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Teenage hoodlum is named and shamed



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Published Date: 23 January 2008
A SHERIFF has been praised after lifting a ban on the naming of a teenager who viciously attacked a homeless man.
Lee Reid, 15, left Matt Browning, a Big Issue vendor, with serious injuries after he attacked him with a bottle on an Aberdeen street.

Yesterday Sheriff Annella Cowan lifted a media bar on naming him. Reid should have been protected by reporting
restrictions which prevent the press from publishing the name of any criminal under the age of 16.

However, Sheriff Cowan condemned his actions and said her decision to lift the ban came in light of soaring numbers of young offenders.

Earlier this week Grampian Police revealed details of crimes committed by children under the age of eight.

The force recorded 10,943 crimes committed by 3,780 under 17s in the area last year.

Sheriff Cowan said she was "satisfied, particularly in the climate of cases of violent assaults by young persons, it is appropriate and in the public interest that the restrictions be lifted." And she told Aberdeen Sheriff court that publishing his name, picture and address was part of his punishment.

Following the hearing yesterday, Mr Browning agreed that his attacker should have been named.

He said: "I have a really big scar and because the bottle cut through a tendon, I am likely to be numb down the side of my face for the rest of my life.

"It was the right thing for the sheriff to do, I am glad she took this step. Maybe this will help deter other kids his age from committing this type of offence. They should all be named and shamed. I went through such an awful time. I couldn't go out for a long time. My face swelled up like a balloon."

David Leslie, a spokesman for Victim Support said he hoped the move would help curb growing numbers of juvenile offenders.

He said: "It is appropriate for youth offenders to be named and shamed as long as it acts as a deterrent to youths committing such crimes.

"It is the parents' responsibility to teach their children how to respect the law and the rights of other people from the cradle right through their formative years.

"Unfortunately, this does not seem to be happening.

Reid was found guilty of the unprovoked attack on Mr Browning, 34.

The court heard how Reid smashed a glass bottle over his victim's head as he sold magazines outside the Royal Bank of Scotland on Union Street on 12 January last year.

Mr Browning told the jury how Reid had taunted him before hitting him over the head with a bottle from behind.

Sheriff Cowan deferred sentence on Reid until next month, but she warned Reid he was likely to be jailed for the brutal attack which left his victim scarred.



The full article contains 475 words and appears in The Scotsman newspaper.
Page 1 of 1

  • Last Updated: 23 January 2008 1:59 PM
  • Source: The Scotsman
  • Location: Edinburgh
  • Related Topics: Youth crime
 
1

Snuffy Ivy,

Aberdeen 23/01/2008 03:11:12
High time that brat got the right kind of exposure. His parents should be very proud of him.
2

Ross Fyffe,

Scotland 23/01/2008 03:11:26
"likely to be jailed" he ought to be whipped in public, and jailed for 20 years hard labour, also "fixed" to prevent the genes being passed on. Also a careful watch put on the producers of this piece of sub-human pond life.
3

Eckyboo,

23/01/2008 06:58:01
His parents should also be named and shamed as they have overall responsibility for him.
4

yockel,

23/01/2008 07:28:59
Aye Eckyboo but do they ken who they are?
5

an interested party,

23/01/2008 09:12:51
why stop at the parents, name his cat, his dog, his hamster,why not publish his address on the internet, name his teacher , the polisman that arrested, his postman , his milkman, the boy that runs his local shop,

send a picture to all future employers and and colleges or university's in the area.

lets screw the rest of his life up so that he can never work and will always be at her majesty's pleasure. lets force him to have no hope or even a desire to have hope. then lets condemn him some more when he turns to drink and drugs and becomes hardened to the system.

yes lets
6

Stewarty,

23/01/2008 10:04:40
#5 Evidently you are another Do-good....., sorry, No Gooder more interested in protecting the wrong-doer, with no regard at all for victims of crime. When this pond-life emerges from prison, he should be consigned to the army to knock sense into him

To address the principle here, why do we not name all wrong doers, regardless of age, publish their names and addresses, along with the names/addresses of their failed parents? Naming and shaming, with some punishment thrown in for the delinquent parents, would serve as a not inconsiderable deterent.
7

an interested party,

23/01/2008 10:12:05
why then do you use a alias to post?

naming a minor serves no purpose, doesnt make the victims injury's less serious or heal quicker or prevent it from happening again.

do you think that that kid or any other for that matter gives a flying f**k about being named (think asbos as badges of honour media hype story). it servers no purpose. naming the relatives of any other criminal wouldnt fly either so why for kids parents?

and why oh why when someone proffers a view that you disagree with (you and a fair portion of this board) do you think that 'getting personal' is a good argumentative technique ?
8

Rulesbutnotrulers,

Federation, not separation 23/01/2008 10:14:59
'Naming and praising' more like. Like ASBOs, these things get converted into ststus symbols if we aren't very careful.
9

Alberto.,

23/01/2008 10:16:55
Sheriff Cowan must be the toast of the Nation with this action!

