiance to Kabul.

Mr Karzai's spokesman said: "We don't want to create militias, but we need to be empowering tribal arbakai (community forces] and citizen patrols; equip them, not just with weapons but with whatever it takes, so they can protect their territories.

"We have lost a major part of Helmand to the Taleban because we failed to keep the population. We failed to keep the tribal elders on our side. When we lose them, we lose the territory. We should go back to the people."

The cash programme will be piloted in two districts of Helmand in the coming weeks and is expected to be rolled out across the province next year.

However, a western policy analyst in Kabul warned: "It's anti-democratic. If this is perceived as more political patronage, or bribery, it runs the risk of generating friction and resentment."

Charities and non-governmental organisations fear it could legitimise militias and store up problems for the future, after years of international efforts to disarm irregular forces.

Matt Waldman, Oxfam's head of policy in Afghanistan, said: "Given the fragile security situation, ASOP is a high-risk strategy which, if mishandled, has the potential to make matters worse."


Divided tribes make it hard to find elders who will help

THE tribes in Helmand province have been heavily fractured by decades of fighting, and balance of power is now inextricably linked to the drugs trade.

Tribal experts insist it will be harder to identify elders who can deliver security there than in the east. The Nato-led International Security Assistance Force is working with the Afghan Army and police chiefs to agree how the tribal forces will be controlled.

An ISAF source said: "The idea is these forces will take responsibility for keeping insurgents out of their areas, but they need to be able to work alongside Afghan and international forces.

"There are significant command and control issues still to be worked out," he added.

Parallels have been drawn with the Iraqi Concerned Local Citizens groups, which helped to unite Sunni tribesmen against al-Qaeda and other insurgents.

But the problems in Afghanistan are more complicated.

Donald Rumsfeld, the former United States defence secretary, warned this week: "Fractured groups of Pashtun tribesmen on both sides of the Afghanistan-Pakistan border do not yet appear willing to unite and take on the insurgents in their midst, as Arab tribes did in Iraq."

Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 25 November 2008 10:07 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Afghanistan
 
1

Rob Bennett,

Point Piper Australia 26/11/2008 00:31:05
Britain paying Afghani tribesmen to get themselves killed fighting the Taliban, how good is that? I wonder what the men to women ratio is over there in Afghanistan?

"Donald Rumsfeld, the former United States defence secretary, warned this week: "Fractured groups of Pashtun tribesmen on both sides of the Afghanistan-Pakistan border do not yet appear willing to unite and take on the insurgents"

Why the hell should they?
2

SouthernGent,

26/11/2008 00:35:40
Maybe because they wouldn't want to be told what to do by the Taliban once all the foreigners go home.
3

POSTMARK,-55,

China, 26/11/2008 00:39:39
The British and American taxpayers must be tickled pink at paying Afghan tribesmen and goatherders whilst there own unemployment lines are ever getting longer.
4

2dogs in D.C.,

26/11/2008 01:06:42
Business as usual.Long,long history of the same old same.
5

Guga II,

Rockall 26/11/2008 03:44:03
The total stupidity of the war criminal Maggie Broon never ceases to amaze me.
6

First Virginian,

USA 26/11/2008 03:47:27
How many centuries have the Afghans been bribed by one side and then the other?

Why are we (US & UK) fighting in Afghanistan again?

It is hard to keep up with the latest money-pit that we keep shoveling taxpayer money into.

Just bring our people home and let those people continue fighting and killing each other since they have done since time immemorial.

Why don't we all just start riding bicycles where we want to go...then we wouldn't have to depend on foreign oil.
7

,

26/11/2008 03:58:55
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8

POSTMARK,-55,

China, 26/11/2008 04:12:46
#8 SCULLlON1,
For starters you're not the real Scullion, you need to get up a wee bit earlier to fool me.
Second,
You totally missed my point.
9

,

26/11/2008 04:30:41
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10

Graeme,

Guangzhou 26/11/2008 04:39:03

It worked to great effect in Malaya.
11

Royster,

26/11/2008 05:21:11
Seems like a good idea though why they don't use the cash to buy up the opium crop I don't know. Anyway, I'm sure it's part of a Baldrick 'cunning plan' whereby the Afghan tribesmen take the British payments, securitise them and ultimately destroy themselves.
12

Siroos,

UK 26/11/2008 05:27:14
They have to stem the flow of arms from Iran first.
Dealing with stone throwing Afghans will be easier then.
13

,

26/11/2008 07:45:53
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14

TREV,

Poland 26/11/2008 08:26:17
Afghanistan is probably a safer place to be investing money than Britain at the moment.
15

paulr,

edinburgh 26/11/2008 08:32:36
I do not really care what they do, so long as I do not have to pay for it with my income tax.
16

An Greumach Mor,

Scotland 26/11/2008 09:10:02
I would imagine taking the side of whomever has the largest Army camped on your door step is the way that the tribal elders ensure the survival of their people.
This is not the way to build relationships that last.