At last, and not before time, is it a sign that the Justice system is 'seeing the light' and endeavouring to show these young thugs that their time is up for the way they are behaving, and will no longer be protected by the ridiculous laws in their favour, for their vile and vicious behaviour!

Hopefully, the Justice system will see further ahead and realise the best way to keep crime, of any nature, of the streets is to lock the crininals up where they can be supervised at all times - regardless!

Freeing them in the much mistaken belief they will learn to better their ways is being proved - beyond all doubt, it's not working, and with many 'deadly' (or seriously injured) consequences to the Law abidind!
10

Doreen,

The Cyber Shebeen 23/01/2008 10:27:38
Sorry...I do not believe this will change anything re his behaviour..

He should be forced to work in a mortuary for one month...dealing with the dead victims of violence...perhaps the sight, and the smell..will help him see the error of his ways..
11

MM,

Edinburgh 23/01/2008 10:37:08
#10 - I like your idea. Could be expanded to included mopping up in A&E
12

Stewarty,

23/01/2008 10:37:47
#7 Why an alias? Probably for the same reason you use one!

There was nothing "personal" in my response - just an expression of frustration undoubtedly felt by others on here that someone should be arguing for the interests of criminal rather than the victim.

If we don't try naming and shaming in a very public way, we will never know if it will prove to be an adequate deterent. If parents were called to account for the actions of their offspring, they might well choose to ensure that their offspring do not re-offend.

It is surely worth a try against a background of criminals being mollycoddled and protected as you seek to do and which has failed patently to quell criminal activity.
13

Gothic Rose,

23/01/2008 11:01:52
Mr.Browning :I could`nt go out for a long time" Why on earth would you want to?
14

an interested party,

23/01/2008 11:04:42
the victims interests have been well served, he has been well treated and will be able to claim reparations from the sate under the criminal compensations scheme thing. and if you saw him on telly last night he was remarkably civil about it and appears to be a decent (if homeless)guy
will he ever be able to turn back time and not have been attacked. no unfortunately not.

and nothing we do to the attacker will be able to change the past.

you describe me as 'Do-good....., sorry, No Gooder'
if that isn't a personal reference i don't know what is.

you assume that i do not believe in punishment in any fashion ,which incidentally is wrong, but with the age of this child there is certainly a consideration to be made about the rest of his life, you and I would rather this kid doesn't do anything like this again. sending him to a borstal where the rule of the jungle is based on violence is hardly going to improve his perception of violence being wrong now is it?

naming his parents assumes that they are decent up standing citizens that would be bothered by being named, they will just claim, rightly or wrongly that, their child has been out of control and that they have tried to seek help from the state but that has been unforthcoming.

we have kids in school from the tender age of 4 or 5 for some 11 years in total yet it isnt the responsibility of the school to teach kids about this sort of thing, where it can be nearly certain that most of his tutors are decent upstanding people that know the difference from right and wrong. as it happens, or it at least appears to, when a kid 'goes bad' he or she are pretty much treated as a lost cause and left to there own devices , after all teachers are there to teach academia not bring up children

and the results are ?

oh i dont have nice simple 'sound bite' answers
mainly because after any form of consideration none of them hold up to much scrutiny





15

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 23/01/2008 11:20:34
#14 >with the age of this child there is certainly a consideration to be made about the rest of his life

Child? He isn't a child. He's 15.

Well done the Sheriff for naming him.
16

joppa jock,

Huntingdon 23/01/2008 11:23:26
At school we sat in rows with folded arms while one teacher taught our class of over 40 youngsters without any problems regarding discipline. The odd playground fight was the nearest thing that approached today's out-of-control violence.
I wonder if the big leather tawse she kept beside her desk had anything to do with it?
17

Al Ghaf,

Largs 23/01/2008 12:00:15
Good point #13

However, what I do not understand is: Where do homeless, Big Issue sellers stay when they are too afraid go out?
18

Davy,

I am not a clone, maybe a clown 23/01/2008 13:09:23
14 An interested party

It is good to have an alternative opinion.
Normally the comments on something like the subject above are very predictable even boring.
Keeps it interesting
19

,

23/01/2008 13:18:04
Comment Removed By Administrator
Reason:
20

Rulesbutnotrulers,

Federation, not separation 23/01/2008 13:27:08
I wonder if naming and shaming #19 above would help her/him use these boards more constructively and intelligibly? Probably not, sadly.
21

Duncan in Edinburgh,

23/01/2008 13:37:08
#19 If there is an "absolute tube" around here it is you. Your post is froth, indignance and imp0tent* rage. At least Interested Party poster had some coherence and logic to his point.

You are typical of those who see the only response to criminal behaviour being punishment. We are past that stage as a society, because we recognised long ago that punishment alone does nothing to stop the problem getting worse.

Let me put this simply: it is better to turn a criminal into a productive member of society than to pay for his lifetime of prison. Society is served better by rehabilitation than by punishment.

*If anyone from Johnston Press is reading this, why on earth does your message filter consider the word imp0tent "potentially unsuitable"? Yet you allow potent! Bizarro.
22

TimW1234,

Ottawa, Canada 23/01/2008 13:53:26
10 Doreen

Your views and suggestions re this vermin are so apt and appropriate, as usual.

He has been RIGHTFULLY named and shamed and will live with his disgusting misdeed for the rest of his life.

He deserves all the insults and vile words that are directed at him because he is an inferior piece of human material.
23

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 23/01/2008 14:03:52
#21 >punishment alone does nothing to stop the problem getting worse.

I don't agree.

Whether or not Lee Reid can eventually be rehabilitated, he requires first to be punished.
24

Duncan in Edinburgh,

23/01/2008 14:41:59
#23 Well I agree with you! What part of what I said do you disagree with? I said punishment *alone* does nothing to stop the problem getting worse. But punishment is an essential part of justice nonetheless. I just believe it is only effective at solving problems when combined with rehabilitation.
25

Urban Guerrilla,

Edinburgh 23/01/2008 14:57:26
#24 I think punishment alone *would* stop the problem getting worse, if it were a punishment severe enough to deter. Rehabilitation, if it could be achieved, would be a bonus.
26

Duncan in Edinburgh,

23/01/2008 16:00:35
#25 Deterrence acts on those who have not yet committed a crime, so would have no effect in this case. We are discussing the appropriate sentence for this convicted individual are we not?

Prison works as an good deterrent already - remove custodial sentences altogether and there's no doubt we would see the effect very rapidly in offending rates. But there are a significant number of people for who prison is not a sufficient deterrent. We should realise that for a good proportion of these, that is because no consideration is given to the consequences of their actions at the time. Those acting under the influence of drink or drugs are simply not deterred by a punishment that they do not consider. And those acting out of desperation are not rational enough to be deterred either.

There is a small minority of offenders whose crimes are of sufficient severity and who have acted whilst rational for whom the ultimate deterrent - the death penalty - would be effective. But the truth is that this is a vanishingly small number. The death penalty is no silver bullet here.

Prison is as good a deterrent as we are going to get. We have to focus on rehabilitation in order to make any meaningful impact on reoffending, which is where the opportunity lies.
27

ex-labour,

23/01/2008 16:07:26
Tony Bliar was named and shamed. Didn't do his career any harm.
28

Allan(handofgod137),

23/01/2008 16:30:10
#5, #21 And all the rest of you lefty handwringers who's social policys has brought us to this sorry state. The reintroduction of corporal punishment in schools, and giving Sheriffs the option of having these animals publicly birched in front of their peers would go a long way to wiping out this sort of anti social behavour.
29

Duncan in Edinburgh,

23/01/2008 16:46:25
#28 It is incredibly easy, lazy, in fact, to hold your views. You pretend that there is a simple answer to what you tell yourself is a modern problem. You lie to yourself about some past time when everything was right in the world. You tell yourself that you are right and that the world is crazy for not realising it. In reality, you are a fantasist, sir. There are no simple answers. Violence begets violence, prison breeds criminality, retribution leaves the problem in place. Every time you tell yourself (or anyone else) that bringing back the birch is the solution you are simply contributing to the problem. You might as well say "I don't care" for all the good it would do.
30

Niadh,

Edinburgh 23/01/2008 16:56:09
What ever happened to the point that adults were legally repsonsible for their children until the child reached 16.
Perhaps if the parents were charged with failure to properly raise and discipline their offspring then we might see an end to the liberalist upbringing of children.
A skelp across the thighs when we did wrong never caused my brother or I long term mental anguish.
31

\seasider,

Saltcoats 23/01/2008 17:19:38
#29
Sir,what sort of punishment do you have in mind for this type of scum? Perhaps holidays abroad with social workers.
#30
You are right, a 'few' skelps across the thighs would do for starters in this and many other cases. Unless there are severe deterrents things will only get worse. It is the opposite type of view,the 'lefty handwringers' with their human rights pleas etc.that has got us into this mess.
32

Doreen,

The Cyber Shebeen 23/01/2008 17:22:37
22...Timothy Charles..having been in a mortuary on several occasions in my previous line of work I think the experience could possibly enlighten this young individual and actually make him THINK...aside from that there's a good chance he'l turn vegetarian...for a while at least....
33

Swede16,

poxy broxy 23/01/2008 18:46:06
What gave Sheriff Cowan the right to arbitrarily lift this restriction now! Just because Grampina police issues a report this week?