Why do the Government not try the same strategy as they used in the Highlands.

Massacre the people then put the remainder on boats to Americas.
17

Jewel of the Forth,

Fife 26/11/2008 11:09:55
#8 SCULLlON1,Canada

Brillant!
18

Few Against Many,

26/11/2008 11:11:48
A Canadian/Chinaman who spends every night of the week on a Scottish paper telling us all about our problems. Surely postie the amount of time you spend in front of your PC telling us all about how terrible we are as a nation could be better spent? IF China is so amazing why don’t you spend some time out doors enjoying the censorship instead of every night in front of your computer on here.

Perhaps this is all a ploy, do you feel you are being closely monitored by your oppressive government so all the guff you write about the Dali Lama and the evil west is a smoke screen as you fear you will be taken away from your pregnant native wife to work in a 3rd world mine somewhere in the mighty China?
19

Dave Crass,

26/11/2008 11:15:13
Let's hear it for the British
20

POSTMARK,-55,

China, 26/11/2008 11:32:28
#20 Few Against Many,
I think that it was you last night who said that there's nothing to fear but fear itself, so no I don't have any fears of the Chinese Government taking me away, for we have a better than average government here, far better than yours, who currently has its troops slaughtering the innocent in Iraq via an illegal invasion and occupation. They're doing the same in Afghanistan, all in the name of Democracy. So if you any beef with any government, go knock the doors down of yours, our government's hands are clean. As for being outdoors, no thanks, its currently quite cool outside here in Shanghai so I'd rather spend the time indoors.
Funny how you suddenly are convinced that I indeed live in China, what converted you into a believer?
21

Few Against Many,

26/11/2008 11:42:23
If you are in China or Broxburn it is quite irrelevant really postmark. What is relevant in all of this is that you are a trumpet who has no idea what he is talking about, contradicts himself at every turn and tells the most boring long winded storeys I have ever heard on subjects ranging from mashed potatoes to the use of language in Shanghai. I enjoy laughing at you and intend to do it at every opportunity.
22

,

26/11/2008 11:49:23
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23

POSTMARK,-55,

China, 26/11/2008 12:03:25
#24 Whitecaps,
Well isn't it funny then that a whole bunch of Wall Street employees are heading to Shanghai to work here?
And is it also not funny how China is already owed around 1 trillion dollars by the US? And China has already been asked to step in and save other countries and their banks as well. The so called good nations of the world are currently waging wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and those two wars combined have already cost in excess of a trillion dollars and they are far from over. So who do you think the evil regimes are? The ones staying at home or those slaughtering thousands and causing suffering to untold millions? All of them innocent victims caught in wars not of their doing?
24

Few Against Many,

26/11/2008 12:18:58
or those slaughtering thousands and causing suffering to untold millions?

_______________________________________________________

Finally you say something true about China.
25

POSTMARK,-55,

China, 26/11/2008 12:30:24
#26 Few Against Many,
You obviously haven't graduated from primary school yet, it shows in your spelling mistakes and your immaturity. China has not slaughtered anybody but your government backed troops are doing it daily in at least two countries and most likely in many more.
Now go work on your spelling shortcomings and if you send me that 55 yuan to the Tea Merchants Bank of Lower Yunnan at account number 1234567890123456789 then I will send you that 'made in China' dictionary so that you can overcome your drastic spelling mistakes.

PS. Thanks for all the laughs.
26

Few Against Many,

26/11/2008 12:48:13
Yet again Postmark you show yourself to be uncreative and much less witty than you assume yourself to be. How many times have you commented on my spelling now? (many) How many times have you managed to offend me with it? (zero) A brighter man would have realised that he needed to change tact to get the reaction from me he desired but then again I think it would be safe to assume that nobody has ever called you bright. I hope your we China woman runs of with an amputee called Wan Shoe and makes him mashed potatoes every night while laughing at the myth that Westerners are bigger down stairs. ‘He no even got king pwaan!!!’
27

POSTMARK,-55,

China, 26/11/2008 13:16:21
Few Against Many,
And you must be so proud of your racist remarks eh? That takes real creativity but not any spine. It also shows that you're ill-equipped so you best not be trying to impress any woman for she'll no doubt laugh at you.
28

Few Against Many,

26/11/2008 13:19:50
What did I say that was racist exactly? You obviously don't even know what the word means you clown! You are so funny on so many levels that it's amazing. I wish I could put you in a little box and keep you as a pet. I find you amusing in the same way I do my stupid dog when he chases his tail.
29

P. Lee,

26/11/2008 13:21:13
#23 Whitecaps
Why do you write nonsense? Are you a real person? What has Russia and China got to do with Britain bribing Afghanis? Please you tell
30

,

26/11/2008 14:22:01
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31

,

26/11/2008 14:43:20
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32

,

26/11/2008 14:49:37
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33

,

26/11/2008 14:55:39
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34

Few Against Many,

26/11/2008 14:58:41
32, I would jump in front of a train if I was your man.