This things should not be lifted on the whim of a Sheriff. There are reasons these restrictions are in place.

I see the flog-em and hang-em nutters are out in force. The kind who woulde take their knitting along to a good public hangin'.
34

john z,

edinburgh 23/01/2008 19:04:36
Number 5, 'an interested party'

I agree. Lets.

This piece of pond scum chose to leave an innocent person with partial face paralysis. For fun.

The wee jobby deserves all he gets. No sympathy with this kind of person whatsoever.

35

Doreen,

The Cyber Shebeen 23/01/2008 19:21:09
What about the pedo soldier that got young girls to fondle him...and he was not jailed?..whats all that about?..and there was another who was not imprisoned..dreadful photos in his possession...I am just thoroughly disgusted that pervs are allowed to walk free when they have committed sexual crimes against children.

Why can we not comment on these articles?
36

co jones,

here and there 23/01/2008 19:26:27
well said no 28 and others. kick the sh*t out of him. that should teach him that violence is not the answer to his problems?
37

\seasider,

Saltcoats 23/01/2008 19:32:38
#34
WELL SAID. Thats it in a nutshell.
#33
I think if public punishments were reinstated they would have a larger attendance than the Commonwealth Games will get. Bring back the tumbrils.
38

john z,

edinburgh 23/01/2008 20:35:36
Swede 16,

I'm really quite satisfied the good Sheriff knows the law better than you ever will.
39

Ghost Of Scotland Past,

23/01/2008 21:09:24
19) If your insulting post is pulled I want you to know that I am responsible, and here is what I feel about it.
"This posting is an unacceptable, insulting,
and offensive personal attack on another poster, it does not address the issue."
I am very probably what your kind would call a do gooder, or no gooder both wildy inaccurate non insults. You would be quite correct to assume that I am against violent treatment of offenders, thus capital and corporal punishment is well consigned to our violent past, neither worked then and neither will work now.
Violence only breeds violence and does nothing to solve the problem.
I accept in this case that naming and shaming is an appropriate course of action and may be used in the future but each case on its merits. I would go further
and place such idiots in the stocks for public insult and ridicule but that is unlikely to be reintroduced.
The military should not be used as a dumping ground for social rejects, they are professional volunteers who have no use for such people, who would only be a liability to them. Perhaps institutions such as the former approved school staffed by retired military
trainers would be part of the answer here, the rehabilitation part after appropriate, proportionate, non violent punishment.
40

The Fly Fifer,

Fife 23/01/2008 21:22:16
# 39

What would you do with a 19 year old drug addict who was a member of a gang who tied you up, and raped your daughter in front of you?

This crime happened in the past for real, probably will happen in the future.

Just tell me Ghost, what would you do??

Remember you can use NO violence, you are not permitted to raise a hand in response to the man who left the broken bleeding body of your daughter.

Tell me Ghost in the real world what would you do!!
41

The Fly Fifer,

Fife 23/01/2008 21:25:05
Replace :-
This crime happened in the past for real, probably will happen in the future

With

This type of crime happened in the past for real, probably will happen in the future
42

Duncan in Edinburgh,

23/01/2008 21:34:05
#40 There is a good reason why families of victims do not sit as judges or jurors in trials. Your question is irrelevant.
43

The Fly Fifer,

Fife 23/01/2008 21:52:28
If Ghost was the judge, he would have had first hand knowledge of the torment that "his" daughter would have gone through, if a juror the same applies.

There is no doubt as to the guilt of this guy it is what would Ghost want to do with him.

You see Duncan it is all well and good to be a liberal softie with other peoples misery but when asked if it was your daughter that is a different matter.

In any case I think Ghost can speak for him or herself.
44

The Fly Fifer,

Fife 23/01/2008 22:04:11
and anyway Duncan I did not mention anything about a trial, I was implying that Ghost managed to get his or her hands on this guy before the police became involved.

It is then that ghost could practise what they preached, sit down with the rapist, have a wee chat with him, let him know that he will be ok, let him know that the Ghost will be helping his or her daughter get over this life changing traumatic abuse of her.

Maybe even say that s/he will visit him in prison if charges are ever pressed.

Yes let's just see what Ghost would want to do.

45

COLINTON.MAINS,

Oakville Ontario 23/01/2008 22:35:33
LEE.REID.SHOULD.HAVE.GOT.TEN.YEARS.THE.COWARD
46

Duncan in Edinburgh,

23/01/2008 23:23:26
#43 and #44 You haven't thought this through, have you?

Like many people I have been a victim of crime. Like many victims I felt great anger toward the perpetrator. But, apparently unlike you, I am able to appreciate that there would be nothing to be gained by my acting outside the law as a response to someone acting outside the law against me. I have certainly acted in self-defence before now, but never in retribution.

You seem to think that on one side of this argument are those who will meekly ignore all crime and hand out sweeties to criminals, and on the other are those who will take things into their own hands and demand the birch at every opportunity. This is a conceit for your own benefit. The reality is that people who believe the law should take its proper course are still angry, still damaged, still indignant. They don't want criminals to be let off - they want them to be punished, rehabilitated and deterred from future crime. The only difference is that they have thought it through and understood the futility of the alternative approach.

You are not on the moral high ground, however much you might believe you are.
47

Ghost Of Scotland Past,

24/01/2008 13:26:45
39) I have taken my time to ponder a response to your
specific, dramatic, and personalised hypothetical example
Such a crime is so rare that I have only heard of something like it happen once in the UK and once in The USA, I believe that the film series Death Wish starring
Charles Bronson was a dramatisation of the American crime which was nothing more that a cynical hollywood money making exercise taken from a real and personal tragedy.
the British case concerned a Vicar, his daughter and her Fiancee. The details of which I will not go into here, but let's say it was his understanding of human
nature, and his belief system which got the three victims through the traumatic crime stronger and better people than before, and he did not even consider the use of violence against the perpetrators. If I remember
they wer caught and sentenced to a total of 63 years
in jail. Personally I would have had them sent the to a
secure institution for the criminally insane at her majesties pleasure.
None of us can say what, when or where violence starts
but we all have it within our power to end it. It is only very rarely such circumstances arise where the only way to stop it is by returning violence against any perpetrator. What I understand is that anyone who can not be talked out of using violence or who uses it
randomly and for no apparent reason is either temporarily or permanently insane to some degree, and whilst proportionate punishment is necessary for the good of society and the victims, so to is rehabilitation, and retraining of offenders.
I hope this answer, gives you a clue as to how I may act in the situation you describe, but I am human and cannot be expected to say how I would respond in the heat of the moment, and under such extreme circumstances.
What abhors me most of all is that given that most sane
reasonable people wish a better world free of crime and violence, those who would use violence to achieve that end usually end up flinging non insults a
48

The Fly Fifer,

Fife 24/01/2008 15:06:41
# 47 I thank you for your response, please also add, Bosnia, Croatia, Kenya, Rwanda, to the list of "so rare" examples of a brother husband or other relative being forced to watch such a crime, in May 2006 4 youths killed a family Father, Mother, teenage daughter (14) and baby boy 11 months Father tied up. Mother raped in front of husband then disemboweled and her throat cut.
Daughter then raped in front of father then drowned in bathtub. Baby boy stabbed in the forehead and throat cut. They then stabbed the father 55 times. In court the four stated they didn't just go to rob the family but to kill the father as he did not like black people.

I could go on but then it becomes gratuious, however the point is made.

It is far more common that you imply. the world is huge, the crimes horrific and it is getting worse.

Your answer says you do not know how you would react, I respect that as you took time to reply, and you would have them sent him to a mental institution for the criminally insane.

Those who turn their swords into plough-shares are killed or subjucated by those who do not.

Always have been always will be until the Second Coming.

Until them it is up to us to police the world better
49

The Fly Fifer,

Fife 24/01/2008 16:38:23
http://thescotsman.scotsman.com/latestnews/Open-prison-at-centre-of.3705304.jp

For you Ghost
50

Upandunder,

20/05/2008 10:32:19
Bring back corporal punishment.

Also, humiliation.

Teenagers are, above everything else, self-conscious and obsessed with what others thing about THEM. So, if there is a baseball-capped Ned offender, force him to walk through his local area dressed as a Goth or in a clown's suit. Believe me, they would never offend again.

I have a teenage daughter (who thankfully doesn't cause trouble) - but I do know if she was told she'd be forced to walk the local high street dressed as a chavster/ned she'd sooner hang herself!

If we had any gumption we'd force Reid to walk, dressed as a circus clown and with a placard reading "I am a total joke" up and down Union Street every Saturday for six weeks, he'd never re-offend.

 

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