In all seriousness I don't have any children so when my friends whip out pictures of there kids I like to whip out my junk. My 'boys' are my pride and joy and i take any opportunity I can to talk about them.

PS. R.I.P Gurga's junk. I am sure they are missed.
35

Bemused and above it all,

26/11/2008 15:10:07
we need a good world war, c'mon Iran, up yer game and fire off a dirty bomb to tel aviv so we can get the party started!
Enlistment= No unemployment
Millions dead = more food & material resources
millions wounded = incredible advances in medical treatments
need for weapons = end of recession as manufacturing of equipment increases 100 fold = even the concientious objectors have jobs = absoloutely NO unemployment
millions dead = shorter transplant waiting lists

See, WAR?HUH!
What is it good for?

Quite a lot actually...
36

Bemused and above it all,

26/11/2008 15:12:27
On the point of the story,
Have the British Army not been 'bribing' the ghurkas for years? also the scots, irish, welsh & english soldiers are all technically 'bribed' to fight.
In fact we are all 'bribed' to do specific tasks, we call it work, we then pay 'bribes' to others for their services. FFS, talk about spin.
37

Ben More,

Edinburgh 26/11/2008 15:20:34
35--you said it best at 19. Leave postit the wee canuck pretender to fulminate and spout communist propaganda from wherever he is.

on the subject nominally under discussion, I think that engaging the Afghan people and getting them to fight the Taliban enemy in their midst is a positive strategy. not a failsafe solution ,but a step in the right direction. we need to work within the social parameters on the ground, tribalism, and give the afghan people confidence. admittedly, arming more factions in this country is then going to prove problematic in the future. how do we disarm them when the time comes? all in all, it's a bloody mess.

anyhow, i have observed my moment of silence for guga's junk. I suspect postit ate it (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/programmes/from_our_own_correspondent/5371500.stm) in the hope of increasing his virility so he could impregnate his beached chinese (?) whale of a wife.
38

,

26/11/2008 15:24:31
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39

Bele's bane,

Scotland 26/11/2008 15:27:04
I think that we should all return to our history for a closer look!

Democracy was the evolutionary product of a tolerant, Pagan Europe! In 400 BC a tolerant, Pagan European gentleman by the name of Pericles of Ancient Athens put the refining touches on the concept and for Europe, it worked.

Afganistan does not have the requisite European heritage necessary for the acceptance of what they must perceive as an alien concept of governance.

Leave them to live their lives in a manner they believe is best suited to their religous and social mores.

All we are acheiving is enmity for the murder of their unarmed civilians resulting from air strikes and then our labelling the victims thereof as being so many "suspected" militants killed, even if the "suspected" militants are two years old and dead in their mother's arms.

Since when did our western society start murdering people on the strength of suspicion?????

Any occupied country has the right to resist the occupier, that is how they see us however differently we may see ourselves!
40

,

26/11/2008 15:42:47
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41

,

26/11/2008 15:49:36
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42

,

26/11/2008 15:59:02
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43

,

26/11/2008 19:08:40
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44

Maurice,

26/11/2008 19:17:24
Britain has done this before. In the war against drugs the British promised the Afgan farmers cash to destroy their opium crops. Suddenly they invaded the country and those farmers, who had destroyed their only source of income to feed their children, received not a blue bean. The result was the crops were regrown and the proceeds went straight into the coffers of the Taliban. The British government is unable to be truthful to its own population, how on earth will the Afgans beleive they are being truthfol here? I'm afraid their ability to drum up support there has been shot away with every shot fired by the invading force
45

drahcir,

pittsburgh, pa, usa 26/11/2008 19:40:50
even a moron can see that it's bribery !!!!!! oh, we can do that in a war zone, but in our countries it's a crime !!! so really this adds up to criminal bribes ???

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P8fgAS0w9Q8

goldieshouse.piczo.com
46

Taz,

The Land of the Free. 26/11/2008 21:22:36
Re: Britain paying Afghani tribesmen to get themselves killed fighting the Taliban,

Why not? They have been paying Nepalese peasants to do their fighting for them for a couple of centuries.
47

The Former Mr. Angry,

Perth 26/11/2008 21:35:01
For a country that's virtually if not actually bankrupt what are we paying the Afghan bribes with?

You'd think we were a superpower instead of the hollow shell we've become under Brown and Darling not to mention 10 years of Tony. Troops should be out of there and Iraq and let them fight it out themselves. Admitting there's actually no end game would be a start. Also what's the problem with destroying the poppy crops? It's just mincing around the problem. This is where the Taleban get their money. The end product causes misery and death here so just get right into it is my view.

Then perhaps the freed up troops could help with border problems right here and the festering problem of terrorist cells in the UK which is presumably one of the main reasons we're in Afghanistan in the first place (or is it?).

 

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